518 replies to this topic

[NocturnalBeast]

Steel Raven, on 07 July 2018 - 01:38 PM, said:

Tonnage is probably the best way to balance Clan vs IS without nerfing Clan weapons into baseline. You see less clan assaults but hey, more demand for Clan Lights and Mediums.

We also need more Clan vs Clan and IS vs IS events. Made allot of noise for the Civil War but only got one event related to it. Also skipped the Refusal War all together and that was what most of MW2 was based on, huge missed opportunity!

Yes, all buffs and nerfs should be taken out of the game and if uneven teams are not possible, then the game should be balanced by Clans having less tons to use. Yes, this means that even in QP, Clans would always have to be on one side and the IS on the other. This would work well, if there are only Clans in the queue, then it would be Clan vs Clan with even tonnage on both sides, if there are only IS Mechs in the queue, it would be IS vs IS with even tonnage and if there is a mix, then Clan on one side and IS on the other with Clans getting less tonnage than IS (the amount less would have to be determined by beta testing).

[Careful Method]

Dumb. Gauss are already nerfed since they require charging, which they shouldn't explode when critted if they didn't hold a charge?

BTW high alpha kills a Clan mech just like an IS one, both sides suffer. It isn't like we are doing Clan vs IS drops or anything.

[Sir Immortal Shadow]

Wow, okay I need to say that I am on both sides of this one. I agree that a big chunk of the nerfs were heavy handed. That said, this is a public TEST so people should probably stop freaking out so much.
As for the balance, the damage nerfs themselves aren't bad (other than ERMLs) but then they have also nerfed dps and dph, so these weapons all just got worse in almost every way, and drastically worse in a general sense. The ERML damage nerf was drastic, but again nerfed dps and dph on top of that is so crazy that I wonder if you made some mistakes with the heat numbers
I'm very confident in my balancing ability, and though I can't speak for older stuff, I've agreed with almost every balance change PGI has made in the past year or so, so I know we're generally of the same mind.
Even though this is a public test, the only way I could make sense of you guys doing this is if you just wanted to see how bad over-nerfing the lasers would be so that you have a more accurate idea of where the happy medium is, instead of just making tiny adjustments until it feels right. If that's what you're planning then I fully support that idea, but only if we can all agree right now that as is most of these weapon changes are too much.

[Sir Immortal Shadow]

Could we keep the weapons *slightly* closer to where they already are if we bring the Engines/Endo/Ferro a couple slots closer to even? As is the case with the weapons, they don't have to be the same, but they probably need to be closer to even than on tabletop if you want to balance the game. I'm talking a couple slot difference here, 1 slot less for light-ferro. If IS light engines are heavier than clan XLs, and light ferro heavier than clan ferro, they could take fewer slots. It would be a very small change generally, one that I don't think would really require any counterbalancing.

Edited by Sir Immortal Shadow, 07 July 2018 - 04:46 PM.

[o0cipher0o]

Just to have some giggles about the 94 points alpha of doom, i'll put this here:
just had a match with a deathstrike with said build on the enemy team, i was in my roughneck. The guy shot at me three times over the match, just toe then complein after he died about "how many alphas does he have to dump in an enemy's CT for my damage to register?".
Too bad hi's alphas were spraying all over my mech as i was torso twisting. But yeah, being that chris is likely a potato level player, i can see how he expects that kind of damage to oneshot or almost oneshot anything in its path (unaccounting for the torso twisting that anyone would do even accidentaly), just to the use it as an excuse for yet another blanket nerf.

But heh, watcha know, gotta nerf those CERSL. (yeah, i'm damn salty about this PTS, because i know they're gonna do whatever they want anyway disregarding our, flawed as it will be absed on useless 4v4 matches, feedback).

[Dran Dragore]

again: the Problem with the clans is that they are boring and less versatile. The IS got Weapons for all purpose and every situation. The clans have - Laser Vomits. The ATMs are no ATMs. At least as they are intended by Fanpro: an allround Missile System. In fact the ATMs in MWO are just usable in this 200-300m Corridor. My suggestion: strip at least the minimum Range of this weapon and give us a counterweapon against the Heavy Gauss! Or give us maybe the HAG and other weapons. And No. Range is not everything: On Faction Play maps where you have to run into the Enemys at close range there is no advantage of clan Range Weapons.

But all i read is the disassembly of Clan Lasers for no reason ... As written before of many others: then just delete the Clans and make it only IS vs. IS. The clans at all are after this a shadow of their former self. Can i have my money back for so many Clan Mechs in my Hangar which are after this useless?

[ET Penang]

PGI really good at pissing people off with nerf....pointless move

[50 50]

On a one to one comparison of the weapons now and with the changes there isn't a hell of a lot of difference in the DPS or HPS:.
Reasonably significant in terms of overall damage output.

I dunno.
Don't know if I care enough any more.

[Hydrocarbon]

Lances107, on 07 July 2018 - 11:33 AM, said:

Now for the Fun oh wait oh devs here you go a 100 point firepower damage fafnir WRATH
Two MRM 40s, guardian ecm, a couple of er medium lasers. By this stance and position you have taken on clan weapons, this means that both the IS er medium lasers and mrm 40s need drastically nerfd,

Nonsense, PGI reviewed that but considers your idea invalid because MRM's spray all over whereas lasers are pinpoint damage. /sarcasm

[BMKA]

Nerf nerf nerf nerf snaaaake (?)

PGI, stop killing your game :/

[Jonathan8883]

"• If an existing Public Test install is detected you will simply need to run the latest patches to update your PTS client.
• If no PTS install is detected, you will be prompted to install the PTS."

I cannot select the PTS install on the left side of this launcher.
I would really like to install it now, instead of having to do a 20GB download next week during the test period. Please advise.

[Noguchi-san]

Let us all switch to IS for some Month to show PGI that we ( THE onces left playing FP at all ) do feel about that nerf! ( A NERF THAT IT IS - NO BALANCING META **** AT ALL - just a simple CLAN NERF AT ALL! ) I called Chris once before a liar - now i do it again ( full aware of FREE SPEACH - my lawyer full by my SIDE! ).

I do that math - and the resolution - PGI wants to **** all CLAN MECHS for the worst.

WE do not want ot have 3 erll without Ghostheat - as long as IS can do the same with less duration and nearly the same RANGE! ( YOUR MECHS - YOU MUST HAVE THE NUMBERS so stop to foul the NOOBS! )
Or LARGE PULSE LASERS nerfed to the GROUND BUT HEY - NOW YOU CAN BRING 3 without GHOSTHEAT. That is such a ********!

PGI - listen to me - for just one second! YOU WILL KILL YOUR GAME! FP will be DEAD after that NERF ( WHAT IT IS! ).
IS is strong - stronger than strong in FP - Balance has shifted towards IS Month ago - still you wanna nerf Clan even more?
That is HILARIOUS!

Now i feel DIRTY to bought that that WC supporter Pack at all - NEXT YEAR i won´t SPEND any CENT on PGI!

Let they have their BS MW:5 - BUT THEN ...

... just to make it clear - not the Battletech Fans are the ones which will buy your MW5 - your true Fan Base will be the ones and what are those NUMBERS?

LESS than 20K!

You are living a delusion!

[Noguchi-san]

FP will be dead!


QP - no change at all! Because good PILOTS will always try to bring the best they can bring!
And Lasers - long time ago - where the thing to bring ( meta ) but for month now they aren´t!

So also the PRO Pilots are the ones to be blamed for this - for NOT STANDING up against such a BS act.
All those PRO PILOTS like PROTON, O´NEILL and CO. - stand up and tell PGI what they are doing is not the THING WHAT will be good for this GAME!

But as PGI is not respecting what you are talking -.feel free to what PGI is thinking about you PROs - PGI is spitting in your FACE - all the TIME because you are good PILOTS and they are NOT!

That is the PROBLEM! Not ONE PGI PILOT is a good PILOT - Therefor all those NERFS!

[justcallme A S H]

Lances107, on 07 July 2018 - 11:33 AM, said:

Now for the Fun oh wait oh devs here you go a 100 point firepower damage fafnir WRATH
Two MRM 40s, guardian ecm, a couple of er medium lasers.

Thing is, you can actually do it ever BETTER.. But you know - The Clan BOOGEYMAN is the problem.

[WarmasterRaptor]

You guys know we’re here because Energy Draw is not in right ??
So PGI has to do something else to work on for balance...

I’d like an E-Draw revisit honestly, and less knee-jerkiing pitchfork doomsaying Lol

[Steel Raven]

Ed Steele, on 07 July 2018 - 02:56 PM, said:

Yes, all buffs and nerfs should be taken out of the game...

I wouldn't go that far considering some designs need buffs to be playable. The Orion IIC was considered a wast of money when it first dropped, Cataphract only recently bounced back as a brawler thanks to buffs. Even with quirks and buffs, mechs like the Awesome are just too easy to core from a distance while some just have bad hard points. I would prefer the game getting a total overhaul of the hit box system and weapon convergence but it seem impossible at this point, can only hope MW5 does better with a new game engine.

[Y E O N N E]

WarmasterRaptor, on 07 July 2018 - 07:04 PM, said:

You guys know we’re here because Energy Draw is not in right ??
So PGI has to do something else to work on for balance...

I’d like an E-Draw revisit honestly, and less knee-jerkiing pitchfork doomsaying Lol

Negative. We're here because a vocal few 'Mechdads think Clans having an unsustainable, gimmicky, 94-point alpha capability is OP and certain loyalist IS bads think that the more average 64-point Clan alphas that take 1.125 seconds to get off are OP compared to the 57-point IS alphas that take only 0.935 seconds.

Basically, we're here because players who are not only bad at the game, but are also unwilling to learn how to improve at the game, are crying fowl over what is and has been a non-issue for even moderately competent players.

[ShooteyMcShooterson]

Ok but seriously...

I've always perceived the key to balance as; Clan gets more firepower, IS gets more TTK.

Why is this so hard?

Edited by ShooteyMcShooterson, 07 July 2018 - 09:17 PM.

[Chride]

Yet another waving of the nerfbat for clans?

PGI - you're taking away the last bastions of hope for the clans. How many clan metas have already seen the deathstrike land on them? We're at a point where the clan "meta" builds will start to become ATM and ERLL boats.

Oh, and if a 105 point Wrath has too high of an alpha strike - let me introduce you to the Pukestar - 144 point non-ghost-heat alpha strike, with an option to double tap for 174 points. But as the definitely-not-B33f-of-late would say: "It's not about being good, it's about sending a message". However if the PTS changes go live, it'll drop to a mere 159.5 double-tap

[Hayato1983]

Are you serious. Values are just wrong. Its like just porting is values to clan values. Then whats the difference? We need a different approach. New mechanics, how is it that clans are supposedly more advanced and have a recoil penalty. Its not heavy guass. Laser values are too low, whats next, to reduce range of clan lasers? Make them work different o use a different approach.

Edited by Hayato1983, 07 July 2018 - 09:29 PM.