518 replies to this topic

[denAirwalkerrr]

[Radkres]

I think they want the Gauss Shake to throw off the laser to minimize the pinpoint damage and make it more spread.
They could also make it so you can only fire one gauss at a time with .5 delay between them o.O
Who knows what kind of mess this will turn out into! o.O

[Hawok79]

xe N on, on 08 July 2018 - 03:40 AM, said:

Are you really comparing a 90 ton mech vs. a 65 ton mech in a situation where both a set against without any surroundings?

What about a 30 ton Urban mech against a 100 ton KDK-3. It's so unfair that the KDK-3 will wipe the floor with the urban mech! Nerf clans??!

And are you really crying about LRMs? It that meant ironical? Maybe I get you wrong?

Oh dear...The Urbie will kill the KDK-3

Edited by Hawok79, 08 July 2018 - 12:23 PM.

[TheOrphanator]

The laser changes wouldn't be so bad if the durations were correspondingly lowered, at which point the gauss doesn't need nerfing at all. This is not at all the "micro-changes" mentality Paul keeps talking about. This is extremely drastic and completely pointless.

The only weapon system that is inflating alpha strikes is the heavy large laser. Take 2-3 points off of that, you effectively bring down the clan alpha by 4-6 points, job well done. Everything else doesn't work. Clan mechs have no extra armor, no extra mobility, and [REDACTED] ballistics aside from the gauss rifle. IS get ridiculous armor quirks, cooldown quirks, shorter durations on lasers, and way more ballistic options.

So if you make the weapons the same on both sides, guess which side has the advantage? Clans are already relegated into laser roles and laser-gauss because gauss+PPC got nerfed, ballistics got nerfed, and brawling doesn't work against IS mechs. So nerf the remaining viable builds and you just won't see clan mechs anymore.

You would need to make everything the same to make everything the same. Make meaningful differences and embrace them.

[Sedmeister]

I'm an IS loyalist. 142 mechs. 20 clan mechs for when our unit went clans because we were sick of being stomped by OP clan mechs in FW. Clan mechs are OP. Clan tech is OP. THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE OP!

Fix Faction warfare then use tonnage and/or lore (2 x clan stars of 10 mechs versus 3 x IS lances of 12 mechs) to balance the game!

[burning wisky]

i don 't like it ( because why )........ but i will test this one.

[Nema Nabojiv]

TheOrphanator, on 08 July 2018 - 01:19 PM, said:

The only weapon system that is inflating alpha strikes is the heavy large laser.

And like many have pointed out, that 94 points HLL+gauss build is too hot to be used at a regular basis, so it was not an issue to begin with.

Edited by Nema Nabojiv, 08 July 2018 - 01:43 PM.

[Betrax]

my reaction on tis Patch...

[Mcgral18]

I have no interest in testing these changes


#PGIplz
Just use the sensible Community balance pass instead

[BigScwerl]

PGI Why are you doing this? Why does your team continually believe that this game needs these massive changes? As a player that regularly plays both IS and Clan side, I can say definitively that this rebalance is unneeded. Please stop screwing with this game. Just keep pumping out mechpacks and working on MW5, stop changing MWO. Just. Stop.

This is unabashed Clan weapon massacre. It will completely destroy all of the current laser vomit meta, along with nearly all laser vomit builds. It will render millions of C-bills useless, hundreds of builds garbage, that players will have to go through individiaully and fix. Wasting the time of your player base with mechlab grind is not how you keep old players coming back or get new players interested. It doesn't make any sense! This is a recurring theme over and over. Did you learn nothing from solaris? Think of all the developer hours spent building something that nobody wanted, and they almost nobody plays anymore. Every time a change is made to MWO it further complicates and changes this game pushing it towards being even more unplayable and unapproachable than it already has become. Weapons being OP is not the problem. The problem is that players do not understand the fundamentals of how to play this game.

The entire point of having Clan vs IS is that each side has strengths and weaknesses. If this Clan nerf moves forward as is, we'll effectively just have the same crap shooting the same crap. The entire philosophy of laser trading, which is a basic tennant of MWO will be crushed and wasted. I think it would be extraordinarily wise to shelf this alpha balance, and walk away.

[roboPrancer]

denAirwalkerrr, on 08 July 2018 - 12:15 PM, said:

So basically this will only shift the meta to long range and stomp the shorter range clan lasers into the ground even more. My clan light/medium laser skirmishers weep. There is a playstyle that we aren't going to see come back soon. I'm still mourning for my cersl dps.

Radkres, on 08 July 2018 - 12:19 PM, said:

I think they want the Gauss Shake to throw off the laser to minimize the pinpoint damage and make it more spread.
They could also make it so you can only fire one gauss at a time with .5 delay between them o.O
Who knows what kind of mess this will turn out into! o.O

Gauss shake is a non-factor,its totally possible to fire your lasers then charge and fire your gauss at the end of the burn for the exact same effective alpha. The only time that would hamper you is if you were surprised by a close light and trying to get a quick shot off with your arm mounted gauss.

[PobbestGob]

Just wanted to mention for everyone who is saying "this is just a test, nothing is guaranteed to go live" yes that's true, but these changes are so obviously extreme that it shouldn't require a testing pass to know how unnecessary and ineffective it is. I certainly thank PGI for doing a test at all rather than simply pushing these live of course. But a better test would be nice, such as the community balance sheet as-is, with PTS incentives like MC rewards etc to get higher numbers to participate, or even just making it live for a week or so to get the best turnout and see how people like it, with the possibility to go back to the old values after the testing period.

[NocturnalBeast]

Turlo, on 08 July 2018 - 11:50 AM, said:

Perhaps the solution is to just get rid of the Clans altogether? Seems the issue is players are upset with the canonical Clan superiority. I'm sure the removal on the Clans won't have any impact on the player base.

Simply reset the game to 3025 (or 3039 for the younger generations) and have at it.

I have suggested this same thing myself, many times. I have also gotten the impression over the years that PGI wanted to keep it 3025 or so only, but needed to make money quickly to meet a deadline and the unseen were off limits at the time.

[freud2b]

sad, you had done good things his last time by stopping nerf.
So the next clan nerf, I'm leaving . because I'm tired of this ******** to change my 260 mechs all the time.
R.I.P Mwo

[ApexSun]

14 pages of passionate pilots who are disgusted by the proposition, I counted maybe 4 players who agree. How many does it take before PGI understands that they are on the precipice of destroying MWO and killing a good chunk of the player base that might have moved to MW5? This is no way to run a business, folks.

[IllCaesar]

ApexSun, on 08 July 2018 - 05:21 PM, said:

14 pages of passionate pilots who are disgusted by the proposition, I counted maybe 4 players who agree. How many does it take before PGI understands that they are on the precipice of destroying MWO and killing a good chunk of the player base that might have moved to MW5? This is no way to run a business, folks.

The great thing about the recent Battletech and liking PPCs as much as I do is that I can make them any bit as powerful (or weak) as I want them to be. Design your own weapon balance.

Most likely it won't be too hard to alter weapon stats in Mechwarrior 5. I'm sure plenty of players would be happy to go create their own balance and never come back to MWO.

[Toxicresidue]

stop redistributing my DPS COMRAD

[Toxicresidue]

ApexSun, on 08 July 2018 - 05:21 PM, said:

14 pages of passionate pilots who are disgusted by the proposition, I counted maybe 4 players who agree. How many does it take before PGI understands that they are on the precipice of destroying MWO and killing a good chunk of the player base that might have moved to MW5? This is no way to run a business, folks.

yea it seem like they are trying to shoot this game in the foot or the succeeding mechs are gonna have quirks to counter these nerfs. buy new mechs or switch to mw5. hmmmmm

[Vesper11]

Copying it from another thread as it seems that the main discussion is here:
cERSL:
DPS: 1.09 DPH: 1.43 - old and somewhat bad
DPS: 1.02 DPH: 1.38 - new and even worse
compare to
ERSL:
DPS: 0.93 DPH: 1.48
SL:
DPS: 1.08 DPH: 2.95 -50m really, why do ERSLs even exist, oh right, it's to make cERSL nerfs look "balanced"
cSPL:
DPS: 1.60 DPH: 1.95 -50m +0.5t (now PGI will nerf it too)
cERML:
DPS: 1.22 DPH: 1.11
DPS: 1.00 DPH: 0.92
ERML:
DPS: 1.02 DPH: 1.11 -40m yes, clan lasers are not only hotter and have longer burn but now also weaker!
cERLL:
DPS: 2.16 DPH: 1.10
DPS: 1.96 DPH: 1.00
ERLL:
DPS: 2.00 DPH: 1.13 -65m +1t never was a fan of (c)ERLLs
cMPL:
DPS: 1.79 DPH: 1.47
DPS: 1.60 DPH: 1.39
MPL:
DPS: 1.76 DPH: 1.58 -110m and this is the reason for cMPL nerf, because MPL sucks so much they brought cMPL down to its level.
ERML:
DPS: 1.02 DPH: 1.11 +30m -1t
cLPL:
DPS: 2.80 DPH: 1.20
DPS: 2.55 DPH: 1.09
LPL:
DPS: 2.72 DPH: 1.38 -235m +1t LPL sux
LL:
DPS: 2.14 DPH: 1.29 -150m -1t 450m is good enough tho and a bit better DPS per ton but still very bad DPS per ton for laser
ERLL:
DPS: 2.00 DPH: 1.13 +75m -1t thus slightly lower DPS per ton
cHML:
DPS: 1.44 DPH: 1.25
DPS: 1.16 DPH: 1.14 - now even more useless
ML:
DPS: 1.14 DPH: 1.47
cHSL:
DPS: 1.25 DPH: 1.73 -155m, yep now larger lasers are also weaker, hotter and longer burn than already bad smaller lasers
cHLL:
DPS: 2.47 DPH: 1.13
DPS: 2.20 DPH: 1.00
LL:
DPS: 2.14 DPH: 1.29 +1t

TL;DR: ******** blanket nerfs to almost all lasers. Because "laser boating too stronk" PGI tries to bring clan lasers down to ****** IS laser level instead of buffing non-small IS lasers (like giving them better heat efficiency to counter lower IS ability to stack DHS) and addressing medium+large clan laser boating that is still there.
The result is that already unpopular medium and light clan mechs get the worst of that crap but unpopular = no one plays = no one will care if PGI nerfs them more, right?

[Dee Eight]

Kill2Blit, on 08 July 2018 - 11:48 AM, said:

I'd be interested in seeing videos of these hackers, never had reason to believe anyone was using hacks before myself. only ever saw a video of an aimbot once, and it didn't help the guy out much either.

That's often said by the folks who either use them, or know folks who use them.... problem is, shortly after anyone posts a link to a video here, a mod swoops in and deletes it, and sanctions the poster for violating the forum guidelines.