518 replies to this topic

[PraetorGix]

The changes are not set in stone blah blah blah, but the fact that you're starting with these numbers is scary.
The ER med and Heavy Large nerfs are ridiculous.
I haven't visited the alpha thread in a while but I can almost assuredly say that the people who voted on "less clan laser damage" imagined less damage in exchange for overall better DPS and heat. Not straight up nerfs like these two cases (three if you count the SPL) Whoever wanted a simple and plain damage nerf is an IS loyalist who just wants Clans under-performing and you shouldn't be "balancing" to cater to those players.

[Ensaine]

And again, these guys are focusing on THREE clan mechs, that next to no one plays, because they are shiite .....

Just the fact that they mentioned the 94 point AlphaBogeyman again, makes me ill.

Talk about being on an island .....

Doesn't matter that they tried to keep part of the room clean with the 'not set in stone' thing, it's just the fact that these guy can NOT see past THREE crappy mechs.

Edited by Ensaine, 06 July 2018 - 06:11 PM.

[Tarl Cabot]

GamerPro4000, on 06 July 2018 - 05:44 PM, said:

Does this mean clan mechs will get structure and armor quirks like their IS counterparts in the near future?

PGI is already slowly adding said structural/armor quirks. Several Clan mechs already have them.

Navid A1, on 06 July 2018 - 05:41 PM, said:

My initial thoughts:

snip

• I really think you need someone to define the meaning of trade-off to you Chris!... so tell me again what do the clans get in terms of advantage for all the HUGE downsides now?.

(chuckles) PGI is not providing non-lethal benefits to isXL so IS mechs that do take isXL will simply die to the loss of any side torso, will have to take fewer DHS, fewer or smaller/lighter weapons while still going slower than Clan mechs....

Sorry, I could not resist. As for the cERML/CERSL maybe this is them underbidding, allowing them to increase it based on the rage/negatively of the threads to show they are willing to "Meet" us in the middle.....

[PraetorGix]

thebrainman, on 06 July 2018 - 05:23 PM, said:

[...] Or increase the burn time to give the opportunity to dish out a similar % alpha compared to the reduced armour of the mechs packing the big alphas?

That's one of the most egregious mistakes they are incurring in. Inouye talks and talks about the spooky 94 damage alpha but keeps forgetting that it's NOT PINPOINT. Heavy lasers take forever to dish out those 18 points. On the other hand IS has heavy friggin Gauss rifles with 25 pinpoint, instant, unavoidable damage. But no, that's not a problem right? Because the whine of the week is IS flavored.
But hey, I guess that in the future when clan lasers have gone the way of the Small Pulse and are useless we will all turn to Heavy Gauss meta, and that will be the perfect time to nerf it. Not before selling us a couple of HGauss boating mechs of course.

Edited by PraetorGix, 06 July 2018 - 06:23 PM.

[Vxheous]

Maybe the Clan ERML damage is a typo, and meant to be 6.25. That would actually be consistent with the overall damage reduction each clan laser received..

[The Lighthouse]

Vxheous, on 06 July 2018 - 06:25 PM, said:

Maybe the Clan ERML damage is a typo, and meant to be 6.25. That would actually be consistent with the overall damage reduction each clan laser received..

Hope is first step on the road to despair.

[PobbestGob]

Vxheous, on 06 July 2018 - 06:25 PM, said:

Maybe the Clan ERML damage is a typo, and meant to be 6.25. That would actually be consistent with the overall damage reduction each clan laser received..

Possibly. They did say two game modes would be available but listed three..

[justcallme A S H]

Tarl Cabot, on 06 July 2018 - 06:17 PM, said:

PGI is already slowly adding said structural/armor quirks. Several Clan mechs already have them.

Wanna know the irony? The BOOGEYMAN DWF 94PT alpha, 2 patches go, was armour buffed.

So it was apparently so weak 2 months ago yet now suddenly is such a problem the entire Clan enery needs to be massacarred.

Logic right there.

There is zero consistency in the approach at the moment. Ok there is one - Unbalance the game while making it as stale as possible.

[NocturnalBeast]

Navid A1, on 06 July 2018 - 05:50 PM, said:

Energy draw was ditched BECAUSE of the pitch forks... otherwise we would have had it live with PGI saying that they received positive feedback

I hope that the pitchforks can kill this nonsense before it goes live too. Also, funny to see a sale on Clan Mechs right before the nerfs.

[Admiral Ackbar 86]

Considering PGI makes their money on paid content, they sure dont inspire much confidence in letting the consumer feel secure their purchases won't be nerfed. I was planning on spending some money as a newish player, but i think i will hold off especially considering the prices they ask for their mechs.

[A Headless Chicken]

If this somehow goes live from PTS, all I can say is it was a fun ride, mostly the people and community, but not the devs..

[FrigginWaffle]

While change might not be bad, this seems overboard. These are big changes to how the games and builds play out. Ever tried going for small changes, like a 0.5 dmg reduction across the board with these Clan lasers? I really don't see how nerfing them so hard is a good idea. Changes in a big manner will anger a lot of people and make it feel unwanted.

[Commander James Raynor]

Clearly, what they are doing is coming up with these ridiculous changes in order to roll them back so it looks like they "listened" to the feedback and get less heat for nerfing a single faction so much. I don't blame them for the strategy, but I do blame them for not understanding simple things about the balance:

1) The fact that IS has better DPH doesn't mean nothing. It actually is one of the best stats in this game. Having better DPH means you do more damage in every fight where you reach heat limit, which is every fight that lasts more than 6 secons, so always except when poking. This because, after you reach max heat, the limit to how much you can shoot becomes how much damage you can do before reaching max heat again, i.e. DPH. Keeping IS even more dominant on the DPH department and taking the alpha capabilities of the clans is not balance.

2) Leaving IS not only with better DPS through better DPH (see above) but also with a better way to deliver it with MUCH lower burning time and front loaded autocannons, will make them just too good (in comparison). Add to that the MUCH better quirks and the fact that IS has only battlemechs (which are better, and no one can seriously deny that) and you will have a game so unbalanced as it was when clans were released.

I do belive that lowering the heavy lasers alpha, lowering the large lasers damage and allowing to take 3 is a good idea, since they allow too much alpha for too little tonnage compared to IS, but these changes should be made with a corresponding heat compensation, not making the DPH worse, but better than before.

Look, I'm a decently good player. I know what is better than what, I can change my loadouts and playstlyle and I know I could just play IS all the time and get my kicks, but being forced into the faction that you don't like because of poor balance is the reason I stopped playing. I just dislike IS: mostly ugly mechs, the utterly idiotic way in which they are named, etc. I mean, "BL-6B-KNT"??? what the hell is that? "BNC" with a "C"??? variants that are called "732B", "1X", "5SS"?? it just pisses me off. I want my mechs to be called prime, a, b, c, 1, 2 and 3. Obviously, that is MY personal preference, and having the chance to choose based on silly "flavor" instead of performance would be great... right? But now I would have to play the good looking mechs I like with bad builds or play the mechs I don't like and win. So, these poorly thought changes costed you my money, and I'm sure many other's as well. So, you know, you screwed me with my favorite game and will screw you with your paychecks. Maybe not, though, but It's hard to imagine that these changes will mean an increase in the player base. Bad move. Just my opinion, obviously.

tl;dr: the nerfs are ridiculous, leaving IS with so many advantages, specially better DPH and quirks is going to kill clans. Bad change, bad for business.

[Marius Evander]

Ed Steele, on 06 July 2018 - 06:31 PM, said:

I hope that the pitchforks can kill this nonsense before it goes live too. Also, funny to see a sale on Clan Mechs right before the nerfs.

Theres not enough whale pitchforks left, the only pitchforks pgi worry about.

[Y E O N N E]

I will give detailed feedback once I play it, but I can already say this is too strong of a nerf and not pleasant at all. It's even nerfing weapons that are not contributors to the perceived problem and still wouldn't be even after the contributors are nerfed.

[NocturnalBeast]

Cadoazreal, on 06 July 2018 - 06:51 PM, said:

Theres not enough whale pitchforks left, the only pitchforks pgi worry about.

The "Whales" do not like their favorite Mechs to be constantly nerfed into the ground because the people who could not buy them right away cried about how OP they were.

Yeonne Greene, on 06 July 2018 - 07:00 PM, said:

I will give detailed feedback once I play it, but I can already say this is too strong of a nerf and not pleasant at all. It's even nerfing weapons that are not contributors to the perceived problem and still wouldn't be even after the contributors are nerfed.

There was no problem, the game is as "balanced" as it needs to be right now. IS Mechs seem powerful and Clans still seem powerful right now too, nerfing Clans more is just unnecessary.

[ApexSun]

This is ridiculous. You just increased drop deck tonnage in both Scouting and Invasion FP for the clan side because IS ballistics were clobbering Clan units and now its going to be another step backwards? If laser vomit was so overpowered then Clan would be winning unit tags every night in FP but they aren't. Expressing statistics in "damage caps" are meaningless. The viability of a weapons platform is damage over a time interval at a given heat cost and at a certain range. That's a no-brainer statistical analysis. The Heavy Gauss is the most dominant weapon in the game but it gets buffed not long ago. Its only real counter is a high alpha laser Clan mech. There is actually a good bit of parity right now. Don't allow the crybabies to throw this game off yet again.

Edited by ApexSun, 06 July 2018 - 07:23 PM.

[saltywater]

This is "balance"

- Nerf mobile mechs (size, engine desync etc)
- Nerf weapons that punish low mobility mechs (g+ppc, clan laser vomit, laser g)

Next nerf prediction: IS mech survival (armour and structure nerf) . Clam nerfed weapons would make push (especially IS) hard to fend off. So PGI will decide IS mechs are too tanky.

[Lizardman from Hollywood]

Ah what I wouldn't give for a big bowl of popcorn now. Whiners gonna whine haters gonna hate and PGI will roll this back under the rug when the dinner bell stops ringing. And lets be honest, the "pros" will stay regardless because they don't have the skills to do this well at any other game, or they would have left for greener pastures long ago. So stop crying, play the public test and then leave constructive comments after you have some seat time. Your speculative jargon and arm chair number crunching isn't doing anything but making folks jump to conclusions.

Edited by Sephrus Shanadar, 06 July 2018 - 07:28 PM.

[Valec]

[redacted]

Edited by Ibrandul Mike, 08 August 2018 - 11:07 AM.
unconstructive