66 replies to this topic

[MischiefSC]

Jman5, on 18 July 2018 - 04:43 AM, said:

Yeah, I'm glad the message is finally starting to sink in, but boy was it frustrating trying to explain to people the concept of "damage mitigation". Or trying to tell them diplomatically that if I'm getting smacked in the face by LRMs, ATMs, and Streaks pretty regularly, they are almost certainly getting hit by them too. Or even trying to point out that what goes on in the comp queue is very different than what goes on in the solo queue.

I honestly thought people would shut up about AMS being a waste when they introduced the counter to the scoreboard because the numbers spoke for themselves. A single ton of AMS ammo could chew through more than 200+ missiles. Now it's something like 300. That's a crazy amount of damage mitigation for yourself and your team for such a tiny tonnage investment. For half a ton of AMS ammo all you would need is to shoot down some combination of 32 LRMs, 16 streaks/SRMs, or 11 ATM missiles to pay for itself. That's nothing!

I was always the guy in KCom getting teased for AMS - until we were getting LURMed on Caustic. The way we played you only needed 1/2 ton of ammo so it was a 1 ton investment. 1 DHS was never a really deciding factor. Now I shave a second DHS or a tiny engine downgrade or whatever works and take 1.5 or 2 tons of ammo with 2 AMS or 1 full ton of ammo with 1 AMS and my whole team does better. It is the ability to functionally neutralize multiple enemy mechs until after you've killed their teammates.

However the success I've had recently from it is atypical. A lot more people bringing LRMs, more people willing to stick together to use AMS to avoid them.

Edited by MischiefSC, 18 July 2018 - 06:06 AM.

[Mystere]

El Bandito, on 18 July 2018 - 05:09 AM, said:

Why though? It is the Clans that have triple AMS mechs. I'm just happy that better AMS awareness in recent times equated to less "NERF LURMS!!!" rage threads than expected. With luck Paul & co will not knee-jerk nerf LRMs anytime soon.

And now you just jinxed it.

[Novakaine]

Last night while puggin I ran me ole trusty Stalker 5M.
Stripped the usual load out and strapped on just 2 LRM10's.
And all the 6 packs and lasers I could squeeze on.
I even had one guy in the chat call me out a the usual lurmer suspect.
I had three lights trying to gank me.
They all died.
Much fun was had

[Dogstar]

MischiefSC, on 18 July 2018 - 06:05 AM, said:

and my whole team does better. It is the ability to functionally neutralize multiple enemy mechs until after you've killed their teammates.

This, so very much, even if you treat this as a 'solo' game taking AMS helps you _and_ your team meaning you get to win more!

The unholy drive to use the meta and nothing but the meta makes for poor team players.

Edited by Dogstar, 18 July 2018 - 09:09 AM.

[Leone]

MischiefSC, on 18 July 2018 - 06:05 AM, said:

I was always the guy in KCom getting teased for AMS - until we were getting LURMed on Caustic.

Really? I remember when we first went IS when everyone brought one to keep off the rain. I still usually bring AMS and no one's ever bothered me about it. then again, I think they stopped giving me grief for my builds long ago.

But yes! AMS is great. It's like getting even more armour! even if only for some weapons.

~Leone.

[justcallme A S H]

MischiefSC, on 17 July 2018 - 01:27 PM, said:

I just played a map on Polar vs some of the more skilled LRM players you'll find outside of comp.

[Groutknoll]

think I'll put this in all the post-patch lrm threads ...

[Tier5 Kerensky]

I haven't noticed any drop in LRM performance or much more AMS than usual. I played some games with 4xLRM20 Supernova, 4x15 LRM Warhawk and few more with 5xLRM10 Mad-dog.

[Mechteric]

HammerMaster, on 17 July 2018 - 11:58 AM, said:

Irony I guess.

Nope




Just cause and effect. More people bring LRM due to buff, so more people bring AMS to counter. Eventually will settle as fewer bring LRM and then fewer bring AMS to suit.

[Greyboots]

MischiefSC, on 17 July 2018 - 11:50 AM, said:

My fear now is that people will stop bringing LRMs and the gravy train will stop before the irony of it stops being funny.

I doubt it.

[Shadowomega1]

Novakaine, on 17 July 2018 - 08:20 PM, said:

They made the so called heat generation for lurms a thing.
So they could buff up ams even more.
Who in the hell overheats firing lurms?
This was not a buff to lurms, but stealth nerf for them.
I see what you really did PGI.

I have seen many mechs do this over my 2 to 3 years of playing this game. Even saw some today post heat nerf on lrms. Still doesn't match the LRM 80 summoner I saw that had no armor on it whatsoever.

Oh and Novakaine I thought HHoD was a Davion Loyalist unit why Steiner?

Darakor Stormwind, on 17 July 2018 - 09:52 PM, said:

Clan LRMs received a buff (less heat) and a nerf (more spread). IS LRMs only received the buff (less heat). That may be why some people call it a buff and others a nerf. Clan vs. IS, essentially.

A lot of people also say AMS was buffed. It was not. A while ago all missile launchers received a buff to their ammo count to make small ammo amounts more worthwhile. They seemed to have forgotten AMS. So at the time, it was essentially a stealth nerf to AMS. Which they now rectified, by giving the AMS ammo the same percentage improvement that the missile systems received.

They still need to make it so AMS gets buffed by the ammo mag skill.

As for LRM mechs I still think the best move is Light Mech wolf pack Assassinations.

[UnofficialOperator]

Apparently a lot of people don't read patch notes so LRMs still good during potato time.

[justcallme A S H]

So I've been watching people stream on/off today...

Even with 2 Triple AMS Nova's, plus 2-3 other mechs with L-AMS or AMS... LRM Boats are still able to crank out 1000dmg+ damage without any worry at all.

LRM60+ is so insanely heat efficient now. This whole thing is lul worthy. There is zero backfire here.

[MischiefSC]

justcallme A S H, on 18 July 2018 - 08:42 PM, said:

So I've been watching people stream on/off today...

Even with 2 Triple AMS Nova's, plus 2-3 other mechs with L-AMS or AMS... LRM Boats are still able to crank out 1000dmg+ damage without any worry at all.

LRM60+ is so insanely heat efficient now. This whole thing is lul worthy. There is zero backfire here.

How terrible does a team have to be to stand back and get lurmed when they are able to neutralize 75-80% of several enemy mechs firepower.

Anyone who is that terrible would lose regardless.

[justcallme A S H]

It's only 2-3 LRMBoats max usually on one side.

Point, which you are missing, is AMS isn't doing things even when there is 6-9AMS pods on the field. Which you said would stop it... It isn't. Especially when you are launching, collectively, LRM150+, AMS ain't going to mow that down. Every mech would need Dual AMS to negate it because you can just constantly fire and that just ain't happening.

The heat buff, watching people play, has just made LRMs absurd now.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 18 July 2018 - 11:21 PM.

[El Bandito]

justcallme A S H, on 18 July 2018 - 11:20 PM, said:

Point, which you are missing, is AMS isn't doing things even when there is 6-9AMS pods on the field. Which you said would stop it... It isn't. Especially when you are launching, collectively, LRM150+, AMS ain't going to mow that down.

I have seen the exact opposite. 3 LRM boats simply can't punch through enough damage to matter, when there is 9 AMS around. I think people should try it in private lobby.

[Kroete]

justcallme A S H, on 18 July 2018 - 11:20 PM, said:

Point, which you are missing, is AMS isn't doing things even when there is 6-9AMS pods on the field.

On the field is different then all 6-9 ams firing together at the missiles.
A 3xams boat is nice, if it is in range, but if it runs around the other end of the map, its ams is wasted.

[lazorbeamz]

I dont see backfires. I see lurms everywhere sigh. A single weapon class capable of ruining the whole game.

Edited by lazorbeamz, 19 July 2018 - 12:52 AM.

[Eisenhorne]

AMS mechs trying to stop me:



It doesn't matter. I'll carry ~4000 LRM rounds. I will fire until your AMS is dry. Unless you literally bring 4-5 tons of AMS ammo per mech, it won't be enough to stop the rain. And that's just 1 LRM boat. If we have 3-4 guys doing it on my team, you'll never stop it all.

I've been doing LRMS all season so far. 196 games so far. 421 average match score, i'm ranked 69th by match score on the current leaderboard. This requires zero skill. Just a minor amount of knowledge about where to stand and how to build a decent LRM boat. It's ez mode.

[Novakaine]

Shadowomega1, on 18 July 2018 - 05:27 PM, said:

I have seen many mechs do this over my 2 to 3 years of playing this game. Even saw some today post heat nerf on lrms. Still doesn't match the LRM 80 summoner I saw that had no armor on it whatsoever.

Oh and Novakaine I thought HHoD was a Davion Loyalist unit why Steiner?



They still need to make it so AMS gets buffed by the ammo mag skill.

As for LRM mechs I still think the best move is Light Mech wolf pack Assassinations.

Fedcom shenanigans is all back home in a bit..