1169 replies to this topic

[Dran Dragore]

i suggest interesting Faction Rewards: Faction Warhorns (Davion, Steiner, Ghost Bear,... ) at the high Rank of the ladder. Or bring special Colors for getting the top rank. Be creative. Just make it more atractive.

[Wing 0]

Friday's Skirmish Event to me was a HUGE SUCCESS. Playing Davion with friends and we were getting nothing but Instant Matches. There were a lot of units out there. However; There were Several units which we've never seen before in Faction were playing so poorly it wasn't even funny. Then again, It was better than Stomping Pugs who don't attempt to play with units.

Now if only we give out reward bonuses for every player actively playing Faction Play, Those Rare or Ultra Rare Supply Caches look very good right now.

Edited by Wing 0, 04 August 2018 - 11:35 AM.

[Will9761]

I have to say, it is nice to see Paul give insight on what can and can't be done with FP and taking our feedback. Sure I understand that "the truth hurts" and it sucks that not every one of our feedback will make it, but as long as the limitations are being discussed then I am fine with it. I just hope that FP becomes more than giving out food pellets for events.

[Starwulfe]

Scouting needs adjusting for smoke diving.
If defenders are able to find and fight in the square under drop ship fire, the mission should not end.
The timer should pause, or allow them to shoot the dropship and drive it off. Then dropship chooses a new location after 30s-1m.

[SilentScreamer]

w

Peiper, on 02 August 2018 - 09:50 PM, said:

BATTLE VALUE INSTEAD OF TONNAGE
Change tonnage to battle value. So, give every mech a battle value based upon the capabilities of the mech, and tell people they can take that much in the way of battle value. (This will have minimal impact on this game mode, but a big impact on quick play matchmaking, btw.) Battle value is simply a value of 1-100 based upon the capabilities and potential of the mech selected. A pre-nerf Kodiak might have 100 BV, pre-nerf Timber Wolf of 75. A pre-buff Atlas might have a BV of 80 and a pre-buff Orion might have a score of 60. (Currently, the scores are far more even by tonnage due to forcing unlike mechs to be equal.) In any case, the idea that all mechs of a certain weight are equal is bogus. This would change it so mechs are valued on what they can do, not their tonnage. It would both allow PGI the freedom to let the mechs be what they are instead of 'balancing them' into crap or god-ness, and get rid of the whole idea that mechs should be equal when they were never supposed to be in the first place.

TL;DR Battle value is a value of 1-100 based on mech ability. Use this to replace tonnage. Result: IS and Clan no longer have to be equal in tonnage, rather simply equal in battle value vs. each other.

justcallme A S H, on 03 August 2018 - 01:59 PM, said:

Yeah but look at Solaris and balance, it's really not great. There are 3-4 chassis per div that are good and that's basically it (I've played a decent amount of it).

As I said a chasiss can be deemed to have a higher value, you put a junk build on it suddenly it's worth less than a bad chassis with a good build. This instantly breaks any semblance of a decent 'Value' calculation. Plus the overt complexities that come with it that I pointed out... It literally means another layer of balance for PGI and also understanding for Players. I can't see anyone in a logical frame of mind thinking that's good for anyone.

Even considering that the system we have now is based on only Tonnage? So plenty of players would freely trade a 65 ton Ebon Jaguar for a Jagermech? Or take a Spider 5V instead of a Arctic Cheetah, because they are both 30 tons and the current system is based on balance by tonnage.

I do not think Peiper or anyone else suggesting an alternative is not thinking "logically". I think the current system could use improvement

[The Basilisk]

dragoburnhard, on 04 August 2018 - 09:58 AM, said:

here is the fix for factionplay

https://youtu.be/cXadyduAVes?t=7m59s

This...
Clone MWLL with modern tech and effective and functional physics, clean programming and a sh..load of maps, multiplayer missions and npcs for pvp and coop Faction wars and there you go....

[redacted]

Edited by Tina Benoit, 07 August 2018 - 10:08 AM.
nonconstructive & staff abuse

[FuzzyNZ]

Please add:

Number of players in Searching Lobby, like Solaris.

As soon as there is one player, another player sees this and will be more willing to wait seeing others in the wait queue.

Much better than a waiting searching logo.....

[Marius Evander]

FuzzyNZ, on 04 August 2018 - 04:37 PM, said:

Please add:

Number of players in Searching Lobby, like Solaris.

As soon as there is one player, another player sees this and will be more willing to wait seeing others in the wait queue.

Much better than a waiting searching logo.....

That does more to discourage than encourage queueing, FP "oh theres only <7 people queueing stuff it ill go back to QP for another game, repeat.

[Cato Zilks]

Paul Inouye, on 02 August 2018 - 10:19 AM, said:

- Adding lore and decisions to your participation in any given conflict. For example, if the conflict is between Clan and IS, when I select a planet that is in contention, I will choose at that point whether I want to play as Clan or IS. If the conflict is between IS and IS, I can choose the faction I want to back. Even as a Kurita Loyalist, I can choose to fight in a conflict between Steiner and Merik and not have to be penalized for doing so. I also want a story or story arch to tell me WHY I'm going to be fighting.

Jesus Christ Paul, its Marik.

[SilentScreamer]

Cato Zilks, on 04 August 2018 - 05:59 PM, said:

Jesus Christ Paul, its Marik.

We finally get direct interaction with Paul on the forums and the playerbase would rather nitpick mispelling by one vowel instead of discuss the game? We might see another thread like this by 2024.

[Cato Zilks]

SilentScreamer, on 04 August 2018 - 06:24 PM, said:

We finally get direct interaction with Paul on the forums and the playerbase would rather nitpick mispelling by one vowel instead of discuss the game? We might see another thread like this by 2024.

I am going to discuss the game, but I don't think razzing Paul for using the wrong vowel is going to dissuade him from interacting.

[Cato Zilks]

From reading through this whole thing, the best ideas really seem to come out in the first few pages and later pages have the same things reworded or pie-in-the-sky game overhauls. So here is a recap post that incorporates a lot of those earlier ideas with tiny amount of feedback. Sorry, if I didn't include your post. Also, I edited the quotes below for brevity, but links are included to the full posts:

justcallme A S H, on 01 August 2018 - 08:48 PM, said:

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6142480

• Loyalist / Merc Tree - Max Rank 20 Loyalist / Rank 10 for Merc. Many users achieved this 2 years ago...
  
• 1-Bucket Merger / Purpose of the map - There is now no 'purpose' to Faction Play...
  
• Mercs Insta Contract Switch vs Loyalist- ...
  
• Tug-O-War bar is BROKEN - ...
  
• Loylist Probation Games - Make it 5 and not 10...
  
• IS v IS / Clan v Clan - This really has not eventuated at all. Needs to happen, keeps things interesting.
  
• Incursion -Increase base points hitpoints...
  
• New Player Experience - gate FP by making new accounts spend 50-100 games in QP first to 'qualify'...
  
• Regular Events - We were promised regular stuff as part of FP4.1. It just isn't happening, that was December 2016.

• SEIGE Maps - tweak maps...
  
• In-game UI - Make a 'Marketplace' of sorts where a Unit Leader can advertise in game...
  
• Drop Zone walls - have the walls face 45deg INWARD toward the drop zone centre...

Ash, first thanks for getting this started. Second, the angled dz walls is ******* gold, needs to happen ASAP. I think your points generally spot on, but some are sparse on the details for certain points. Like how do we add purpose? etc.

Eisenhorne, on 01 August 2018 - 09:53 PM, said:

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6142504
* Allow Loyalty Points to be converted to MC once you're past rank 20...
* (F) Faction variant mechs....
* Show how many groups are queued...
* If scouting gets to Tier 3 FP bonuses, the team with the bonuses should have a cooldown reduction on the global strike cooldown.
* Seasonal rewards for faction play...
* Have 3 conflicts at once...
* Add a new game mode ...
* Make it more profitable to win by objectives, or at least equally profitable...

Eisen, I think the Faction Variant idea and small MC for LP exchange could be really fun rewards for LP post max level. I am not keen on seasonal participation awards for number of matches. I think it makes more sense to just give us rewards up front. 3 buckets is not going to really be on the table. In regards to the rewarding objective, see below

Jon McFuzzy, on 02 August 2018 - 05:37 AM, said:

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6142695
- Do NOT allow Trial mechs to be used in FP drop decks...
- Re-enable IS vs IS / Clan vs Clan
- Significantly improve CBills and Loyalty point rewards for performance, even for a loss, discouraging gen rush
- Provide rewards/incentive for group drop as compared to solo drop
- Re-enable the ability to see who's in queue and how many
- Sales on Drop decks and add more than four (I got four already)
- Change the lobby wait time from 60 seconds to 90 or 120 seconds
- (Slightly) alter Siege map design. Too many choke points, huge disadvantage for attackers
- More Content - Give players reason why win is important, why planets are important, background stories for events
- Why can't we have "form up on me" command option

Jon, I think you are spot on with the increased drop decks, added lobby time, seeing queue size, and the form up on me command. Now you want to increase the rewards for fighting while Eisen wants to increase rewards for objectives. Obviously, ya'll are in direct opposition on this issue, and I think this is an issue that does deeply divide the community. I don't know which direction PGI needs to take rewards in some of their game modes, but I do think they need to take a fresh look and take a more clear direction in each mode.

QueenBlade, on 02 August 2018 - 10:45 AM, said:

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6142827
https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing
FP needs to be more RPy...
Make us care about planets...
The Reward/Rank system could use an overhaul...

QB, while I totally agree that the nerd factor of FP needs to be turned up significantly, you are proposing a major overhaul. Little of this is easily achievable and I am afraid that your system is going to increase the frequency and brutality of stomps, which I think is bad for game pop.

Paul Inouye, on 03 August 2018 - 02:00 PM, said:

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6143447
Here's a quick list of stuff that can be done pulled from comments here:
- Increase health in Incursion base buildings
- Higher ticket count in Conquest
- Call to arms timer change
- Game area indicator for Friends List (QP/FP/Comp/Sol instead of just "Deployed")
Investigating:
- More than 4 drop decks
- Removal of certain maps/modes from FP cycle
- Refresh button on Friends List

Paul, first, thanks for being so active in here. I think most of these are pretty good (especially the extra drop decks), but I personally think the brakes should be pumped on a few of these ideas. I don't think conquest needs a sizable ticket change (or if it needs any change at all). As has been said several times in this thread, conquest is currently one of the most dynamic game modes in FP and I don't want it to be changed over to more of a slugfest with cap points as an after thought. Also, I strongly disagree with the posts about removing the long-range/open-sight-line maps like Alpine or Polar. I think they serve as a good balance to the congested brawling maps we have invasion.

[KingCobra]

The event is very fun with small groups or solo players right up until you get rolled by premade units playing mostly Kurita I have said so many times in the past FP needs 2 queues one for 4-12 man groups and another queue for everyone else.

Its obvious PGI is trying to revive FP which is great but if they continue to let it be Premade groups VS everyone else it will fail hard just like Solaris has because of bad game mode design.

[Cato Zilks]

In terms of small additions tweaks that can help fix both the tug of war system and the factions have no flavor issue, I will go back to an old idea first brought up by Hobbles https://mwomercs.com...y-mode-variety/ and which I tweak https://mwomercs.com...changes-for-fp/ (pt. 5). The all or nothing feature of the tug of war system has a terrible effect on gameplay and needs to be a top priority. Moreover, rewarding factions that do the winning with planet victories will do a lot to make factions matter a bit more again. Importantly, this does not require creating a bunch of buckets for the population.

Spoiler

Put briefly, break the bar into however many planets we think should be up for grabs at once; right now that is four planets. So, each 1/4 of the bar represents a planet. If clans end the cycle with the bar about 60% past even, they would get 2 planets. Every single faction would vote for their own target, but planet allocation and tags would be a bit different. The core idea is to reward factions for good performance and keep the map changing.

Planet victories would be assigned based on wins and participation: each win earns a faction .75 points, and participation earns 0.25 points (so a win actually gets 1 full point as winners participate). We could have scouting participation count a .05 and scouting win as .2 (making four scouting wins equal to 1 regular FP drop.

On a night when the IS won 3 planets, lets say the point totals were like this:
Liao 648 points
FRR 530.25
Davion 402
Marik 397.75
Kurita 388.5
Steiner 360
Lets also, pretend that Davion does not share clan border. Liao would take the planet they voted for and the top Liao unit would get the tag. FRR would take the planet they voted for and the top FRR unit would get the tag. Davion, because they share no border with the clans, would not take a planet on the map, but their top unit would get the tags on the next planet taken. Marik would take the planet they voted for, but the top Davion unit would get the tag.

Conversely, a night where clanners win 4 planets:
Vipers 728 points
Sharks 615
Falcons 610.75
Bears 497.75
Cats 388.5
Jags 360
Wolves 317.5
Because several clan factions share space, they also need to share polls. Falcons, because they share space with the Vipers, would take the planet the Vipers/Falcons voted for most and the top Viper unit would get the tag. Wolves, because they share space with the Sharks, would take the planet the Wolves/Sharks voted for most and the top Shark unit would get the tag. Falcons would take the planet the Vipers/Falcons voted for second most and the top Falcon unit would get the tag. Bears would take the planet they voted for most and the top Bear unit would get the tag.

This helps keep rewards from piling all to one faction (to disincentivize super-factions) while also not rewarding under performing factions from reaping all of the benefits from having a larger voting base. More importantly, it encourages participation even when the bar is not far along. Currently, if you login with 2 hours left in the cycle and the bar is right in the middle, there is little reason to play, nobody is capping that night. But if you only need to move the bar 25% in your favor, the task of capping a planet is within your grasp.

Most importantly, while this sounds like a major departure from our current system, it really isn't. This takes the clan model for voting and applies it to all factions, takes the tagging system and applies it to how planets are captured. All of the data used in this system is already collected and used by the game, it just applies it in a slightly different manner.

Also, lets get more of these smaller faction events going.

Edited by Cato Zilks, 04 August 2018 - 08:16 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

Xavier, on 04 August 2018 - 05:50 AM, said:

Selectable drop zones: remove the walls around drop zones that were placed their to prevent farming and instead allow pilots to select which DZ they wish to land.

If the wall fix I put forward happens it would fix a lot of those issues.

Side point on selectable dropzones - this will be a Paul clarification item - I think this came up at one point as not being easily possible due to the way dropship mechanic work/come in off the map... This is a vague recollection though.

[Marius Evander]

justcallme A S H, on 01 August 2018 - 08:48 PM, said:

• Drop Zone walls - To alleviate some spawn camping sitiatuons need to move the Spawns a bit closer to gether on some maps and also have the walls face 45deg INWARD toward the drop zone centre. This will stop spawn camping a little by letting dropships shoot OVER the walls. Currently you can hit behind walls, wait for dropship to leave, go kill mechs. Adjusting the wall angle instantly resolves this big complaint. Will it stop it entirely? No, but it will help.

Cato Zilks, on 04 August 2018 - 07:50 PM, said:

Ash, first thanks for getting this started. Second, the angled dz walls is ******* gold, needs to happen ASAP. I think your points generally spot on,

LATER THAT WEEK AT PGI HQ



A FEW MONTHS LATER




MORE SIMPLE "SOLUTION" IF YOU REFUSE TO DO SOLO AND GROUPED QUEUE.




MORE COMPLEX, IM DREAMING, SOLUTION.

Edited by Cadoazreal, 05 August 2018 - 04:54 AM.

[Yondu Udonta]

Make a store that allows you to buy faction related stuff such as warhorns/banners with another currency that is given out for every FP game played. Not the most important thing I know but would be nice perhaps.

And wow finally a FP EXCLUSIVE event after 9 months. Have we finally seen the light at the end of the tunnel we have been walking through for 2018? Or is it just a brief reprieve? Time will tell but at least there's some optimism to be had.

[Cato Zilks]

Cado, that gave me a good laugh. There are a lot of ways of trying to ease the stompiness of dz camping. I am behind Ash's because it is simple (changing the angle of objects and making them something you cant walk on vs short term fall immunity). Simple means PGI is more likely to implement, and some improvement is better than none.

Still, that was funny.

Edited by Cato Zilks, 05 August 2018 - 12:14 AM.

[Marius Evander]

I expect its as hard to make the RAMPS surrounded by invisible WALLS so that they can't be climbed as it is to make the dropship leg protection mechanic last a little longer, there's often other terrain nearby people can hide behind when dropships are there, and I know my tower idea / higher dropships probably wont help with that either.

So that leaves us with SPLITTING THE QUEUES! into solo with SSR and grouped with additional rewards !



V Agree word for word with what CZ said quoted below.

"Paul, first, thanks for being so active in here. I think most of these are pretty good (especially the extra drop decks), but I personally think the brakes should be pumped on a few of these ideas. I don't think conquest needs a sizable ticket change (or if it needs any change at all). As has been said several times in this thread, conquest is currently one of the most dynamic game modes in FP and I don't want it to be changed over to more of a slugfest with cap points as an after thought. Also, I strongly disagree with the posts about removing the long-range/open-sight-line maps like Alpine or Polar. I think they serve as a good balance to the congested brawling maps we have invasion"

Edited by Cadoazreal, 05 August 2018 - 03:56 AM.

[Bishop Six]

Terrorsdawn, on 04 August 2018 - 09:45 AM, said:

Biggest problem is population imbalance, caused with the introduction of Mercs and no proper framework in place to maintain population balance.

And exactly on this we are working on.

We all can help:

- be friendly to enemies / no trash talk against noobs/ beginners
- constructive (!) advices if you see a teammate using wrong setup
- i rarely see DropLeader in Pug-Teams. Everyone have to take courage a bit more, everyone is happy about some talking! At least some Target calling and giving some intel about enemies sightings
- The premades should take 1-2 Guys from LFG with them on regularly base
- Try new / fresh tactics, even if there is a chance you will not succeed this time. Be open for new stuff!

These points can help imo to create a more friendly environment for ALL Players, consequence should be an increasing number of FP participants.

Then PGI is doing their part and zack bumm, we will have a more living FP!