1169 replies to this topic

[Ignatius Audene]

Domtik, on 05 February 2021 - 10:19 PM, said:

I think that increasing damage output of the drop ships and increase the range of them to create a risk vs reward for spawn camping the drop point. That seems to be that standard operation in a lot of the FP matches.

Just leave your spawn and fight the enemy soon enogh, and u will never get spawn camped.

Stronger dropships will just result in more 2ac2 erppc overwatch hiding in spawn.

[Khobai]

Quote

Just leave your spawn and fight the enemy soon enogh, and u will never get spawn camped.

Stronger dropships will just result in more 2ac2 erppc overwatch hiding in spawn.

They do leave their spawn initially. The problem is they die and get pushed back to the spawn.

And the problem isnt the dropship not doing enough damage. Its the teams not being properly balanced. Spawn camping can only really occur when one team is significantly superior to the other team. Usually a good group vs a bunch of solos or a worse group.

The problem is the same as its always been: groups vs solos. The sooner PGI recognizes that the better.

FP as a gamemode for groups/units was a novel idea but it failed miserably. It turned into the same unbalanced cesspool that group queue did. Because of the matchmakers inability to properly balance groups.

If they cant create a matchmaker that balances groups against solos then they need to get rid of group vs solo matchups.

Solo players will NEVER tolerate losing to groups. The situation in FP will never improve as long as thats a thing.

Everything else is secondary to that.

Edited by Khobai, 02 June 2021 - 01:19 AM.

[Leone]

Leone said:

You are wrong. The only thing a premade group has over any other solos is the potential for complimentary builds. That is all.

~Leone.

[Horseman]

Khobai, on 02 June 2021 - 01:01 AM, said:

If they cant create a matchmaker that balances groups against solos then they need to get rid of group vs solo matchups.

We've been there. It made everyone, solos included, unable to get matches in FP at all.

Quote

Solo players will NEVER tolerate losing to groups. The situation in FP will never improve as long as thats a thing.

That's an attitude problem with solos, and it exists even when they have groups on their side.The "evil groups of toxic comp players who cheat by using optimized mechs and communicating" are just a convenient scapegoat - and as it is with scapegoats, if you deny solos the ability to blame that one they'll find a new one.

Edited by Horseman, 02 June 2021 - 11:32 PM.

[Stormbreaker613UA]

Ok. So main problems in FP:
Spawn camp.
Randoms vs Prepared groups of 10-12 (Randoms always lose)

Cheaters (I not saw them, but I heard of them)

That all comes to that almost nobody plays in this game mode.
Some people even can leave this game after this. (Online of this game is still low compare to other Online games)
Right now FP is almost dead as Solaris 7.

Main reason to keep playing/ to play Faction is a free Mech bays.

After you get every free mech bay from 2nd rank of each faction is nothing do here unleast you ready to spend almost all entire life to get max rank by constant loosing and sometimes winning.

And also MAIN Advantage and Disadvantage of this entire Game - VERY BIG TEAM DEPENDENCE!
You can't pull your team up to the win even with a full squad of 4 people. (In other Online games you can do it even by your own. For example: War Thunder, World of Tanks ....)

And yes, Clanners is Superior to IS because of better weaponry and range, and overall technological advantage. And it's correct in lore and it`s OK in tabletop (I guess).
BUT!
Inner Sphere SHOULD BE Superior BY NUMBERS, and it Terms of Mass production.
SO in Faction Play IS players should be able to drop more mechs than Clanners!

So my suggestion that: Clanners should have less mechs to drop compare to IS
For example: Clanners can drop only 2-3 mechs per player. IS go full 4.

Right now FP is unfair compare to QP.

QP is fine, more or less.

That's all for now.


IMHO: I'm playing in this game for 1 month. And I like this game, but this game still feels like is in Open Beta with all beta problems (Balance, low quantity of content and etc.) and this game was released in 2013. Devs need to do more and do it fast.
Because if they met a very strong and good alternative to their game -> their project will be dead.

And also MW5 is very bad compare to MW4 and MW3. Only think can save MW5 is modders. So if you want MW5 - wait it on sale. MW5 don't cost its price at all.

[Leone]

Stormbreaker613UA, on 01 July 2021 - 11:14 PM, said:

Ok. So main problems in FP:
Spawn camp.

Yup. Nothing for it. You can't force other's to leave their spawn, so just charge in an clear 'em out, and leave your own when your teammates do so.

Stormbreaker613UA, on 01 July 2021 - 11:14 PM, said:

Randoms vs Prepared groups of 10-12 (Randoms always lose)

I beg to differ.

Stormbreaker613UA, on 01 July 2021 - 11:14 PM, said:

Cheaters (I not saw them, but I heard of them)

Mostly that's just scrubs complaining because 'they are the best, so it couldn't have been skill!'. Actual cheaters are very rare, and get caught and banned.

The game-mode is great! it's a blast, my favourite. But it can take a while to get a match, and sometimes even after waiting a bunch, you'll get skipped if dropping solo.

Lastly, Clan is, actually, not superior in mechery to the Innersphere.

~Leone.

Edited by Leone, 02 July 2021 - 12:22 AM.

[justcallme A S H]

Stormbreaker613UA, on 01 July 2021 - 11:14 PM, said:

Ok. So main problems in FP:
Cheaters (I not saw them, but I heard of them)
.

Given the unit you are in and the other you associate with. I know exactly which 2 individuals are whispering that into your ear.

If I were you I'd completely ignore them. They are well, well known for spreading misinformation within MWO Communities.

[The Basilisk]

Leone, on 02 July 2021 - 12:12 AM, said:

Yup. Nothing for it. You can't force other's to leave their spawn, so just charge in an clear 'em out, and leave your own when your teammates do so.

I beg to differ.


Mostly that's just scrubs complaining because 'they are the best, so it couldn't have been skill!'. Actual cheaters are very rare, and get caught and banned.

The game-mode is great! it's a blast, my favourite. But it can take a while to get a match, and sometimes even after waiting a bunch, you'll get skipped if dropping solo.

Lastly, Clan is, actually, not superior in mechery to the Innersphere.

~Leone.

There seem to be heavy discrepancys in how you and 3 or 4 other very forum active individuals percieve reality in contrary to literaly thousands of players that skipped FP or dropped the game because their playing experience in it was awful to put it mildly.
The ammount of personal investment and outright wrong overoptimisation that was needed to build up a drop team that had a consistant and constant good chance of success against other organized teams was simply hillarious. (Also the results when you encountered random groups...or the ghost drops...hillarious)

If we would talk about large developer sponsored E-sports titles like Overwatch, CS, UT, or ilk like that .. .yes ok I know how to stay away from that.
But this sh...in a BATTLETECH fan game that should be aimed at the 40 to 50 yo daddys who played TT BT as kid and the first MW titles during highschool or study time ???

MEEEEEEP.....dear developers you hardmissed your customer group. Cuz the only ppl with enough time to keep up with your stuff are semiprofessional twitchers, U-tubbers and other oddballs with a serious lack of normal private life.

And look now at the completely disproportional amount of actual players and SM ppl populating the game.
How many players per streamer are there in a normal game ? 1/5000?
Look at the huge list of streamers in the last event and how many active accounts there are.

Aside from the constant exageration folowed by lackluster or outright not delivering the content they advertised this is the main problem the game had. Hardmissing their target group.
QP and even Group queue where nice and fun...QP still is from time to time.
But they realy should have concentrated on making interesting QP and GP modes and shitloads of maps instead of FP.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Khobai, on 02 June 2021 - 01:01 AM, said:

They do leave their spawn initially. The problem is they die and get pushed back to the spawn.

And the problem isnt the dropship not doing enough damage. Its the teams not being properly balanced. Spawn camping can only really occur when one team is significantly superior to the other team. Usually a good group vs a bunch of solos or a worse group.

The problem is the same as its always been: groups vs solos. The sooner PGI recognizes that the better.

FP as a gamemode for groups/units was a novel idea but it failed miserably. It turned into the same unbalanced cesspool that group queue did. Because of the matchmakers inability to properly balance groups.

If they cant create a matchmaker that balances groups against solos then they need to get rid of group vs solo matchups.

Solo players will NEVER tolerate losing to groups. The situation in FP will never improve as long as thats a thing.

Everything else is secondary to that.

2018/19? im think was my end to play of FP and to this Time, thats was a Big Problem ,you seeing thats the Russian Jade Falcons comes as Closed Group and you can seeing the own Team dies in Seconds without each Chance for Counterattack , the only weak Part by this Group was the 0 Back Armor.
After it ,with the "You out" FP Events while not in this Faction and the horrible Waiting Times for a Ghost Drop for me was FP dead

Edited by MW Waldorf Statler, 02 July 2021 - 01:56 AM.

[Khobai]

I have never seen any evidence of widespread cheating in this game. thats fake news.

The Basilisk, on 02 July 2021 - 01:05 AM, said:

There seem to be heavy discrepancys in how you and 3 or 4 other very forum active individuals percieve reality in contrary to literaly thousands of players that skipped FP or dropped the game because their playing experience in it was awful to put it mildly.
The ammount of personal investment and outright wrong overoptimisation that was needed to build up a drop team that had a consistant and constant good chance of success against other organized teams was simply hillarious. (Also the results when you encountered random groups...or the ghost drops...hillarious)

If we would talk about large developer sponsored E-sports titles like Overwatch, CS, UT, or ilk like that .. .yes ok I know how to stay away from that.
But this sh...in a BATTLETECH fan game that should be aimed at the 40 to 50 yo daddys who played TT BT as kid and the first MW titles during highschool or study time ???

MEEEEEEP.....dear developers you hardmissed your customer group. Cuz the only ppl with enough time to keep up with your stuff are semiprofessional twitchers, U-tubbers and other oddballs with a serious lack of normal private life.

And look now at the completely disproportional amount of actual players and SM ppl populating the game.
How many players per streamer are there in a normal game ? 1/5000?
Look at the huge list of streamers in the last event and how many active accounts there are.

Aside from the constant exageration folowed by lackluster or outright not delivering the content they advertised this is the main problem the game had. Hardmissing their target group.
QP and even Group queue where nice and fun...QP still is from time to time.
But they realy should have concentrated on making interesting QP and GP modes and shitloads of maps instead of FP.

its funny because its true lol

[Daidachi]

Stormbreaker613UA, on 01 July 2021 - 11:14 PM, said:

And also MAIN Advantage and Disadvantage of this entire Game - VERY BIG TEAM DEPENDENCE!

Erm...yeah, it's a team based game. A group that coordinates is automatically going to have an overwhelming advantage over a group of randoms who aren't.

No matter what you think of Mercstar (for example) they didn't win a lot by having the best 12 mans in the game on every single drop (hint: a big chunk of their playerbase were only of average skill) - they won a lot because they were all on comms together and coordinated.

It's the same now, but very rare to see the same tags on every pilot on one side or the other, but the adage still holds true.

Now if you were saying PGI should have looked at making better tools to allow players to find and group up with others, I'd have agreed with you. Heck, timestamped messages in chat might be of use there.

But this reads like a person who rocked up for a job interview without reading the position description first, missing out to someone who took the time to address the selection criteria in advance.

And frankly, I'm tired of seeing people complain about others winning because they made an effort. If you just want to do your own thing, that's cool - plenty of options out there. But a cooperative pvp game that focuses on team based play is probably not the right fit for the experience you say you're after.

Edited by Daidachi, 02 July 2021 - 10:53 AM.

[Duke Falcon]

FP is good. I like it a lot and prefer it above the rest of MWO. But clan versus clan matches\conflicts would be trully good.
FP is good. I usually got beaten fast because my aggressive style or if I try to remain behind and lag to preyed by lights. Still, FP is the best part of MWO IMO. It need (somehow) far-far more competitors to quickly fill the queues (grrrr, those 20-30 mins waiting times!)...
FP is good. Many may complain much about it and propagate QP. QP is to quick and way to small in scale. Right, QP is good to fullfill events or test\learn your new mechs\builds but other than that QP is not good. More "imbalanced" than FP I think: If OPForce has 8-12 T1s you sucked. In FP you sucked either but have more options to deal damage, watch, learn or just try to avenge your destroyed mech...
FP is good because grants more CB at the end. If you make things well you could earn 3-5x more CBs than in QP (not to mention the XP)...

[Tarl Cabot]

I stole this from a player when with a discussion about groups and that queue.

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__3535245

Basic message is this:

1. Teamwork is OP - way more op than any xxxx Meta

2. Communication

3. Understanding and configuring your team's mech composition and loadouts

4. Understanding each other's playstyle and assigning roles to suit

5. Focus Fire

6. Lock down potentially dangerous opponents first

7. Understanding the map, the flow of battle and adapting

[Khobai]

Daidachi, on 02 July 2021 - 10:52 AM, said:

Erm...yeah, it's a team based game. A group that coordinates is automatically going to have an overwhelming advantage over a group of randoms who aren't.

A premade group that coordinates should never be matched up against a group of randoms in the first place. That is the entire problem.

[Horseman]

The Basilisk, on 02 July 2021 - 01:05 AM, said:

The ammount of personal investment and outright wrong overoptimisation that was needed to build up a drop team that had a consistant and constant good chance of success against other organized teams was simply hillarious.

"Personal investment is wrong", "optimization is wrong"... like, do you even hear yourself?
If there is something, ANYTHING to be competitive about, people WILL get competitive about it.
If there is room to optimize, players WILL optimize.

Quote

But this sh...in a BATTLETECH fan game that should be aimed at the 40 to 50 yo daddys who played TT BT as kid and the first MW titles during highschool or study time ??? MEEEEEEP.....dear developers you hardmissed your customer group.

It's funny how you automatically equate that group's age with having no drive, no ambition and no personal pride and imply that anyone who has them isn't part of this game's customer base.

Quote

Aside from the constant exageration folowed by lackluster or outright not delivering the content they advertised this is the main problem the game had. Hardmissing their target group.

If I recall, originally FP was advertised as THE main mode for the game where QP was at best considered a temporary filler.
Think about that for a moment.

[Tarl Cabot]

Horseman, on 02 July 2021 - 11:50 PM, said:

-snip-
If I recall, originally FP was advertised as THE main mode for the game where QP was at best considered a temporary filler.
Think about that for a moment.

Ding Ding..^^^ This!! And that worm and hook pulled in the whales, the founders!!!!!!!!! Everything else was to build up to Faction Plan, aka Community Warfare. The reason the game went from 4vs4 to 8vs8 to 12vs12 and the actual group queue for groups 5-man to 12-man while 2/3/4-man stayed in the QP queue, but PGI furbar that Launch module.

I do wonder though how things would have worked out if the Launch Module had actually worked properly instead of dumping the larger groups, including 12-man into the QP queue, even then would PGI possibility reduced the QP queue to 2-man and 3-man? Even then the QP queue continued to go through changes, rendering the 3-3-3-3 rule manually when specific mech packs were released, to open up the value to keeping that specific value particularly short while maintaining the match ups with equal weight classes across the two teams.

Then CW, with the 12vs12 being the stepping stones. It had its moments, but without any actual House Leadership in place for guidance/direction it, it would have been difficult for it to continue. I was glad the setup changed but even then it took so long for PGI to make changes that baited hook had lost its meat, literally blasted away with the Long Tom event.

With that said, the major revision with the Tug of War was definitely at step in the right direction but even then it was missing some items. For me the major item missing is in the current rendition of FP, the "co-opt" of major Factions with like Factions (IS vs Clan), or picking a side of minor Faction (Dracs vs Fedrats or Wolves vs Falcons), thus people/units no longer had to leave their House or Clan to participate in any events.

Even then the first two major versions, the Wheel and Tug-of-War, allowed planets to switch too often, ie getting instant satisfaction. I like the current variation, the combination of Tug-of-War but done over more than main series of combat drops, each counted by itself with the final result being who won those encounters, and ties went to the defender.

There are still pieces missing, but may have played better with the two previous variations, such capturing planets to cut supply lines to at prevent forward movement to planets deeper into the interior/exterior. And since there hasnt been any Repair/Rearm necessary, possibility of rendering how often a chassis could be used after being destroyed then those players would have to change out that specific mech. For Omnis this would be the main base of said mech, the CT. And the number limits for the defenders cut off could also be dependent whether or not a drop was a win or loss with a win extending that limit. It could also matter if the defender has the most wins, ties or loses that session period.

Frak it.. wishful thinking/storyboarding...

[D A T A]

SIEGE ONLY, 265 both factions

Edited by D A T A, 04 July 2021 - 12:28 PM.

[Telemachus -Salt Wife Salt Life-]

D A T A, on 04 July 2021 - 12:21 PM, said:

SIEGE ONLY, 265 both factions

I just came back to the game after like 2-3 years off and the current conflict is all siege right now and it's very nice.

The whole one side is always attacking and always defending kinda makes it a little boring, maybe it should randomize the attack/defense sides, but I am 100% for 24/7 siege. In case there is some sort of CW redo happening right now.

240 both sides is fine too

Edited by Telemachus -Salt Wife Salt Life-, 04 July 2021 - 01:46 PM.

[The Basilisk]

Horseman, on 02 July 2021 - 11:50 PM, said:

"Personal investment is wrong", "optimization is wrong"... like, do you even hear yourself?
If there is something, ANYTHING to be competitive about, people WILL get competitive about it.
If there is room to optimize, players WILL optimize.
It's funny how you automatically equate that group's age with having no drive, no ambition and no personal pride and imply that anyone who has them isn't part of this game's customer base.
If I recall, originally FP was advertised as THE main mode for the game where QP was at best considered a temporary filler.
Think about that for a moment.

remember again

FP was advertised as story of the Inner sphere Clan invasion driven event based game mode where you would join a faction and earn credit in this faction names.
The only event that ever was in FP was the Tukajid event (can't remeber just now was it two or three times?)

And thats it.

No context

No missions

no events

just the grind for mechbays for ppl that would be considdered whales by newbys that could have been the only ones profiting from the mechbays you could get from FP

even EVE that proudly calls itself a sandbox game and that does everything to drive their players in the arms of some thug like organisation driven meetgrinder playerdriven everlasting war over meaningless terretories has more storry and explainational content than this

Regarding the the optimization....I give that back to you ... do you even know what you're saying???
"If there is room to optimize, players WILL optimize"
Are you effin insane ? Are you blind? Deaf ? Otherwisely inabled to realize simple cause effect relations?
That is the prob I'm talking about.
The game is so full of stuff that crys abuse me that those that do not care for what the game is actualy about just jump to it...and FP is the worst part of it with the most stuff that can be abused...starting with builds and chassis combination going over certain strats and ending with simple spawn camping....this....is....wrong!!!! There is every single error of implementing gameplay in a multiplayer game that any company made in the last 20 years in one game mode.
And speaking of wrongly implemented or translated gameplay...
Starting by all this pinpoint damage sh...going to inverted relation between omni and battlemech and climaxing in this hillarious hot mess of multiple weapon systems acting as one big !!!
We have 2021 !!! The reason because this kind of implementation was somewhat ok was because 22 years ago when the last precursor of an online capable MW game was done nobody expected a deeper, more meaningfull more balanced and intelligent aproach...the RL tech level alone was a good argument to not expect too much of a game.

But this is no game made by some fans doing a patreon financed open source thingi
The founders prog alone yielded over 5 mio dollars thats +5.000.000€
The game has now somewhat beteen 25000 and 30000 active acounts. It had more once.
Just think about the count of mechpacks, what they did cost, and how many players may have bought some.
And now tell me it would have been impossible to put that money to good use.

Regarding drive, abition and personal pride.... yea...in a computer game ...
ambition ? Wrong game nothing to gain here try Starcraft in Korea.
drive ? For what? There is nothing to gain here except some mechbays and trolling other players away from the game...thats mainly the reason the player count is reduced to the hardcore MW and BT fans..there is nothing to win and no other goal that any kind of drive could use as target...
personal pride? ... again...in a COMPUTER GAME...you...are...effin hillarious dude

We are here for MW Battletech content ... and it has barely been delivered...thats the only thing I can think about regarding MWO when I'm not putting gauss rounds or lasers through other mechs.

Edited by The Basilisk, 04 July 2021 - 02:20 PM.

[Karl Streiger]

The Basilisk, on 04 July 2021 - 02:15 PM, said:

We are here for MW Battletech content ... and it has barely been delivered...thats the only thing I can think about regarding MWO when I'm not putting gauss rounds or lasers through other mechs.

You can shoot Mechs, do you need anything else