25 replies to this topic

[kapusta11]

Never forget.

[Shadowomega1]

kapusta11, on 10 October 2018 - 07:25 AM, said:

Never forget.

If they would just allow people to change map zoom on the fly. 500m, 1000, 1200, and 2000 meters options would be perfect.

[RJF Volkodav]

OP, TTK, need nerf, potatoes cant play...

[Daggett]

That was a great feature i really miss, especially on enemy movement.
But i also like the current weight-class information which replaced the direction.

Ideally i'd like to have both, but that's maybe a bit too much at once for the small minimap.

[El Bandito]

It got too cluttered, I suppose. Should have no problem if PGI brings back 8v8.

[kapusta11]

El Bandito, on 10 October 2018 - 08:36 AM, said:

It got too cluttered, I suppose. Should have no problem if PGI brings back 8v8.

Good thing that THIS is not as cluttered, right?



Apparently you can also tell the mech weight class just by looking at your minimap, if you're casually playing in 4k of course.

[Prototelis]

Play at 720p, no problem reading the mini map.

There is also this great feature called the battlemap.

Uavs and (I think) target retention also give enemy direction, but I do agree that knowing which way your own teammates are facing would be hella useful.

[El Bandito]

kapusta11, on 10 October 2018 - 09:27 AM, said:

Good thing that THIS is not as cluttered, right?



Apparently you can also tell the mech weight class just by looking at your minimap, if you're casually playing in 4k of course.

That's far less cluttered than 12v12.

[Nightbird]

The new minimap has arrows for each mech, unfortunately they only show up under UAVs as a 'feature' and removed completely for allies.

PGI being PGI

Edited by Nightbird, 10 October 2018 - 09:58 AM.

[Harlock69]

Maybe keep it simple, and just add a ' nose' to the existing icon, pointing in the direction of motion?

[Pope RW]

Actually a tail indicating direction of travel would be easier.

[Throe]

[deleted by user]

Edited by Throe, 09 November 2018 - 11:31 AM.

[Sug]

Wait, the little squares somehow indicate the weight class of the mechs?

[Prototelis]

There is already a little ^ that appears next to the enemy contact on the mini map if they're under a UAV which indicates direction.

And yes, the different diamonds represent different classes. The 4box diamonds are assaults, the split diamonds are heavies and mediums, and empty diamonds are lights.

Edited by Prototelis, 10 October 2018 - 07:11 PM.

[Maddermax]

Sug, on 10 October 2018 - 06:37 PM, said:

Wait, the little squares somehow indicate the weight class of the mechs?

Yes, empty diamonds for lights, vertical line for medium, horizontal line for heavies and crosses for assaults. You can also hit B to get the full map with legend if you forget which is which.

[ocular tb]

I liked the old minimap but I like the current one more. I think knowing the weight classes of both your teammates and the enemies is more useful than knowing just the direction they're facing/moving.

Either map is better than that "other" minimap they gave us for about a week a few years ago. Remember that one? lol

Edited by ocular tb, 10 October 2018 - 10:25 PM.

[Moldur]

The old minimap is inarguably better for instantaneous situational awareness. It showed a smaller area but with much greater detail.

There were a lot of complaints when the minimap was changed. The intermediate one as mentioned by ocular, totally sucked.

I was actually a proponent of the minimap change. I argued that having less information was not necessarily worse for gameplay. It just meant we were not spoonfed as much. PGI implemented these changes before the Cyclops went live, and I figured it was so that electronic warfare would be more useful. If players knew less by default, that would give room to make EW features actually useful. Maybe give directional indicators as a sensor buff or something. That's what I thought anyway.

High situational awareness will guide a player toward intelligent gameplay decision. As you all know when you've got some UAVs or tracked targets, MWO plays much differently because everyone knows what is going on. Conversely, we know that a hidden team with a lot of ECM is harder to track, and the team often gets cold feet because they don't know what is going on. Does the UAV change anything physically? not besides missile lock. Its greater effect is how it influences a team to maneuver and pick targets.

Even the relatively clueless players will seemingly be sharp and capable of smart maneuvering if they are given the means to have high situational awareness. Whether that is from easy to read, immediately visible HUD elements, or from map knowledge and "combat sense" is irrelevant to the outside observer. When you take away that easy information, it becomes apparent as to who is who on that scale.

In battlefield 4 for instance, the minimap is so immediate and easy to use that it can guide you directly to enemies. I am not joking when I say you can stare at the minimap for pretty much everything besides actually aiming. Squad on the other hand, offers no HUD or HUD-like features to assist in situational awareness. You've got mk1 mod 0 eyeballs, a simple map with no assists, and communication to figure out what the hell is going on. Everybody is pretty clueless in that situation, and players are very reliant on those with map and game knowledge who can deduce what is going on from the small information input, e.g. "If they are not here or here, we are here, our team is there, then the enemy is likely over here."



I don't mean to talk down on anyone or to say that you must be a clueless player who sucks at the game if you dare to think that we should have a better minimap. I don't think that, but I'm just verbalizing what the deal is here. Yes, weight class info is also useful information, but the old minimap with its scale and directional indicators was way, way more useful. Not just in knowing enemy mech orientation but your teammates' as well. For instance, you'll feel a lot safer peeking a corner if you can look down and see you've got 3 friendlies trained on that same corner from different positions. You'll "telepathically" know that the 4 of you are a firing line and can waste anyone that pops out, so instead of fearing that corner, you'll stare at it or move up on it. Eh, that's a bad example, but there is really no way to directly compare the 2 systems now or show anyone what I mean. You'll just have to take people's word for it.

[Brizna]

Good old times. Instead of generic target decay, radar derp nodes and so on I wish sensors' skill tree would allow to get a better radar map.

[Peter2k]

Personally I don't think the weight differentiation is worth a lot.

With the old mini map I was able to tell if my teammates are actually holding the line with me, are running away from the front, or are chasing a squirrel with just a simple glance.

To make the same determination now I have to keep on looking at it and see how everything unfolds, so if I'm engaged and holding the line I cant afford on taking my eyes of my targets for more than a glance.
I died many times because I thought the team was actually holding the firing line, when they were just busy turning around and running away.
With the old arrows I always was able to get that info at a glance.


That might not be so important in high level game play in GP or competitive where you are on comms and usually know where the wind is blowing.
But in QP it was way more useful to know if your team chickens out instead of knowing what weight class an enemie mech is (also only with UAV anyway).

I just see it as a failed attempt of implementing any sort of resemblance of the failed info war pillar.

Edited by Peter2k, 11 October 2018 - 02:16 AM.

[Acersecomic]

Daggett, on 10 October 2018 - 07:38 AM, said:

That was a great feature i really miss, especially on enemy movement.
But i also like the current weight-class information which replaced the direction.

Ideally i'd like to have both, but that's maybe a bit too much at once for the small minimap.

World of Tanks does't have problem showing the whole map, 30 players, weight classes, view, radar and detection ranges as well as last place enemy was spotted at.