534 replies to this topic

[Nightbird]

If you think getting rid of top teams in FP will make your experience better... it won't. As long as there are teams in FP, there will always be a top team. Those are players that learn to play the game, develop strats, and coordinate. EVIL has only been strong for a year or so, before that there have been many others over the history of FP. They always get replaced by another boogeyman the forums complains about.

For the players who don't want to learn or coordinate, only some sort of PGI implemented balancing mechanism can help you. So far though, PGI is hanging you guys out to dry. Try writing them some emails if you actually care.

[Rustyhammer]

PGI did it best to kill organised gameplay in MWO.
I start playing FP around March 2017 and I recall facing many units at that time, each with they own strats and unique gameplays. That was fun and I learned a lot of new things even when solo dropping and being matched along and against them. One year later FP turned into a desert with almost no units and the remaining people playing it as QP with re-spawns.

You can keep saying it's the scary top units that drove people away but in reality it's these very units that are gone now. When was the last time you saw a big group of KCom, EVIL, BCMC, 228, MJ12 or other top units in FP? FFS, the remaining players from two of them can't even form a full group together, they accept pretty much anyone in they drops, when the group gets too diluted they losing matches against other premades but people still bitching about facing them.

PGI should give new players good reasons to actively seek a unit to join and get better. There should be reasons for units to recruit and train new players. Having several trainees in the top-tier group will make these groups less scary. Right now, why would you invite a total stranger from LFG to your PUG group rather than in attempt to form a 12 man for insta lobby?

[Oor Wullie]

Paul Inouye, on 06 December 2018 - 05:29 PM, said:

Just want to throw this out there. There's talk here about the tonnage restrictions for high level teams.

Earning 'Mechs and buying 'Mechs is an invested part of MWO. Limiting an entire team by a significant tonnage difference is a rather steep wall of saying "you can't play those 'Mechs because you're too good in them". Also, as others have pointed out... a team of well organized, high-level players is still going to win even with a big tonnage restriction in-place.

The MM doesn't know of a team's reputation from previous wins. Does the 8392th Deuces always drop 12 man? What if there are 2 players from 8392th Deuces on a team with a bunch of random pugs? Do the rest of the pugs get hit with the tonnage restriction because of those 2? Take an average W/L? An average is not going to work because there are so many permutations to a player's success rating that an average will favor high skilled players because averages pull top players down and bottom players up. 4 high skilled players far outweighs the 4 lower skilled players on the team in terms of battlefield success.

Does the tonnage restriction change based on the team ranking? That's going to be a logistical nightmare for teams having to change drop decks on the fly (even after we increase the number of drop decks you can have). If you're on the lower 'ranking' team, who gets the extra tonnage? Who's allowed to take heavier 'Mechs now that the team you're facing is 'better' than yours?

From this I don't think there will be any type of handicaps placed into the game. So instead on dwelling on things that will prolly never happen how about we try and come up with ideas on how to get people back in?

What incentives can we have to get players back in and reason to group up join units?

Also where the hell has Paul gone too? His last post was on the 7th of december. Dont ya just feel the love and concern from PGI. Yes it holiday season but how hard would it be for him to take 30 secs out of his busy schedule to have said he was going to have a few weeks off over the holidays with family.

[Nightbird]

Nr1Noob, on 23 December 2018 - 01:11 AM, said:

From this I don't think there will be any type of handicaps placed into the game. So instead on dwelling on things that will prolly never happen how about we try and come up with ideas on how to get people back in?

What incentives can we have to get players back in and reason to group up join units?

Also where the hell has Paul gone too? His last post was on the 7th of december. Dont ya just feel the love and concern from PGI. Yes it holiday season but how hard would it be for him to take 30 secs out of his busy schedule to have said he was going to have a few weeks off over the holidays with family.

It's clear from the post that Paul hasn't really thought much about it.

1. Bad to limit players from using any mech they want because they're too good: It'll only happen if the teams are lopsided in strengths. It'll also give more chances to use mediums and lights as today most dropdecks are assaults and heavies plus 1 throwaway light.

2. The MM doesn't know of a team's reputation from previous wins: don't do it based on unit history, just player stats is fine. Even keeping a record of a players last 10 FP invasion games is enough IMO.

3. An average is not going to work because there are so many permutations to a player's success rating that an average will favor high skilled players because averages pull top players down and bottom players up. 4 high skilled players far outweighs the 4 lower skilled players on the team in terms of battlefield success: He answered his own question. By taking an average, we encourage skilled players to work together with unskilled players rather than creating a 12man of only skilled players. If a mixed team like this incurs a handicap, it's because the other side is much weaker.

4. Does the tonnage restriction change based on the team ranking: Of course not. Just player stats. Teams have good and bad players.

[TygerLily]

How about, each time an individual loses consecutively they gain 50 tons in their personal drop deck. Each time they win consecutively, they lose 50 tons. Maybe there can be a natural, player equilibrium?

Any tonnage no used over the baseline (the normal 250 or 265 that PGI begins each faction at) is converted to a cbill payout, win or lose. This is for those players who don't have that many Mechs.

It buffs the defeated (rather than nerfs the victors)

[Hammer Hand]

Like a lot of you, I have played CW and FW from the start. I still enjoy FW when I can get a match. I hate waiting and the unit I am in is not very active in MWO and less active in FW. Numbers of mechs and tonnage limits have been a long-running discussion with few adjustments. MW5 will be good but I think MWO will still have a place and I think FW could be huge.

Training players to play in FP is key, tactics, and builds are different. There are not many places that cover the builds that work. Different drop decks for different maps. Map control, firing angles, playing the objectives etc.

One thing I have tried to do when we/I run into an elite or unit group is changing the mission objective. If we see a clan or IS 12 man then there is a lot of chatter that we will be stomped or this will be rough. So I suggest (in coms) if we know we will lose the war how many mechs do we need to count it as a victory of us. Then as a group, we pick a number. For the sake of this post, let's say 25 kills is a win. Then we talk about how we will get the 25. Focus fire, stay together, pick your ground etc....

The best training imo is against a hostile force in a FW drop. So if we can open the lines of communication in drop between the sides that would be good. The trolls could be a problem (maybe a mute for the drop leader). If that is not possible what about at the end of the Drop the chat screen stays open longer. Say 15 mins or as long as players are talking?

Concerning "GIt Good" it is a true statement the question is how to help players "Git Good" what should they practice. What skills do they need? How do the good players process the information in their HUD? PUG drops are not a lot of help.

[Alreech]

MWOs big problem is the lack of coordination for the 12 vs 12 game mode.
And unless you drop in a 12 player premade you don't know nothing about your teammates loadout and their planned tactic.
These problems are common in all game modes, not only in Faction Warfare.
In Faction Warfare the lack of coordination just gives you the chance to get stomped longer.
Besides that Faction Warfare has no unique selling point over Solo or Group Quickplay.

Improving coordination in Faction Warfare would greatly improve the quality of the matches.
PGI should add a 13 player with access to the Battlegrid & Spectator Cam in Faction Warfare, maybe with some limited access to Artillery & UAVs, to improve coordination during the match.

[Lichtsteiner]

I would be happy with FW stat reset every month.

Map rotation that coordinates with planet level of occupation..................IE Siege maps are saved for last 10% before planet is taken.

I for one am burned out on Siege attack....................

Edited by Lichtsteiner, 26 December 2018 - 08:46 AM.

[BROARL]

i've been getting stomped for years.
i currently drop whichever side is the least busy in order to get regular games, often this means facing the teams that others seem to avoid.
i am happy so long as i am playing and i often learn more by fighting people better than myself.
my personal issue is veteran players trolling noobs as there is nothing constructive or productive that ever comes of it.
there will always be tears with the bumps and lumps but there need not be a lack of dignity.

i would rather PGI release new maps instead of spending energy on balance and handycaps and nerfs that never work.
the community stuff is up to us not PGI, we are the community, they don't even play from what i can tell...

[Nightbird]

BROARL, on 26 December 2018 - 11:26 PM, said:

i've been getting stomped for years.
my personal issue is veteran players trolling noobs as there is nothing constructive or productive that ever comes of it.
the community stuff is up to us not PGI, we are the community, they don't even play from what i can tell...

Skilled players grouping up and stomping pugs is how PGI designed this game though. This is the optimal path PGI created to taking planets, earning cbills, LP, boost stats, etc.

As far as trolling, skilled pilots don't troll pugs. The phrase small dogs bark the loudest rings true here, mediocre pilots being carried and enjoying stomp get a little hot in the head and displays that in all chat. If you check the scores afterwards, you'll see the quiet ones are actually doing the work.

[JUGMAN]

Nightbird, on 21 December 2018 - 08:19 AM, said:

This may benefit you, but why should we weaken ourselves to lose to the other 12 mans that queue up?

I agree with you. I have been on the end of getting our heads handed to us when we have a 4 man team. we cant carry hard enough. We love the 12 man setups so we actually can work as a team. To get to the level of competitive play a pilot needs to learn how to play FP. It is very different than QuickPlay. Teamwork is the key. You can not expect pilots that can shoot and play as a team disband to get swallowed up by low skilled players. I hate to say "GIT GUD" is that term that all pilots need to adhere to. I am not even close to my potential and learn from the game each time I play it.

Matchmakers by skill level has been debated in every on-line game I have played. The matchmaker will never be perfect for every level of play. The best one can hope for is a level of game play that caters to the average 50 percentile player. To make a game vialbe to the 50%, the game has to be engaging. Getting wrecked by a team like Evil, CSPS, MS or anyother high caliber team is not going to bring people to the FP game. There are changes that can be implemented that bring low skilled players to the table. They ahve been listed in prior posts.

If PGI doesnt fix this in the next year, I see this game failing completely. I really hate to see this but I see it starting its down hill slide. PGI YOU NEED TO LISTEN TO YOUR PLAYER BASE.

Nightbird, on 27 December 2018 - 11:38 AM, said:

Skilled players grouping up and stomping pugs is how PGI designed this game though. This is the optimal path PGI created to taking planets, earning cbills, LP, boost stats, etc.

As far as trolling, skilled pilots don't troll pugs. The phrase small dogs bark the loudest rings true here, mediocre pilots being carried and enjoying stomp get a little hot in the head and displays that in all chat. If you check the scores afterwards, you'll see the quiet ones are actually doing the work.

well said.

[Bishop Six]

JUGMAN, on 27 December 2018 - 12:49 PM, said:

I agree with you. I have been on the end of getting our heads handed to us when we have a 4 man team. we cant carry hard enough. We love the 12 man setups so we actually can work as a team. To get to the level of competitive play a pilot needs to learn how to play FP. It is very different than QuickPlay. Teamwork is the key. You can not expect pilots that can shoot and play as a team disband to get swallowed up by low skilled players. I hate to say "GIT GUD" is that term that all pilots need to adhere to. I am not even close to my potential and learn from the game each time I play it.

Matchmakers by skill level has been debated in every on-line game I have played. The matchmaker will never be perfect for every level of play. The best one can hope for is a level of game play that caters to the average 50 percentile player. To make a game vialbe to the 50%, the game has to be engaging. Getting wrecked by a team like Evil, CSPS, MS or anyother high caliber team is not going to bring people to the FP game. There are changes that can be implemented that bring low skilled players to the table. They ahve been listed in prior posts.

If PGI doesnt fix this in the next year, I see this game failing completely. I really hate to see this but I see it starting its down hill slide. PGI YOU NEED TO LISTEN TO YOUR PLAYER BASE.



well said.

Well spoken Jugman. I hope PGI understands soon that FP is their main core of the game, even if there are few players than in QP.

QP is quick fun and quickly over. FP is exactly what they wanted: endgame content with long time motivation. I really enjoy to see all my dudes, friend and foe, daily in FP and i am proud to say, sometimes we can manage to deliver a good fight against the elite clanners.

When they have a good time and we have a good time, everything's good

I hope PGI will get this and fulfill their promises to work on FP SOON (!)

Edited by Bishop Six, 28 December 2018 - 01:43 AM.

[Weagles]

Let’s take the conversation a new direction. How to give all pilots a new experience in FW with lower costs to PGI.

Take all the siege maps, and all the rest of the maps used for FW and give them a single existing texture and weather pattern. Repeat for all textures and weather patterns. For example Victric Forge has red glass and a blue sun and high heat no weather. It that were applied to the Boreal Vault map the play would be very different. Same to if Boreal has a forest colony look and mild climate. The Canyon maps would play differently if they had a Polar look.

The result is a complete set of maps by each texture and weather pattern. A victric planet, a polar planet, a swamp planet, a canyon planet, a moon (HPG), a sulfur planet, a forest planet, dare I ask for an urban planet.

When giving descriptions and history to planet systems (lore) add what type(s) of planets are in the system. That way if FW contests the system the map choices are limited to the planet types.

For each 8 hour contest only fight over and vote for a single system. When captured give 4 units the planet, top merc unit in votes, top 2 loyalist units in votes and the top unit left. With one system only one may a couple of planet types are involved. Makes setting up drop decks easier.

Personal request for Paul, a new planet type.

Planet Iowa.

Texture: bean fields, corn fields, terraces, pastures, and treed creeks and draws. Kick farm equipment, cows, and pigs. Occasion deer and flocks of birds. Barns, silos, and trailer parks. Liked the demo of MW5.

Weather: Norman Rockwell snow, Blinding Blizzard, Fluffy cloud summer day, rain, tornados (with cows), hail, super cells with heavy rain and lightning (great at night).

Edited by Weagles, 29 December 2018 - 12:26 PM.

[Nightbird]

Weagles, on 29 December 2018 - 12:21 PM, said:

texture

You must have missed the part where PGI said no new art assets for MWO next year. (Barring mech packs of course)

[Weagles]

OK. I can live without Planet Iowa but the other maps getting existing textures and weather is what they have already discussed with plans for some in the summer. I just would like to see them take it further, adding the newly textured maps for testing in QP up to Mechcon and then announcing at Mechcon planet dropping FW concept and having a couple of planets, polar and sulfur to be traditional and that they would be happening early in 2020 not September.

[Peter2k]

JUGMAN, on 27 December 2018 - 12:49 PM, said:

PGI YOU NEED TO LISTEN TO YOUR PLAYER BASE.

What maybe gets me personally the most is that Russ/Paul/Chris will always say in every Podcast or roundtable how much they listen to the players, only to implement features the players wanted in the most mediocre way.

Shrugs, I think its basically over.
We all wait for what PGI wants to do with MWO/MW5 in the future, and resources will be allocated accordingly.

All of this FP improvements amount to little more than a few xml changes and map reworks are not slated to arrive or even worked on any time soon.
And the whole idea was easy and fast ideas.

Man if I could sell at work something fast and easy to take half a year or so

Nightbird, on 29 December 2018 - 12:44 PM, said:

mech packs of course

Man I can't wait , finally some content.

Now if PGI could churn out a patch that doesn't mess up something completely unrelated to the patch, or the dozen patches before or after


Also "classic" maps are coming, AFTER FP stuff, sooo July?
And then maybe re skinned maps? Like MechCon 2019?

Yay for all the "new" content

Edited by Peter2k, 31 December 2018 - 02:22 PM.

[Tesunie]

Paul Inouye, on 06 December 2018 - 11:18 AM, said:

C-bill transfer between players.

I just want to say, please don't. Not unless you have really increased account security.

As much as I would love to give stuff to friends, I can see the "gold" farmer accounts starting up... Not being able to trade nor give keeps this game safe from a lot of potential problems.

[Vectoron The Black Minister]

Hello MechWarrriors and Hello PGI!

I think the best way to anyones heart is through the stomach! C-Bills and Other Items! Check out some of these starting suggestions!

• Allow units to donate a total of 5-20 million C-bills to pilots (number of pilots able to receive bonus uncapped) in their unit. (Pilots may only receive a total of 5-20 million c-bills a week from Unit Coffers.)
  
• Pilots must spend at least 25 Million C-bills before they are permitted to donate to their unit. This is to prevent players form using cadet bonuses as a means of gaming the system.

Adding ways to distribute or use the C-bills inside of unit coffers would allow unit members to be rewarded for their hard work. This change would also give a reason for pilots who are sitting on piles of C-Bills to keep grinding in order to help their fellow unit members.


I have more suggestions on how to get more activity, participation, and incentives into the game that would benefit everyone! I'd really like to start here though, and I would love to hear from the community. Thank you for your time!

Sincerely,
Vectoron

CLARIFICATION EDIT: The numbers are an idea or starting point. Not completely set in stone, just an offering to PGI.

EDIT: Clarified bullet One.

Edited by Vectoron The Black Minister, 02 January 2019 - 07:30 AM.

[J a y]

Vectoron The Black Minister, on 01 January 2019 - 05:14 PM, said:

Hello MechWarrriors and Hello PGI!

I think the best way to anyones heart is through the stomach! C-Bills and Other Items! Check out some of these starting suggestions!

• Allow units to distribute a total of 5-20 million c-bills a week between any number of pilots (number of pilots able to receive bonus uncapped) in their unit.
  
• Pilots must spend at least 25 Million C-bills before they are permitted to donate to their unit. This is to prevent players form using cadet bonuses as a means of gaming the system.

Adding ways to distribute or use the C-bills inside of unit coffers would allow unit members to be rewarded for their hard work. This change would also give a reason for pilots who are sitting on piles of C-Bills to keep grinding in order to help their fellow unit members.


I have more suggestions on how to get more activity, participation, and incentives into the game that would benefit everyone! I'd really like to start here though, and I would love to hear from the community. Thank you for your time!

Sincerely,
Vectoron

@ PGI do it please ill buy you dinner

[T e c h 4 9]

I play FP regularly with my team, and I'm no expert player. There are tons of good ideas that have been pitched by various players in the community. Personally, I think Kanajashi brings up some good points/ideas in this video on YT:

Paul: if you haven't watched this video, please do. it's 45 minutes (-ish) - you could watch it over lunch. Not that implementing these ideas would "Fix" FP altogether, but they would certainly help. Of course, there are many other valid ideas that would improve FP as well, as well as add some "depth" to the game. Ultimately though, for most (casual, non-hardcore) players, gameplay is more important. Let's face it, most players just wanna blow some mechs up.

Thanks, and Happy New Year everyone!