107 replies to this topic

[Maugged]

I've had two games today as an assault where charlie lance pushed forward the nascar way while the rest stayed behind and got wiped out then ranted about nascar hahaha.

[Athom83]

Maugged, on 13 January 2019 - 05:04 PM, said:

I've had two games today as an assault where charlie lance pushed forward the nascar way while the rest stayed behind and got wiped out then ranted about nascar hahaha.

Protip from someone who uses a LOT of assaults; If you don't want to get stomped by the enemy NASCAR, lead your own team's NASCAR in a 100t assault.

[ShiverMeRivets]

Athom83, on 13 January 2019 - 09:21 PM, said:

Protip from someone who uses a LOT of assaults; If you don't want to get stomped by the enemy NASCAR, lead your own team's NASCAR in a 100t assault.

At 48 kph.

[Storming Angel]

You could always you know.

Protect the biggest hitters on your team, I mean if you cant adapt in some of fastest mechs in the game then you might as well not even bother.

also don't whinge when you lose the game because you wanted to play mw5 in mwo.

[MrXanthios]

Mister Glitchdragon, on 11 January 2019 - 12:51 PM, said:

1) Sacrifice some tonnage for speed. If you can't do at least sixty in the solo queue, you'd better be really good at what you do. Some are: I've seen ANHs and CPs come trudging in late and totally wreck the enemy when it seemed all was lost. If that's you, than by all means, carry on (and thanks for saving the day!). But far more often, I don't see my team's ANHs and CPs anywhere except on the end-of-game scorecard, with double-digit damage. Be honest with yourself: If you can't ever seem to put all those guns you're lugging around on a small and fast harasser, you either need a bigger engine or you need a smaller, faster mech.

I mean, if you don't do at least 1k dmg every single game with a paypnir, with those 4 lb10x and 90 degrees per second of torso twisting, agility nowhere to be seen in the majority of the other assaults, then it's either time to change your mech class or uninstall the game.

[Athom83]

ShiverMeRivets, on 14 January 2019 - 12:28 AM, said:

At 48 kph.

Altas with a 350-360 engine, Kodiak with a 375-400 engine.

[Kubernetes]

Athom83, on 13 January 2019 - 09:21 PM, said:

Protip from someone who uses a LOT of assaults; If you don't want to get stomped by the enemy NASCAR, lead your own team's NASCAR in a 100t assault.

This happens way more in my experience than people want to admit. Me, in my 57kph Victor, engaging while 400m ahead of my team: "Where tf is everyone and why is my slow assault alone at the front?"

[General Solo]

@OP Like the Title
I think the advice is solid for the intended audience

Quick plays not so organised as GQ , FW or comp right.

Ever try to get solo pugs to make a firing line....what a joke, works maybe 1%

I'm sure vast majority who complain about NASCAR arn't in the top 10%, so noice post

I frankly get annoyed with not so good assault pilots too and have no problem ditching them if it means winning.
Guess wot, they win too

ShiverMeRivets, on 14 January 2019 - 12:28 AM, said:

At 48 kph.

With garbage team it happens alot from experience

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 14 February 2019 - 09:38 AM.

[General Solo]

Grus, on 11 January 2019 - 01:30 PM, said:

You're sacrificing a bunch of your weight and firepower when you nascar. isnt recorded in jarle's

When four assault mechs split up or take 3 minutes to kill a target you sacrifice nothing

In fact your doing them a favor and getting the win

Two teams nascar one team wins - Solo Queue Proverb

Is that nascars fault

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 14 February 2019 - 09:39 AM.

[VonBruinwald]

OZHomerOZ, on 14 February 2019 - 09:09 AM, said:

Quick plays not so organised as GQ , FW or comp right.

Every try to get solo pugs to make a firing line....what a joke, works maybe 1%

I think what's worse is the guys on comms who disparage plans but offer no alternatives.

I don't use comms, but I'll happily take commander, pop a few markers, set my throttle and type a basic plan out en route to the first marker for people to follow. Then inevitably some guy with comms weighs in "that's stupid, let's go F4 instead"... one of three things normally follows.

• People ignore voice guy, I keep popping orders. He shuts up for the rest of the match. If we lose he blames me, if we win he says nothing...
  
• A couple of guys go his way and ignore the rest of the pack, they get cut taken out relatively quickly. I keep issuing orders the rest of us fight. Sometimes we win, sometimes we lose, but we're organised and that makes a big difference.
  
• I yield command to him. We go his way, he says nothing for the rest of the match. Sometimes, if we win he'llsays it's because we did it his way.

If you're going pug don't be afraid to take commander and drop some markers, you'll be surprised how many people follow those orders until someone else chimes in. Just don't forget to update those markers throughout the match. If you struggle to keep on top of them once you've engaged the enemy, remove them entirely once you're in position. If you can at least get your team in a good starting position you've done more than most.

[General Solo]

VonBruinwald, on 14 February 2019 - 09:31 AM, said:

I think what's worse is the guys on comms who disparage plans but offer no alternatives.

So true, talk about sowing confusion and tankin morale

Give an alternative solution that people actually respond to, (check mini map) then its no problem

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 14 February 2019 - 09:38 AM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

To the OP.

How about light and fast mechs adpating? This is the attitude that drives me crazy. Its saying, "We are going to do what we want to do and the hell with you". There is no dialog back on what you can do the solve the issue, it is always, "Play a Faster Mech if you have a problem". I mean I proposed a plan where Charlie Lance would always spawn on the right side of the map and be moved significantly forward toward the areas on the map where the battles usually take place. This has zero effect on the lights being able to NASCAR except moving them out of their prime starting location that allows them to immediately pounce on Assault mechs struggling to keep up but all I generally got was "Hell no" and "Drive a faster Mech" out of it. Drive a faster mech isn't a solution. Telling Assault mech pilots they are straight garbage isn't a solution. Telling them to adapt, quit or cry isn't a solution.

Also you mention being a screen. That isn't what your there for either. Your not there to just get shot up by the enemy before the Assaults arrive. Your early role is to find where the enemy is at, announce this to the team, harass the enemy if you can without taking catastropic damage and if someone is a straggler and you can safely do it, take the mech out or prevent him from joining his team. Then once the battle is joined, fall back and support the rest of your team by keeping the enemy lights off their *** and adding damage and confusion where ever you can. There is nothing wrong with flanking the enemy and turning their attention away from your assault and heavy mechs but you don't leave your team behind. You don't run the hell off as fast as you can sacrificing you Assault mechs.

P.S. I play lights and/or fast medium mechs too. I also Flank but I never completely leave my team behind. I try to look at the minimap and see where best I could help the team win, especially with an eye on taking out or driving off enemy lights and surprisingly my kill counts, performance and damage done is always respectable. You can do it to if you you want to. NASCAR isn't the end all, be all of everything for a fast mech.

[PhilTKaswahl]

In a situation where the team ends up with slow assaults and the fast ones can't be bothered to not slow down even when the team is being spread thin, it's the latter that's clearly refusing to adapt to the tactical capabilities of his own team, willing to sacrifice the most armor and firepower carrying weight on the team, and is thus the most willing to put their chance at victory almost entirely dependent on the incompetence of the enemy.

There's hot garbage alright, and it's not OP's strawman Charlie Lance.

Edited by PhilTKaswahl, 14 February 2019 - 09:59 AM.

[LordNothing]

taters flock to assaults thinking they will do better. lol. feed the squirrels.

[BlueStrat]

Unnatural Growth, on 11 January 2019 - 02:53 PM, said:

Wut?




Wut?

Normally the only time I see "nascar" being an issue with assaults, is when you have a few assaults on your team that don't frikkin start moving when the match starts. Why is it always the assault drivers that sit there fingering their exhaust ports and picking lint out of their belly buttons?

When the match starts, get going. Usually at least some of the heavies and mediums will sweep through your lance and pick you up. But if you're just sitting there making bunny shapes out of clouds, well then, bye bye.

I've noticed the last few weeks that at drop, sometimes the game 'hangs'' and I'm stuck in the dropship for anywhere from 30 seconds to almost a minute after everyone else has already dropped. When it does finally drop my 'mech it appears to fall in slow motion from a great height (scared the crap outta me the first couple times!).

This never used to happen, nothing changed on my end. It's caused me to get farmed by lights several times, being left behind by the team.

You're right that often it's just people being inattentive, but not always.

Edited by BlueStrat, 14 February 2019 - 01:36 PM.

[Potatomasher69]

I play a lot of assaults. I'm not gonna pretend to be good but sometimes I feel like, when I'm in a fat mech and the nascar has caught up to me, it's now my job to turn around and try and stall them, perhaps gib an over zealous light/medium, or at least deadside someone.

[Xiphias]

Angel of Annihilation, on 14 February 2019 - 09:42 AM, said:

How about light and fast mechs adpating? This is the attitude that drives me crazy. Its saying, "We are going to do what we want to do and the hell with you".

How is this any different from assaults saying the team should revolve around them? Lights aren't asking the team to play differently, they adapt based on how the match plays. Assaults on the other hand are constantly whining and trying to tell the rest of their team how to play so that they can be protected better.

Quote

I mean I proposed a plan where Charlie Lance would always spawn on the right side of the map and be moved significantly forward toward the areas on the map where the battles usually take place.

I really don't care which spawn the assaults start in. However, in the majority of cases it's not going to matter because it is poor gameplay, rather than poor spawn location that causes assaults to get left behind. If moving the spawns fixes the few cases where it isn't the assaults' fault I'm all for it, but it's not going to be the panacea you think it is.

As has been stated other places, good assaults rarely get left behind and are the highest performing class. If it was a widespread issue I would be all for fixing the problem, but it isn't. When I play assaults I often find myself at the front of the nascar because I play aggressively and path well. It's a mindset problem, not a speed problem.

Quote

Telling them to adapt, quit or cry isn't a solution.

Why not? It's on each individual player to adapt to the game as is. I don't expect my team to conform to whatever playstyle I choose. When I build a mech in the mechlab I go in fully understanding the consequences of my choices. If a build doesn't work I either adjust how I play or I adjust the build, I don't expect the team to cater to my limitations.

As above, if there are plenty of players that are able to take slow assaults and keep up with the team then it is absolutely fair to tell players they need to adapt if they are getting left behind. You can either pilot better to not get left behind, or if you can't improve your piloting then perhaps you shouldn't be taking really slow mechs.

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Then once the battle is joined, fall back and support the rest of your team by keeping the enemy lights off their *** and adding damage and confusion where ever you can.

There's a really common misconception that lights should be keeping lights off of the back of bigger mechs. That's not the role of lights. Lights should be finding crit/isolated targets and killing them off. Lights aren't usually able to kill other lights quickly, however heavier mechs can easily cripple or open a light in a single shot. On the other side lights can kill large mechs from behind faster than other large mechs can kill them from the front. Even if a light doesn't kill a mech they pull more firepower away from the line by distracting them.

Quote

You don't run the hell off as fast as you can sacrificing you Assault mechs.

What if sacrificing (bad) assaults is the best way to win a match? Isn't the best team decision to let the few die so that the many can win? My experience is that the assaults that are good are able to keep up with the team, while the ones that get left behind tend to be less useful. If I save an assault who then does 200 damage it's a net loss for the team if I could have done 400 damage in the same time.

[Wil McCullough]

Lol this is why lights are the ultimate wet nurses in this game. They have to take care of small children and big babies.

You have to hold your assault's hand to the front line, scout forward, harass the enemy backline, provide a screen for your fatties, fight off enemy lights, stay in the dom circle and cap points in conquest.

You could take out 4 enemy assaults by your lonesome and according to your <100 damage assaults, it's still your fault that your team lost.

[Jman5]

Xiphias, on 14 February 2019 - 02:26 PM, said:

I really don't care which spawn the assaults start in. However, in the majority of cases it's not going to matter because it is poor gameplay, rather than poor spawn location that causes assaults to get left behind. If moving the spawns fixes the few cases where it isn't the assaults' fault I'm all for it, but it's not going to be the panacea you think it is.

If Viktor Drake actually got his way and PGI just made every charlie lance spawn on the right-most spawn location, it would be a complete disaster for the assaults on several maps where this isn't the case. Canyon Network (skirmish) is a great example. It would put the Assaults on the south side right next to the enemy Light lance. This is why I attempted to get specifics from him in his last thread.

Quote

As has been stated other places, good assaults rarely get left behind and are the highest performing class. If it was a widespread issue I would be all for fixing the problem, but it isn't. When I play assaults I often find myself at the front of the nascar because I play aggressively and path well. It's a mindset problem, not a speed problem. Why not? It's on each individual player to adapt to the game as is. I don't expect my team to conform to whatever playstyle I choose. When I build a mech in the mechlab I go in fully understanding the consequences of my choices. If a build doesn't work I either adjust how I play or I adjust the build, I don't expect the team to cater to my limitations. As above, if there are plenty of players that are able to take slow assaults and keep up with the team then it is absolutely fair to tell players they need to adapt if they are getting left behind. You can either pilot better to not get left behind, or if you can't improve your piloting then perhaps you shouldn't be taking really slow mechs.

So, aside from Mechwarrior Online, I really don't play many shooter-type games. I have mostly played RTS and 4X strategy games. Whenever I see these NASCAR threads I'm constantly reminded of the threads from those games where people complain about how there is nothing they can do to counter early game harassment and rushes. Good players will chime in saying "well actually if you build your base like this, if you don't just try to fast-tech to late game without any defense, and scout the enemy for the rush, you can counter it."

This is followed up by, them saying "No, no, no it's too hard to counter the early game rush, NERRRRRRRRRF!"

In both the cases it all comes down to the player acknowledging the problem, adapting to counter their opponents plans, and not doing bone-headed things like fast teching to late game without building any defense.

[General Solo]

Seen a guy afk at spawn because HPG nascar

Threw his team under a bus coz he dont like nascar

Seen similar things on when Polar first come out as well (YOLO)

Outright refusal to acknowledge

Refusal to adapt, basically having a tantrum

Edited by OZHomerOZ, 14 February 2019 - 09:02 PM.