47 replies to this topic

[Darian DelFord]

I have finally captured the essence of the OP cries by assaults everywhere in regards to how OP lights are,

[DisasterTheory]

Nice video, but where are the Pir, Arctic Cheetah and wolf Hound? You know... the light mechs that are a problem?

[BrunoSSace]

Lights are not the problem. Assaults boating LRMs without back up weapons, then crying about lights are.

Why cant I use my medium Lrm boat anymore? Because 20 missles get shot down to quicly. I use to beable to do thousands of damage, now I can't pull more then 300 cause the amount of tripple ams boats is ridiculous. Plus PGI gave out a free one.

[chuck mcgills space blanket]

BLOODREDSINGLE, on 25 January 2019 - 10:49 PM, said:

Nice video, but where are the Pir, Arctic Cheetah and wolf Hound? You know... the light mechs that are a problem?

Arctic Cheetah? Haven't heard that one in a while. I think a "Lights are OP, Nerf Now" file from 2015 was inadvertently used in the creation of this whine.

[Darian DelFord]

Apparently Bloodredsingle has not seen what I can do in a flea or a locust if he does not think those are a problem

[El Bandito]

Why are people surprised by this? Everyone should know that Lights < Mediums < Heavies <Assaults < Lights. It is a proper rock-paper-scissors situation.

Now if Lights constantly manage to beat the crap out of Mediums packing Streaks/SRMs/MPLs/MLs, then we have a problem.

Edited by El Bandito, 26 January 2019 - 05:27 AM.

[Yiryi-Sa]

BrunoSSace, on 25 January 2019 - 11:09 PM, said:

Why cant I use my medium Lrm boat anymore? Because 20 missles get shot down to quicly.

Wait... players use AMS?! I've advocating for players do so for a while now...

[Darian DelFord]

Just so this does not turn into a fest..... This is a sarcastic post ;pp

[Mystere]

Darian DelFord, on 26 January 2019 - 05:33 AM, said:

Just so this does not turn into a fest..... This is a sarcastic post ;pp

Too late.

[Warning incoming Humble Dexterer]

BLOODREDSINGLE, on 25 January 2019 - 10:49 PM, said:

Nice video, but where are the Pir, Arctic Cheetah and wolf Hound? You know... the light mechs that are a problem?

There's only one good clan light brawler, that's why it stand outs so much. you meant : The Pir, Wolf Hound, and the other half dozen good IS lights

[BlueStrat]

The problem (in solo-QP) as I see it is not so much lights being OP (tho the PIR pushes the envelope hard) it's that the game design assumes that the slower, less agile thus vulnerable assaults will receive support from the team, which everyone knows is a rarity in solo-QP. It certainly doesn't help matters that the low player population means that most of the time all PSR tiers are mixed together and seemingly often not divided equally between teams.

[Variant1]

El Bandito, on 26 January 2019 - 05:26 AM, said:

Why are people surprised by this? Everyone should know that Lights < Mediums < Heavies <Assaults < Lights. It is a proper rock-paper-scissors situation.

Now if Lights constantly manage to beat the crap out of Mediums packing Streaks/SRMs/MPLs/MLs, then we have a problem.

False, no class counters the other. The only difference between classes is weight and armor with lights having less armor/firepower but being the fastest and heavier classes being slower but more firepower

Any class can kill any other class it all comes down to skill and builds

[El Bandito]

Variant1, on 26 January 2019 - 09:56 PM, said:

False, no class counters the other. The only difference between classes is weight and armor with lights having less armor/firepower but being the fastest and heavier classes being slower but more firepower

Any class can kill any other class it all comes down to skill and builds

Of course skill and build matters, only an idiot would not think so. In general though, I stand by my previous comment.

Edited by El Bandito, 27 January 2019 - 02:56 AM.

[InspectorG]

BlueStrat, on 26 January 2019 - 09:54 PM, said:

The problem (in solo-QP) as I see it is not so much lights being OP (tho the PIR pushes the envelope hard) it's that the game design assumes that the slower, less agile thus vulnerable assaults will receive support from the team, which everyone knows is a rarity in solo-QP. It certainly doesn't help matters that the low player population means that most of the time all PSR tiers are mixed together and seemingly often not divided equally between teams.

The larger problem is not even that. The game has a skill gap that most players will never reach let alone cross. Either due to inability, or lack of care due to casual play.

Situational Awareness is whats missing, and there isnt even a tutorial about it. The other missing tutorial is about concentrated-focused-fire in a zero-sum game.

Players simply do not look at their minmap, they dont try to conceptualize whats happening in the match. They just NASCAR or Camp. They do not know the maps well enough to guesstimate opponent behavior to get/force free trades. They dont view teammates as a resource that is non-renewable. Hell, they dont even use comms and im pretty sure at least half dont read messages.

And, this wont get fixed. Its just what it is.

Group or FW is where teamwork happens, and from what i hear, requires practice.

[OrmsbyGore]

BlueStrat, on 26 January 2019 - 09:54 PM, said:

The problem (in solo-QP) as I see it is not so much lights being OP (tho the PIR pushes the envelope hard) it's that the game design assumes that the slower, less agile thus vulnerable assaults will receive support from the team, which everyone knows is a rarity in solo-QP. It certainly doesn't help matters that the low player population means that most of the time all PSR tiers are mixed together and seemingly often not divided equally between teams.

engine desync was also a factor; now my 350+ engine doesn't help me twist to track lights, and some of them are so small that they don't even appear on screen when they leg hump

[Darian DelFord]

OrmsbyGore, on 27 January 2019 - 09:20 AM, said:

engine desync was also a factor; now my 350+ engine doesn't help me twist to track lights, and some of them are so small that they don't even appear on screen when they leg hump

This hurt lights almost as bad as it did assault mechs

[Prototelis]

It hurt lights a lot more.

Those accel bonuses are critical to shoot and scoot maneuvers.

Almost every global nerf targeted at assault and heavy mechs has had a bigger effect on light mechs.

[Khobai]

El Bandito, on 26 January 2019 - 05:26 AM, said:

Why are people surprised by this? Everyone should know that Lights < Mediums < Heavies <Assaults < Lights. It is a proper rock-paper-scissors situation.

Now if Lights constantly manage to beat the crap out of Mediums packing Streaks/SRMs/MPLs/MLs, then we have a problem.

except lights shouldnt counter assaults if assaults cost 100 drop tonnage and lights only cost at most 35. if youre only paying 1/3rd the cost you shouldnt be able to counter an assault.

its no surprise you rarely see assaults in gamemodes with drop tonnage. because theyre unfairly punished by the whole drop tonnage system.

they need to get rid of drop tonnage and replace it with a proper point system instead. drop tonnage doesnt accurately reflect the power level of mechs. but a point system would.

itd be okay for lights to counter assaults if lights and assaults were actually costed proportional to their power level.

Edited by Khobai, 27 January 2019 - 11:53 AM.

[Shadowomega1]

El Bandito, on 26 January 2019 - 05:26 AM, said:

Why are people surprised by this? Everyone should know that Lights < Mediums < Heavies <Assaults < Lights. It is a proper rock-paper-scissors situation.

Now if Lights constantly manage to beat the crap out of Mediums packing Streaks/SRMs/MPLs/MLs, then we have a problem.

Sadly I have been seeing great anti light medium mechs, even with anti light weapons, ignore light mechs going for their teams assaults, while going for the enemies team's assaults while whining the assaults are not there to back them up.

[dario03]

Khobai, on 27 January 2019 - 11:51 AM, said:

except lights shouldnt counter assaults if assaults cost 100 drop tonnage and lights only cost at most 35. if youre only paying 1/3rd the cost you shouldnt be able to counter an assault.

its no surprise you rarely see assaults in gamemodes with drop tonnage. because theyre unfairly punished by the whole drop tonnage system.

they need to get rid of drop tonnage and replace it with a proper point system instead. drop tonnage doesnt accurately reflect the power level of mechs. but a point system would.

itd be okay for lights to counter assaults if lights and assaults were actually costed proportional to their power level.

You don't pay a third the cost of an assault if you take a light. In most modes you get one mech, doesn't matter if its a light or assault. And in FP with 4 mechs you still only get 4 mechs no matter what mechs you take, you don't get extra mechs if you take a light or even go in at minimum weight.
And how are assaults punished in tonnage drops? By having to take lights to fit?