116 replies to this topic

[GeminiWolf]

[K O Z A K]

When comparing it to the IS whammer it's actually not so bad. Is whammer just shields so well despite that width because of it's agility, hopefully this will be similar

Gargles is basically a slightly up armoured clan heavy, it runs like a clan heavy, it has agility and firepower of a clan heavy, and the size of a clan heavy. It's basically a non ecm 80 ton hellbringer

[Angel of Annihilation]

Y E O N N E, on 12 February 2019 - 08:29 PM, said:

You need to both look again and remember that the IS Warhammer will be smaller.

Also, is that you, Viktor Drake?

75 tons vs 80 tons so it should be less of a difference in size than between the Marauder and Marauder IIC and the size difference between those two mechs isn't all that noticeable. At 5 tons difference, you shouldn't be able to even notice the difference in size unless the two mechs were standing side by side.

Now of course this is PGI's scaling we are talking about which apparently uses advances mathematics only available in the year 3055 because it tends not to conform to any math known today. Still I think once the mech scale screenshots come out, it will be pretty close to the same width as the original Warhammer. I think it is taller or the upper arms are shorter because on the Warhammer, its arms are definitely waist height. On the image of the Warhammer IIC, those arms seem to be well above the waist, more similar to the way the Night Gyr's arms are positioned. If so, that will be a nice bonus.

And to answer your last question. Yes, Victor Drake here. I guess I got a distinctive writing style or maybe distinctive opinions or something hehe. Anyway, was drinking one night, noticed I had a free name change token and thought "Angel of Annihilation" sounded cool <sigh>. On hindsight I miss my old name.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Hazeclaw, on 12 February 2019 - 08:40 PM, said:

When comparing it to the IS whammer it's actually not so bad. Is whammer just shields so well despite that width because of it's agility, hopefully this will be similar

Yeah your right. One thing that the IS tends to always have as an advantage compared to the Clan is agility and that could definitely be a factor in how well the Warhammer IIC fares. If they bind the Warhammer IIC up with a poor mobility profile and slow torso twist, then the Warhammer IIC will have issues because lets face it, the IS Warhammer does have a pretty wide profile.

[FLG 01]

PGI does tend to make Mechs wide. It is just that some assault Mechs were fortunate enough to escape that fate, most notably the Mad Cat MkII. Other were less lucky, like the Nightstar (a very slim Mech with minimal frontal profile originally, turned into two walking barndoors).

80t Mechs in particular are not known for being slim. Zeus, Victor, Awesome...

[WrathOfDeadguy]

Angel of Annihilation, on 12 February 2019 - 08:48 PM, said:

75 tons vs 80 tons

Correction: 70 tons vs 80 tons. The IS Warhammer is a 70-tonner. The WHM-IIC is exactly as much heavier than the WHM as the MAD-IIC is to the MAD. Hopefully, that means the WHM-IIC will keep the WHM's hitboxes the same way the MAD-IIC kept the MAD's.

It could strike a good balance between the GAR's mobility and stronger weapon loadouts (with the hero and early adopter variants in particular able to run dual large ballistics plus ample backups on a 350-375XL), but it could also just be an easily parted barn door if it's too tall and wide. This thing is really going to live or die based on scaling. I'm thinking that if it's got about the same frontal profile as a Zeus, it'll be OK, but if it ends up as wide as the Awesome it'll be a failboat and need a bunch of quirks that- let's face it- a Clan Battlemech is not going to get on release day.

[CanadianCyrus]

WrathOfDeadguy, on 12 February 2019 - 10:19 PM, said:

Correction: 70 tons vs 80 tons. The IS Warhammer is a 70-tonner. The WHM-IIC is exactly as much heavier than the WHM as the MAD-IIC is to the MAD. Hopefully, that means the WHM-IIC will keep the WHM's hitboxes the same way the MAD-IIC kept the MAD's.

It could strike a good balance between the GAR's mobility and stronger weapon loadouts (with the hero and early adopter variants in particular able to run dual large ballistics plus ample backups on a 350-375XL), but it could also just be an easily parted barn door if it's too tall and wide. This thing is really going to live or die based on scaling. I'm thinking that if it's got about the same frontal profile as a Zeus, it'll be OK, but if it ends up as wide as the Awesome it'll be a failboat and need a bunch of quirks that- let's face it- a Clan Battlemech is not going to get on release day.

Tell that to the Kodiak on release day

[Prototelis]

Angel of Annihilation, on 12 February 2019 - 08:48 PM, said:

Yes, Victor Drake here. I guess I got a distinctive writing

Yes, you toss big salads without any content.

[Angel of Annihilation]

WrathOfDeadguy, on 12 February 2019 - 10:19 PM, said:

Correction: 70 tons vs 80 tons. The IS Warhammer is a 70-tonner. The WHM-IIC is exactly as much heavier than the WHM as the MAD-IIC is to the MAD. Hopefully, that means the WHM-IIC will keep the WHM's hitboxes the same way the MAD-IIC kept the MAD's.

It could strike a good balance between the GAR's mobility and stronger weapon loadouts (with the hero and early adopter variants in particular able to run dual large ballistics plus ample backups on a 350-375XL), but it could also just be an easily parted barn door if it's too tall and wide. This thing is really going to live or die based on scaling. I'm thinking that if it's got about the same frontal profile as a Zeus, it'll be OK, but if it ends up as wide as the Awesome it'll be a failboat and need a bunch of quirks that- let's face it- a Clan Battlemech is not going to get on release day.

Yeah your right, it is 10 tons but that still is only a 12.5% increase in size or about the same different in size as a Marauder IIC is to a Marauder. If they just make it 12.5% bigger in all dimensions, then it won't have much perceptible size difference over the current Warhammer. However I guess they could just add all the extra mass into torso and stretch it very wide if they wanted to. However from looking at the images I don't think that is the case.

Funzo, on 12 February 2019 - 11:13 PM, said:

Tell that to the Kodiak on release day

The Kodiak is WHY the Clan Battlemechs barely get any quirks are release date. PGI decide to never make a mistake like that again.

[B L O O D W I T C H]

Imo, i think it looks okay.
I am more concerned about the missile pods. Like the Warhammer, it's super weird that replacing the 1 ton MG with a 18 ton LB-20-X doesn't add anything to the geometry, but adding a 1 ton srm 2 ups the sidetorso by about 40%. Not to speak about lrm15/20 missilepods.
I don't usually put any sort of missiles on a normal warhammer, but on the IIC i probably want to try out ATM and i think it will totally screw over the geometry much like on a hellbringer or timberwolf.

Edited by Toha Heavy Industries, 13 February 2019 - 01:27 PM.

[Grus]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 13 February 2019 - 01:27 PM, said:

Imo, i think it looks okay.
I am more concerned about the missile pods. Like the Warhammer, it's super weird that replacing the 1 ton MG with a 18 ton LB-20-X doesn't add anything to the geometry, but adding a 1 ton srm 2 ups the sidetorso by about 40%. Not to speak about lrm15/20 missilepods.
I don't usually put any sort of missiles on a normal warhammer, but on the IIC i probably want to try out ATM and i think it will totally screw over the geometry much like on a hellbringer or timberwolf.

Its gonna be a THICK boy with missle pods...

[Acersecomic]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 13 February 2019 - 01:27 PM, said:

Imo, i think it looks okay.
I am more concerned about the missile pods. Like the Warhammer, it's super weird that replacing the 1 ton MG with a 18 ton LB-20-X doesn't add anything to the geometry, but adding a 1 ton srm 2 ups the sidetorso by about 40%. Not to speak about lrm15/20 missilepods.
I don't usually put any sort of missiles on a normal warhammer, but on the IIC i probably want to try out ATM and i think it will totally screw over the geometry much like on a hellbringer or timberwolf.

Which is why we need separate health and hitboxes for the ears.

[B L O O D W I T C H]

Acersecomic, on 14 February 2019 - 04:36 AM, said:

Which is why we need separate health and hitboxes for the ears.

How to implement, tho. Can't just add "ghost armor" TM (ya i said it first). Subtracting some armor of the ST and/or arm doesn't work either. Damage reduction for the missile pods is also toast.

[Acersecomic]

Toha Heavy Industries, on 14 February 2019 - 05:41 AM, said:

How to implement, tho. Can't just add &quot;ghost armor&quot; TM (ya i said it first). Subtracting some armor of the ST and/or arm doesn't work either. Damage reduction for the missile pods is also toast.

Ya didn't say it first, I heard the argument before when I suggested this.
Just give it quirk armor and structure (ghost, yes), less than what would be on regular bodypart but still better than losing a whole torso because someone shot your ear off.
Think of it like an omnipod with quirks.
If a mech has ears for missile pods, include it like a pseudo-omnipod module with quirks that takes up structure space or something, into which you can install missile ear weapons.

Edited by Acersecomic, 14 February 2019 - 06:28 AM.

[Grus]

Didn't mw4 do this?

[Acersecomic]

Grus, on 14 February 2019 - 07:44 AM, said:

Didn't mw4 do this?

Yes it did. It had separate ear hitboxes as well as a superior hp display both in mech display and detailed bar display. God I love it more than what MWO has.
Really do not understand why it is not the case in MWO especially! due to aiming accuracy of players vs bots.

Edited by Acersecomic, 14 February 2019 - 07:49 AM.

[FuzzyNova]

When the heck are we getting our Free Warhammer IIC? Isnt it supposed to be any day now?

[FupDup]

FuzzyNova, on 14 February 2019 - 11:54 AM, said:

When the heck are we getting our Free Warhammer IIC? Isnt it supposed to be any day now?

The holiday hero will be given on the same day as the preorder package Wallhammer IICs. You're not getting it before people who preordered the gundam.

[Angel of Annihilation]

FuzzyNova, on 14 February 2019 - 11:54 AM, said:

When the heck are we getting our Free Warhammer IIC? Isnt it supposed to be any day now?

Tuesday, Feb 18th, the same day that those who pre-ordered received theirs.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Prototelis, on 13 February 2019 - 09:11 AM, said:

Yes, you toss big salads without any content.

Hey there, that isn't nice. I can't help if some people don't like onions, tomatoes, carrots, and croutons on their salad. It is not my fault if they pick out all the important items and throw them away.