60 replies to this topic

[Papaspud]

Hahahaha, if you think it is bad now, wait until you pass 60..... you will wish you had those lightning fast 40 year old reflexes, and it doesn't get better as you age.

Now get off my lawn.......

[Bud Crue]

Thorqemada, on 08 August 2019 - 08:56 AM, said:

I do so - ofc you can play in all kind of certain ways but that is only ok as long as you do not win in a way the vocal egozentric minority believes does not fit the spirit of the true pure skill.

If you do they will use all their vocal force to threw any disturbing playstyle under the bus for obviously being op and unblanced and not skillful etc.

As long til it suddenly becomes their favourite playstyle and unsurprisingly everything very unsuddenly becomes totally blaanced and sklillful and it never was a Problem at all.

And you end up where MWO currently is...

Streaks went through such an cycle for example...

Bah.

Lets look at your streak example:
Since January of 2018: first they had their distribution pattern changed to focus on the CT and then spread to adjacent components bell curve style, then the next month they had their spread changes to focus on torso components. In July they had a bit of a mixed bag nerf/buff to the 6es (heat reduced, heat penalty increased, cool down increased). In August came the “big” change to all the lock on weapons with the reduced reticle area business, also Streaks got a mild velocity buff. In November the 2s had their heat reduced, and this last April they all got health buffs.

IMHO, the majority of those changes made Streak use more reasonable if not more effective. Yes the “big” aiming window change was a hit for those of us with not very steady hands (slowly raises shaky hand), but that detrimental aspect is one that applies to ALL lock on weapons, not just streaks, and as far as I can tell all of those weapons (especially ATMs) are still prevalent in my matches, including streaks.

But even if we accept that the above changes are a collective nerf to Streaks and a detriment to those that might utilize them, where in the written record (here, reddit, twitter, etc.) were any of them being demanded by some cabal of “vocal egocentric” players you mention above?

But lets also not ignore that over that same period (January of 2018 until now) nearly every weapon in the game has been changed (more often than not nerfed) to an extent as great if not greater to the changes made to streaks.

So again, I just don’t see MWO (or some aspect of its community) being intolerant of various play styles, etc. I’d agree that MWO’s mechanics, via various balance passes, etc. over the years, have lead to a lot of weapons and mechs being simply not much fun to play, but I don’t see any patten in the changes to date that suggests MWO, its devs, or any group of players that may have influence over them, is being discriminatory toward any particular play style of subset of players.

[Tordin]

Im gonna be 34 when I hopefully... FINALLY can play MW5............ on steam!

So Im in solar years, 33
Genetic health, 26 years
Mind health and vigor... well either 18 ( impulsive, nonsensical wittyness), 28 ( "normal" babbling or 50 ( too wise for the youth to effing care).
My point is, we kinda have 3 kind of ages.

Edited by Tordin, 08 August 2019 - 01:22 PM.

[TheMundaneYesYes]

Tordin, on 08 August 2019 - 01:21 PM, said:

Im gonna be 34 when I hopefully... FINALLY can play MW5............ on steam!

So Im in solar years, 33
Genetic health, 26 years
Mind health and vigor... well either 18 ( impulsive, nonsensical wittyness), 28 ( "normal" babbling or 50 ( too wise for the youth to effing care).
My point is, we kinda have 3 kind of ages.

Im 34 with the problems of a 60 year old and a mind of someone who is two.

[Tordin]

Lol! Well we all have our little quirks

[juxstapo]

Ahh man, I can't claim the same lofty heights of experience and wisdom... But I have a teensy bit of perspective now. I'm currently I'm in AIT after going through Army basic training at 35. Getting my behind both literally and figuratively kicked by guys in excellent shape 10+ years younger than me.

Came across this thread while lurking for info about MW5. Played MWO for years, every friday from closed beta until 2017 when our team captain and good friend passed away from bone cancer.
Our team, Ransom's Corsairs, (can still dredge up zombie recruitment threads.. .unless they've been deleted), was full of older gamer dudes who were almost exclusively parents.. really chill lot. You all remind me of them

You guys are making me miss this place. I salute you all.

[DaZur]

At 52 I challenge your hypothesis as I've found revitalization in running mediums...

I'm now potato trash in Assaults... Barely viable in Heavies and simply watching the world wiz by in Lights.

For what ever reason, Mediums are now my "thang".

[GuardDogg]

Played the board game as well, in my younger years, but have to give it up for awhile doing private investigation, and working with constables on private roles. One night nearly costed my life (vehicle chase, car crash, head went through windshield, and front/side of car nearly crushed), that I had to call an fast retirement, resign from the force. Same year, my father passed away and then life became very difficult to function. Lost of weight, therapy, became confusing and a problem as hell. Counselling with PTSD, and then a few years later, went to technical schools, to build up a new career as electronic service tech. Passed with help, and became my own boss. Started to work on my body building (get my body back into shape), and then a wife arrived (stopped going to gym), and then a child.Then gained weight. Now, my son is 21, working on cars, computers (me teaching him, that now I ask him questions, although I taught him how to pick up woman the good way, and not the stupid quotes "What a beautiful woman like you doing here?", etc). I am 53 now, and always will be a Battletech/Mechwarrior fan and nothing else. Going game to game not healthy. Have to stay with one or two. If MWO is to much, I go into another like Ghost Recon: Wildlands (got that with a Nvidia video card ($90 game?). Dislike 3rd person, but was surprised at the gameplay. Hope to see a Battletech/Mechwarrior movie before my time, but that is unlikely. I now play Mechcommander Gold (on windows 10) on the side, thanks to bear_clw. Watching him, made me feel to pic it up again. 53 and MWO

[Kaeb Odellas]

I knew the MWO population skewed older, but damn. You guys are old.

[Tarl Cabot]

I remember when gas was around 50 cents. Walked to the gas station Sat mornings to fill up the gas can for mowing yards so I could earn book and model money. Sorry, I was the weird kid who did not collect comic books.

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 11 August 2019 - 04:00 AM.

[Prototelis]

Yeah, well back in my day we didn't have oxygen.

We had to breathe snakes

[LordNothing]

my nostalgia leans more towards mechwarrior than a board game ive never played. i cant really say mwo is the best experience. i had always used joysticks with mechwarrior games. mechwarrior 2 had the best controls options. by mechwarrior 4 the controls had been highly simplified but were still usable. mwo makes joysticking impractical as the emphasis on twitch aiming takes the place of proper controls simulation. living legends, while being a bit more stick friendly, still had the problem of being too mouse dependant. im hoping mechwarrior 5 returns the stick to its rightful place on my desk and eliminate the need to keep up with adderall snorting redbull chugging young whippersnappers who need to get off my lawn.

i cant really say mwo did everything bad. its just the least mechwarriory of the mechwarrior games. seemed too limited in scope, the least fleshed out, the fewest features etc. the mechs themselves, the models anyway (camo and default color scheme leave the game ugly and washed out most of the time), the mech combat mechanics. but the world all this takes place in is way too dead. the same battle on the same maps with the same tactics over and over and over again.

Edited by LordNothing, 11 August 2019 - 11:34 PM.

[Prototelis]

lol.

All action games are in some way twitch based. Might as well get over it.

[O L L O]

I wonder how many players are under 25 in MWO, besides our kids.

[Mystere]

Bud Crue, on 08 August 2019 - 10:24 AM, said:

So again, I just don’t see MWO (or some aspect of its community) being intolerant of various play styles ...

Huh?

[Bud Crue]

Mystere, on 12 August 2019 - 03:49 AM, said:

Huh?

I am speaking of intolerance within the practical confines of the game.

That comment is in the context of the comment of the person to whom I was responding to, and his assertion that the supposed intolerance to play styles has been embodied in actual changes to the game that these supposedly intolerant people insisted upon and that PGI agreed to, and that such changes have been so dramatic as to prevent the victims of this intolerance from being able to play in their desired manner.

You can still LRM or use streaks, or whatever. There is no negative consequence in the actual game for your using weapon A any more than for weapon B. I freely admitted in the context of the conversation above that there are certainly vocal folks who don’t like this play style or that, but I don’t think any changes made to LRMs or Streaks have been the result of the supposed “intolerance” that these folks have for a given weapon. They may voice their “intolerance” here, but there is no actual impact of their “intolerance” in the game (other than VOIP mockery, which you are free to respond to).

Edited by Bud Crue, 12 August 2019 - 04:27 AM.

[LordNothing]

Prototelis, on 11 August 2019 - 11:24 PM, said:

lol.

All action games are in some way twitch based. Might as well get over it.

quaternion with a gun type gameplay has no place in a mechwarrior game imho. should be more sim like because MASSIVE ROBOTS. its not a human you are controlling with human like reflexes. pc gamers need to think outside the mouse. its really only good at one type of control and its really restrictive to what you can do in games.

mechs have mass which means physics needs to play a bigger factor, otherwise you break the immersion. like a lower arm actuator with a 5 ton laser or two attached to it is not going to be able to rotate 10 degrees instantly. that would divide by zero in quite a few places. make it take a second or two and it works. thats the way it was supposed to work in mwo but was downgraded to make room for psr (which broke a lot of cool features this game once had). then you have the slop of multiple actuators all stacking up. shifting weight will need to be countered by other actuators causing additional noise. control systems will fight to eliminate this which would lead to intermittent variations in precision based on movement and vibration. then you fire your weapons, things heat up, metal expands, more slop. for fire your autocannon that rattles you up something fierce, your projected projectile paths shake violently throwing off your aim. thats the kind of depth it should have.

Edited by LordNothing, 12 August 2019 - 06:33 AM.

[Prototelis]

LordNothing, on 12 August 2019 - 06:26 AM, said:

quaternion with a gun type gameplay has no place in a mechwarrior game imho. should be more sim like because MASSIVE ROBOTS.

Twitch skills are even more important when the game is slower.

Mech 3 was significantly slower; twitch skills king
Mech 4 was significantly slower; twitch skills king

ANY live action game is going to be primarily twitch based. It doesn't matter if you add 5 layers of "simulating" something completely impractical on top. The person reacting first and more accurately is going to have a serious advantage.

Edited by Prototelis, 12 August 2019 - 06:34 AM.

[LordNothing]

Prototelis, on 12 August 2019 - 06:33 AM, said:

Twitch skills are even more important when the game is slower.

Mech 3 was significantly slower; twitch skills king
Mech 4 was significantly slower; twitch skills king

ANY live action game is going to be primarily twitch based. It doesn't matter if you add 5 layers of "simulating" something completely impractical on top. The person reacting first and more accurately is going to have a serious advantage.

those games existed before good physics engines became common place. its just not delt with because it was too much for computers at the time. and its not really the physics i want so much as the consequences of the physics. the game needs to convey the sense of mass moving through space otherwise its just quake 3 arena with robots.

[Prototelis]

And twitch reflexes are still important there. Mouse control for aiming is still going to be more precise.