73 replies to this topic

[LordRush]

I know in any game that when you are new there is a learning curve and MW:O is not exempt.
It would seem from over Christmas a large number of new players have hit the circuit here and I am seeing a lot of confusion on the role of a lite pilot.
Being as though majority of the time a new players start in a lite, I thought it might help to give some insight into the role you are designed to play as this is seemingly not the current meta.

I am alarmed by the mentality of lite pilots thinking that they can take on an Assault or even a Heavy. I am seeing more and more lite mechs engage the enemy in ways that are counter productive to the Team,especially in capping situations. ie: Losing the map due to 2 enemy lites capping and our four lites staying with the lance and engaging. Even with our team landing more kills,we lose.
I am seeing builds that are more representative of a medium sized mech.
Lite pilots are not equipping ECM or Narc or even Bap. I even saw an instance where a commando pilot speaking of his talent tree where he spec'd nothing in sensors

Lite pilots, know your role

1: You are a Scout. Your mech needs to be outfitted as such with as much sensory provision and degradation modules you can put on.

2: Your job is to move ahead of the Lance in order to provide information to the group as a whole.
This information is vital , especially to LRM "Boats" as you must remember they are not only further away from you and cannot detect as fast , they depend upon the locks to be able TO fire from a distance. Maintaining that lock almost ensures a positive enemy kill. Maintaining your distance and FOV to the target is crucial. Use walls and shielding whenever possible in order to keep locked onto your target without getting shot at.

3: Conquest or Assault maps that require a team to Cap bases or resources are a Lites playground. You will rack up serious points for utilizing your mech the way it should be here.
Cap at ANY advantage you have and you should never hesitate to do so. A well trained lance of lites can run circles around an enemy team because you will never see them together and they are always pulling the enemy main group apart.
*note - there are times when you find yourself in situations where you are the only lite pilot. You should smartly judge the time you spend targeting, to staying with your lance and ultimately separating yourself to go cap. This all comes with knowing the maps and time.

4: Engage only when you have to. This of course means a multitude of things and possible scenarios can go like :
a: Enemy Lites are in your backfield harassing the Boats. ALWAYS protect the backfield at any cost but if you are chasing away an enemy never get caught over extending the formation line.In other words, don't let the enemy coerce you into jumping into their backfield.
b: If there are enemy lites in your backfield, take them down immediately. Don't force a lance to have to break their line in order to take it down for you. Best advantage point is the Legs..the softest part of any lite mech.
c: Being pulled off Cap when the enemy comes back to regain. If it is a single lite enemy pilot,take em on if you think you can. If it is multiple incoming.....run. Do not engage as it would be suicide. Use your mechs speed, It is what it was designed for.
d: Your team is defeated. You and a completely shredded Warhawk are the only ones left. Stay or get to your teammate (stat) and it is then that you need to defend yourself. Use those weapons then but only as a last resort.

Lites are such a vital part of the Team...this is just some of the ways to expand on helping your team as a new pilot. Remember as well, by using these tools you are given you will surge in points (win or lose) if you use these mechs the way they are intended. This ultimately means that if you are finding you are not liking the lite class and want to move up,the points will get you there quicker. But not by pretending that your lite mech is something it is not by disregarding these tips.

[Vxheous]

This is a joke right?

[Scout Derek]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 02:37 PM, said:

I am alarmed by the mentality of lite pilots thinking that they can take on an Assault or even a Heavy.

What if I told you that lights can take on assaults and heavies?

[LordRush]

Scout Derek, on 02 January 2020 - 04:03 PM, said:

What if I told you that lights can take on assaults and heavies?

To answer your question and how it is presented...no. Lites CANNOT take on "Assaults".
Now, is it possible for a lite to take on an Assault, as in singular? Yes, it is very possible but the variables also make it highly improbable.
With that said, you are missing the point. As a 1v1 variable..again yea..it is quite possible in the hands of a skilled pilot.
As a "Team" based game this is and has never been endorsed by any coordinated group. Unless of course (like I stated above) it cannot be helped. Then sometimes, yea..magic happens and lites get to some sloppy joe who isn't paying attention to his backside. But again, overall, in a "TEAM" setting, this is not how it works.

[Vxheous]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 04:16 PM, said:

To answer your question and how it is presented...no. Lites CANNOT take on "Assaults".
Now, is it possible for a lite to take on an Assault, as in singular? Yes, it is very possible but the variables also make it highly improbable.
With that said, you are missing the point. As a 1v1 variable..again yea..it is quite possible in the hands of a skilled pilot.
As a "Team" based game this is and has never been endorsed by any coordinated group. Unless of course (like I stated above) it cannot be helped. Then sometimes, yea..magic happens and lites get to some sloppy joe who isn't paying attention to his backside. But again, overall, in a "TEAM" setting, this is not how it works.

I'm telling you, in the ultimate "team setting" (Competitive Play), lights can (and will) kill assaults. Your advice is bad, 95% of it is wrong. The only time that I would ever want light mechs to be focused on capping is in competitive play, and thats only to maintain a 3 cap against opponent, on top of being able to guard/harass flanks. Since your advice is geared towards new players, and you are clearly unqualified to speak about competitive play, your advice is wrong.

Here is the role of light mechs in quick play: Kill the enemy, by any means nessessary. Backstab mechs, wolfpack stragglers, guard flanks, scout (and then actually do something, not passive scout and get locks for others like your advice) Use your speed to be "everywhere" as much as possible. A mech that is not contributing damage to the match is a mech that's not helping the team, period.

I think you seriously need to self-reflect on your own play, and vastly improve on that before you start trying to teach others how to play.

Edited by Vxheous, 02 January 2020 - 04:29 PM.

[Kamikaze Viking]

You forgot Buttstabbing, Harrasing, standing behind enemy lurm boats with AMS. etc etc Generally being annoying and distracting.

Even squirrelling by running though the team and running away and having them chase you is valuable.

[LordRush]

Vxheous, on 02 January 2020 - 04:18 PM, said:

I'm telling you, in the ultimate "team setting" (Competitive Play), lights can (and will) kill assaults. Your advice is bad, 95% of it is wrong. The only time that I would ever want light mechs to be focused on capping is in competitive play, and thats only to maintain a 3 cap against opponent, on top of being able to guard/harass flanks. Since your advice is geared towards new players, and you are clearly unqualified to speak about competitive play, your advice is wrong.

Here is the role of light mechs in quick play: Kill the enemy, by any means nessessary. Backstab mechs, wolfpack stragglers, guard flanks, scout (and then actually do something, not passive scout and get locks for others like your advice) Use your speed to be "everywhere" as much as possible. A mech that is not contributing damage to the match is a mech that's not helping the team, period.

I think you seriously need to self-reflect on your own play, and vastly improve on that before you start trying to teach others how to play.

I will not get into a pissing war with you but I will state this. Been at this game since Battletech Genie onto Beta Founder on this game. Not sure how long that equates to but it sure says a lot.
I completely 100% disagree with your mentality and 100% disagree with your tactics as this is exactly teaching that are wrong with this game design and the players who attempt to meta it into something other than the design.
If lites were designed to take on an Assault they would be designed as an...Assault

[Vxheous]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 04:34 PM, said:

I will not get into a pissing war with you but I will state this. Been at this game since Battletech Genie onto Beta Founder on this game. Not sure how long that equates to but it sure says a lot.
I completely 100% disagree with your mentality and 100% disagree with your tactics as this is exactly teaching that are wrong with this game design and the players who attempt to meta it into something other than the design.
If lites were designed to take on an Assault they would be designed as an...Assault

Newsflash, this game isn't Battletech tabletop, and the way it is designed, Lights vs Assaults is a rock->paper->scissors->rock type mechanic.

[Kamikaze Viking]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 04:34 PM, said:

I will not get into a pissing war with you but I will state this. Been at this game since Battletech Genie onto Beta Founder on this game. Not sure how long that equates to but it sure says a lot.
I completely 100% disagree with your mentality and 100% disagree with your tactics as this is exactly teaching that are wrong with this game design and the players who attempt to meta it into something other than the design.
If lites were designed to take on an Assault they would be designed as an...Assault

I disagree with your inability to see that there are different tactics that apply at different skill levels.

And while some of what you say is true at certain skill levels its this inflexible mentality that prevents people from improving and hence should not be taught to new players.

[Temporary Axis]

Kamikaze Viking, on 02 January 2020 - 04:44 PM, said:

I disagree with your inability to see that there are different tactics that apply at different skill levels.

And while some of what you say is true at certain skill levels its this inflexible mentality that prevents people from improving and hence should not be taught to new players.

States high level comp player has inflexible mentality to improving game play style.

Continues to parrot role warfare from Battletech antiquity and refuses to see reality of online PVP FPS game.

Debate the inner workings of this players self awareness.

[Faek]

Look mate, what if I'm no good at doing those things? Holding locks is hard, my mech is as big as medium mech so scouting is hard and I lack the empathy to try and save LRM assaults.

How do you suggest I play a light mech with the above handicaps?

Looking forward to your reply,
Faek

[Harambe McHarambeface Kerensky]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 04:34 PM, said:

I will not get into a pissing war with you but I will state this. Been at this game since Battletech Genie onto Beta Founder on this game. Not sure how long that equates to but it sure says a lot.
I completely 100% disagree with your mentality and 100% disagree with your tactics as this is exactly teaching that are wrong with this game design and the players who attempt to meta it into something other than the design.
If lites were designed to take on an Assault they would be designed as an...Assault

You're a 29% on the Jarl's list and below .500 in your W/L, and you're telling Vxheous, a MWO World Champion (I think he's a 2 Time World Champion) how he's playing the game wrong?

[MisterSomaru]

Harambe McHarambeface Kerensky, on 02 January 2020 - 05:38 PM, said:

You're a 29% on the Jarl's list and below .500 in your W/L, and you're telling Vxheous, a MWO World Champion (I think he's a 2 Time World Champion) how he's playing the game wrong?

This. Statistics will show how much people really know, because if they were right, wouldn't they be much better?

[justcallme A S H]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 04:16 PM, said:

To answer your question and how it is presented...no. Lites CANNOT take on "Assaults".
Now, is it possible for a lite to take on an Assault, as in singular? Yes, it is very possible but the variables also make it highly improbable.
With that said, you are missing the point. As a 1v1 variable..again yea..it is quite possible in the hands of a skilled pilot.
As a "Team" based game this is and has never been endorsed by any coordinated group. Unless of course (like I stated above) it cannot be helped. Then sometimes, yea..magic happens and lites get to some sloppy joe who isn't paying attention to his backside. But again, overall, in a "TEAM" setting, this is not how it works.

Low skill user trying to tell people to play his bad way...

Lol.

K dude.

[dario03]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 02:37 PM, said:

I know in any game that when you are new there is a learning curve and MW:O is not exempt.
It would seem from over Christmas a large number of new players have hit the circuit here and I am seeing a lot of confusion on the role of a lite pilot.
Being as though majority of the time a new players start in a lite, I thought it might help to give some insight into the role you are designed to play as this is seemingly not the current meta.

I am alarmed by the mentality of lite pilots thinking that they can take on an Assault or even a Heavy. I am seeing more and more lite mechs engage the enemy in ways that are counter productive to the Team,especially in capping situations. ie: Losing the map due to 2 enemy lites capping and our four lites staying with the lance and engaging. Even with our team landing more kills,we lose.
I am seeing builds that are more representative of a medium sized mech.
Lite pilots are not equipping ECM or Narc or even Bap. I even saw an instance where a commando pilot speaking of his talent tree where he spec'd nothing in sensors

Lite pilots, know your role

1: You are a Scout. Your mech needs to be outfitted as such with as much sensory provision and degradation modules you can put on.

2: Your job is to move ahead of the Lance in order to provide information to the group as a whole.
This information is vital , especially to LRM "Boats" as you must remember they are not only further away from you and cannot detect as fast , they depend upon the locks to be able TO fire from a distance. Maintaining that lock almost ensures a positive enemy kill. Maintaining your distance and FOV to the target is crucial. Use walls and shielding whenever possible in order to keep locked onto your target without getting shot at.

3: Conquest or Assault maps that require a team to Cap bases or resources are a Lites playground. You will rack up serious points for utilizing your mech the way it should be here.
Cap at ANY advantage you have and you should never hesitate to do so. A well trained lance of lites can run circles around an enemy team because you will never see them together and they are always pulling the enemy main group apart.
*note - there are times when you find yourself in situations where you are the only lite pilot. You should smartly judge the time you spend targeting, to staying with your lance and ultimately separating yourself to go cap. This all comes with knowing the maps and time.

4: Engage only when you have to. This of course means a multitude of things and possible scenarios can go like :
a: Enemy Lites are in your backfield harassing the Boats. ALWAYS protect the backfield at any cost but if you are chasing away an enemy never get caught over extending the formation line.In other words, don't let the enemy coerce you into jumping into their backfield.
b: If there are enemy lites in your backfield, take them down immediately. Don't force a lance to have to break their line in order to take it down for you. Best advantage point is the Legs..the softest part of any lite mech.
c: Being pulled off Cap when the enemy comes back to regain. If it is a single lite enemy pilot,take em on if you think you can. If it is multiple incoming.....run. Do not engage as it would be suicide. Use your mechs speed, It is what it was designed for.
d: Your team is defeated. You and a completely shredded Warhawk are the only ones left. Stay or get to your teammate (stat) and it is then that you need to defend yourself. Use those weapons then but only as a last resort.

Lites are such a vital part of the Team...this is just some of the ways to expand on helping your team as a new pilot. Remember as well, by using these tools you are given you will surge in points (win or lose) if you use these mechs the way they are intended. This ultimately means that if you are finding you are not liking the lite class and want to move up,the points will get you there quicker. But not by pretending that your lite mech is something it is not by disregarding these tips.

I think you are using to many absolutes, and only the Sith and hypocritical Jedi deal in absolutes...

1. Light mechs have plenty of different roles they can play and a lot of them are for direct fighting and thus would benefit more from nodes other than sensors.

2. If you brought a light specifically for lrming scouting then sure you can do this. But going back to point one, not all lights need to be doing this. Plus you didn't mention tag/narc.

3. Capping is a good idea on conquest but I wouldn't say do it every chance you get. If you 4cap the enemy but the enemy murders the rest of your team 3 minutes into the game, you are going to lose. Your note seems to imply keeping a balance though so I guess this is ok.

4. If your light is built for fighting you should be engaging as often as you can as long as that engagement isn't getting you killed.
a. Unless you are running some really slow support light you probably shouldn't stay in the backfield. If the enemy never flanks behind then you are basically doing nothing. Plus if you are a fast light you could just run back if need be but the lrmboats will hopefully not be way behind the rest of the team or at least brought some anti-light weapons. Also there are plenty of times where you going to the backfield makes sense, distracting the enemy or killing a lrmboat that did stay way behind and didn't bring other weapons for instance.
b. Yeah if there is an entire light pack in the back that could make sense to go back, though if they jump in without the rest of their team near by it might not be a bad idea for some of your team to fall back a bit and focus them out. Pure light on light with equal numbers can often go badly since even if you win you might be legged and thus nearly useless.
c. In a lot of cases sure. In some cases you might need to fight even if you are out numbered but it would be a bit specific like you are the last one left and you have to stop them from capping that point to win.
d. If its just you and a completely shredded Warhawk you probably should have been using your weapons earlier. Even if you are a narcing Raven once most of your team is dead you probably need to switch your role to damage dealer.

Yes doing some of the stuff you listed will increase your score, but probably not enough to make up for points lost due to avoiding dealing damage. If you want the highest scores you need to do some of that stuff and deal damage. Or I don't know, maybe bring a 3ams Kitfox and hope the enemy brought nothing but atms/lrms

Edited by dario03, 02 January 2020 - 07:16 PM.

[Davegt27]

[Vxheous]

Here's a good light guide (ignore outdated builds) that Krivvan wrote up in 2015
https://steamcommuni...s/?id=572806592

Edited by Vxheous, 02 January 2020 - 09:07 PM.

[MOBAjobg]

Checking in for the light guide, thks Vxheous.

[Void Angel]

Photobucket is down - but I got my Ace of Spades on a Light 'mech.

[Kroete]

LordRush, on 02 January 2020 - 04:34 PM, said:

If lites were designed to take on an Assault they would be designed as an...Assault

I use lights for scouting with ecm, stealtharmor, full seonsors, narc and a few low weapons.
I use lights with mass ams and ecm standing with the big boys and adding some damage to them.
I use lights with high speed and heavy weapons, do backstabbing or going with a wolfpack
If i want to hunt lights, i prefer a 120+ kph medium mech ...

But none of it has 30 dps metalstorm or 80 tubes raining capabilities ...

Edited by Kroete, 03 January 2020 - 03:56 AM.