107 replies to this topic

[FRAGTAST1C]

VonBruinwald, on 17 February 2020 - 05:19 PM, said:

As long as the bar is moving you're using heat. It doesn't matter where you ride. As far as the maths go, riding high gives you extra dmg initially but you sacrifice having that dmg on hand for opportunity shots.

Do you always plan on group or chain-firing your weapons or alpha strike as much as possible? If you're doing the former, you'll be dealing damage in a scattered manner but the latter gives better results and also helps you use your heat bar to its fullest.

[martian]

Brauer, on 17 February 2020 - 06:07 AM, said:

Doesn't seem like anything is being added to the game at this point sadly.

Of course.

But who knows? With the release of MW5:Mercs done, maybe PGI will turn their attention back to MWO.

[FRAGTAST1C]

martian, on 17 February 2020 - 11:46 PM, said:

Of course.

But who knows? With the release of MW5:Mercs done, maybe PGI will turn their attention back to MWO.

Nah, PGI is busy with DLC and making sure that the editor is fully expanded for the players.

[martian]

FRAGTAST1C, on 17 February 2020 - 11:48 PM, said:

Nah, PGI is busy with DLC and making sure that the editor is fully expanded for the players.

After PGI makes one expansion pack for MW5: Mercs with their MWO Clan 'Mechs, that will be the end of their creativity.

[FRAGTAST1C]

martian, on 17 February 2020 - 11:55 PM, said:

After PGI makes one expansion pack for MW5: Mercs with their MWO Clan 'Mechs, that will be the end of their creativity.

I'm kinda sad having laughed at that but it is true. Just wish they wouldn't be stubborn in finding out how to create unique-feeling missions at least for the MQ.

[PhoenixFire55]

VonBruinwald, on 17 February 2020 - 04:19 PM, said:

If people can't understand that then they'll never understand heat spike.

People don't "understand" heat spike because heat spike is wrong on every single level:

BT lore: Wrong, it doesn't exist.
TT: Wrong, it doesn't exist.
RL physics: Wrong again, it doesn't exist.

All this heat spike *ay *ss *diocy does is *iss people off. It doesn't provide any realism, it doesn't provide any balance and it surely doesn't provide any fun. Thus it is outright stupid.

But then again, preaching to people who spend 99% of their time in the match walking around doing nothing or even better standing in one spot doing nothing is pointless.

[martian]

FRAGTAST1C, on 17 February 2020 - 11:57 PM, said:

I'm kinda sad having laughed at that but it is true. Just wish they wouldn't be stubborn in finding out how to create unique-feeling missions at least for the MQ.

Perhaps PGI will show some effort. After all, almost all previous MechWarrior installments had their mini-campaign expansion packs:

• MechWarrior 2: Ghost Bear's Legacy expansion pack
  
• MechWarrior 3: Pirate's Moon expansion pack
  
• MechWarrior 4: Black Knight expansion pack
  
• MechWarrior 5: ********* ********** expansion pack

It would be shame to break such nice tradition.

[PhoenixFire55]

martian, on 18 February 2020 - 12:13 AM, said:

Perhaps PGI will show some effort.

They fail to show any kind of effort for 9 years. Believing that they would suddenly start now? ... LOL.

[martian]

PhoenixFire55, on 18 February 2020 - 12:42 AM, said:

They fail to show any kind of effort for 9 years. Believing that they would suddenly start now? ... LOL.

Russ Bullock and Bryan Ekman are proud company owners and surely they want to be remembered for something ...

[Axys Rageborn]

Lets face it Nothing will be added but it seemed like a cool idea using whats already in the game. This was more of a "what if" to see how it flows as its pretty lop sided when using XL. I personally have no problems with XL and use them when I can but just wanted to gather some peoples points on the idea.

As for the heat spike mechanic that POS can die in hell as makes no sense and basically f*cked anyone who is riding the heat bar all the time. Also if you have remaining heat your not being effective and wasting potential,

[Tarl Cabot]

PhoenixFire55, on 17 February 2020 - 11:58 PM, said:

People don't "understand" heat spike because heat spike is wrong on every single level:

BT lore: Wrong, it doesn't exist.
TT: Wrong, it doesn't exist.
RL physics: Wrong again, it doesn't exist.

All this heat spike *ay *ss *diocy does is *iss people off. It doesn't provide any realism, it doesn't provide any balance and it surely doesn't provide any fun. Thus it is outright stupid.

But then again, preaching to people who spend 99% of their time in the match walking around doing nothing or even better standing in one spot doing nothing is pointless.

In TT/Lore there is heat overrides LOW on the heat scale or throw of the dice to determine if mech would perform a hard shutdown, as well as all of the other negative effects for riding that the "heat", from ammo explosions rolls, more difficult to maneuver, aim and moving the mech, and RPG the game, actual conscious/damage rolls. But once a mech has exceeded that max threshold, it was a hard shutdown while rolling for possible ammo explosions/pilot health.

And in TT, losing heatsinks/engine crits did have an effect not just on dissipation but also capacity ABOVE the 30pt mark.. it was tied together, causing the one's ending heat to end at a higher point of the heat scale (bar) then if those HS/engine crits did not happen, if one was to think of it in those terms.

Did PGI go far enough with their version, on how they fleshed it out? No. Once they switched around how heat bar capacity would be removed, from the top instead of from the bottom, that would have opened up the door to bring the isXL inline with the LFE/cXL by allowing it to survive the loss of a ST by giving the 3 engines different levels of the heat dissipation/capacity loss, with the isXL having the highest,l the cXL middle ground and the LFE the lowest of the three.

Just remember, the heat bar is not just 30 heat but 30 heat + 20 heat (from engine HS) + portion of any other external HS... so 30 heat would account for approximately 60% of the heat bar...hai?

Tis that hour, have fun!!

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 18 February 2020 - 04:26 AM.

[PhoenixFire55]

Tarl Cabot, on 18 February 2020 - 04:13 AM, said:

stuff

Very nice of you to bring up all that irrelevant stuff. None if it however have anything to do with a heat spike on a cXL/LFE torso loss.

The thing you should remember instead is that losing portion of your heat capacity also means losing all the heat stored in that capacity.

[Tarl Cabot]

PhoenixFire55, on 18 February 2020 - 06:08 AM, said:

Stuff

Tis not irrelevant when attempt to look at how PGI is attempting to add their touch/spin/ flavor to it.... Something that was rarely touched, if at all in previous titles.

And destroying a ST torso does not actually mean the complete removal of the components, simply destroyed components, as well as systems shutting down/rerouting hot fluids.

It ALMOST falls into the same pattern as when Clan mechs were introduced, but when a cXL was destroyed there was no negative impact on the mech of any sort except for weapon/component removal from that section for few months, while isXL still died to 1st ST loss with no LFE in game. How frak up was that, really?

Anyhow.. this is scifi.... and that is a different discussion!!

/shrugs..

[PhoenixFire55]

Tarl Cabot, on 18 February 2020 - 04:07 PM, said:

And destroying a ST torso does not actually mean the complete removal of the components, simply destroyed components, as well as systems shutting down/rerouting hot fluids.

Aha. So its destroyed, but its not destroyed. A very rational argument.

I'm done here. No point in having a discussion when people apply THAT kind of logic.

[VonBruinwald]

PhoenixFire55, on 19 February 2020 - 02:08 AM, said:

Aha. So its destroyed, but its not destroyed. A very rational argument.

I'm done here. No point in having a discussion when people apply THAT kind of logic.

Notice how when you destory a mechs ST (or leg) it's still attached. It's destroyed, but it's not destroyed.

I don't understand why you play if you're going to follow THAT kind of logic.

[Prototelis]

It's no longer part of the system.

If you remove a radiator the heat doesn't magically transfer back into the engine. That isn't how heat energy works.

[Brauer]

Prototelis, on 19 February 2020 - 06:11 AM, said:

It's no longer part of the system.

If you remove a radiator the heat doesn't magically transfer back into the engine. That isn't how heat energy works.

Add to this that whatever the lore or realism based attempts to justify the heat spike the main goal should be engaging, balanced, and entertaining gameplay. The ST heat spike offers none of these things imo and that alone is enough justification to roll it back.

[VonBruinwald]

Prototelis, on 19 February 2020 - 06:11 AM, said:

It's no longer part of the system.

If you remove a radiator the heat doesn't magically transfer back into the engine. That isn't how heat energy works.

.

Be careful, we're dealing with heat pumps not heat sinks despite what they're cooled.

[Prototelis]

VonBruinwald, on 19 February 2020 - 07:22 AM, said:

heat pumps

A car radiator is a heat pump, dingus. Heat pumps, essentially, all do the same thing.

[Sergeant Destroy]

Heat pumps sounds way better though.