228 replies to this topic

[Brauer]

VonBruinwald, on 03 April 2020 - 08:31 AM, said:

FUN!

Still awaiting an explanation of "high skilled" lrming.

Since nobody has provided any actual detail on skilled lrming let's all just agree it requires minimal skill.

[VonBruinwald]

Brauer, on 03 April 2020 - 09:50 AM, said:

Still awaiting an explanation of "high skilled" lrming.

I'm afraid I skimmed past your first request, I do intend to explain at some point. Not feeling too wordy atm though.

[Blood Rose]

>Specifically say I dont run LRM boats, and only ran one once years in the past
>"Hahaha no skill lurmer"
I... I tried. I really did. But I can see that nothing will ever change the view points of the vocal majority. Have fun compaining and whining and circlejerking until the game devolves into another long range twitch finger instant pinpoint sniper fest.

>"your bad machine is no excuse I know people who play on worse machines..."
I doubt that, given how close this poor old girl comes to catching fire on occasion.

Anyway I shouldnt have come back here. It is a stark reminder of how many of the newer players dont know a thing about the lore or the universe and just want to play call of doody or wot with giant robots. Gods, I miss beta. Beta was fun. The complaining actually had basis. now its "oh my gods I got seen by someone andnow missiles are raining down... What do you mean I should bring countermeasures?!?!".
To those of you that were actually polite, thanks. Yo had some good points and I can see your view. Just not always agree with it.
And to the rest: Remember this is a game. Have fun. And try to play like a team. And most of all remember that this is a game based in the Battletech universe where things like LRM boats and fire support are a thing. Gods help us when they introduce Thunder missiles and Arrow IV.

[Tesunie]

Although old... I have this nice link leading to a thread about how to LRM better... and what skills are needed to do good LRMing...

[letir]

Blood Rose, on 03 April 2020 - 11:14 AM, said:

And to the rest: Remember this is a game. Have fun. And try to play like a team. And most of all remember that this is a game based in the Battletech universe where things like LRM boats and fire support are a thing. Gods help us when they introduce Thunder missiles and Arrow IV.

LRM boats exist in MWO, and they are very effective. Just not "lol I gonna sit at 800m and collect all damage in the world with my support fire".

[MTier Slayed Up]

letir, on 03 April 2020 - 11:22 AM, said:

LRM boats exist in MWO, and they aren't very effective. Just "lol I gonna sit at 1100m and collect no damage in the world with my "support fire"".

The extreme majority of them do what I corrected your quote with.

[letir]

Michelle Branch, on 03 April 2020 - 11:33 AM, said:

The extreme majority of them do what I corrected your quote with.

In my experience, direct-fire LRM 30+ can be very scary on mid-range. As long as they willing to actually boat missiles and bring TAG against ECM mechs, DPS and self-guiding properties making this weapon system pretty dangerous.

[Tesunie]

Michelle Branch, on 03 April 2020 - 11:33 AM, said:

The extreme majority of them do what I corrected your quote with.

Majority and "all" are two different things though. I like using LRMs, but at the same time I've seen many people using LRMs that was just painful to watch...

[thievingmagpi]

Tesunie, on 03 April 2020 - 11:40 AM, said:

Majority and "all" are two different things though. I like using LRMs, but at the same time I've seen many people using LRMs that was just painful to watch...

See, here's the thing... That's fine. If you want to do it and enjoy it, sure, okay. Cool.

The problem here that keeps coming up with the LRM issue (and others like it) is people calling something that which it is not , and continuing to do so from an apparent place of self- professed "authority".

Really in truth, no one is bashing anyone for "liking LRMs" or being bad at the game etc. It's people putting on airs and saying things which are demonstrably incorrect.

Like LRMs? Okay.

Not really able to play other weapons (disabilities, old computer whatever) so LRMs still let you play and enjoy MWO? Okay.

Old and bad at videogames? Okay.

Really like lore and roleplaying Big Tiddy Katrina Steiner poolboy LRM support mech? Okay.

Fine, do whatever.

Saying things like "LRMs keep getting nerfed!" or "LRMs deserve some buffs!" or "LRMs are good for gameplay balance!" or "LRMs require skill!" or "Tryhard players don't know about things like ecm or hard cover!" or "My 100 damage matches are helping my team!"

That **** ain't gonna fly.

[Kubernetes]

lmao

this thread

[Tesunie]

thievingmagpi, on 03 April 2020 - 12:20 PM, said:

See, here's the thing... That's fine. If you want to do it and enjoy it, sure, okay. Cool.

The problem here that keeps coming up with the LRM issue (and others like it) is people calling something that which it is not , and continuing to do so from an apparent place of self- professed "authority".

Really in truth, no one is bashing anyone for "liking LRMs" or being bad at the game etc. It's people putting on airs and saying things which are demonstrably incorrect.

Like LRMs? Okay.

Not really able to play other weapons (disabilities, old computer whatever) so LRMs still let you play and enjoy MWO? Okay.

Old and bad at videogames? Okay.

Really like lore and roleplaying Big Tiddy Katrina Steiner poolboy LRM support mech? Okay.

Fine, do whatever.

As I said, I like LRMs, but I also play just about every weapon system in the game. I like to be well verse in what each weapon is capable of. For LRMs, I like them as a support as I approach the enemy. I also like using LRMs in mechs that can reposition well and/or can jump over obstructions and gain direct line of sight.

LRMs can pair well with MASC and JJs, as their shake doesn't matter to their accuracy (as well as ATMs and SSRMs). One of my favorite tactics with LRMs is to jump over a ridge at mid range, unload with MLs and then just before I fall back into safety of cover unload my LRMs into my target as I arrest my fall.

Sure, I can do this with PPCs, ACs, lasers, etc as well. I do. But I just enjoy my mixed LRM builds.

thievingmagpi, on 03 April 2020 - 12:20 PM, said:

Saying things like "LRMs keep getting nerfed!" or "LRMs deserve some buffs!" or "LRMs are good for gameplay balance!" or "LRMs require skill!" or "Tryhard players don't know about things like ecm or hard cover!" or "My 100 damage matches are helping my team!"

That **** ain't gonna fly.

LRMs do require skill to use well. Key word here is to use well.

Predicting the angle the LRMs will fly in is just as important as knowing where your lasers are positioned on your mech before shooting so you don't just blast a ridge. In the case of LRMs, you now need to be aware of their arch with direct fire, as well as indirect fire arch and possible obstructions above the typical fighting grounds. Is this a hard skill? Not saying if it is or isn't. (Just as one example.)

I wont call for any nerfs nor buffs to LRMs. I actually think they perform reasonably well as they are now. On topic of snipers, I think that they are reasonable at this time. A whole team of them can be very powerful, but on most every map if you know the terrain then you can get into range most times.

For damage, that depends upon the individual using the weapon. Some of my best statistical mechs for average damage per match tend to be my LRM mechs. Then again, I don't boat LRMs have seem to have more direct fire weapons than the average LRM user. Am I "god grade" good at this game? Hardly. Though, I tend to fall within the 70-80% on Jarl's list last I checked. Can't blame me for those who want to shoot LRMs at over 900m indirectly only, when LRMs are best when shot within 600m or closer and even better with LoS.

PS: TAG only effects missiles for indirect locks, unless of course you are using it for punching through ECM and/or Stealth at range.

[Phoolan Devi]

After reading this thread I feel like fielding my LURM-Mechs again!

Thanks @thethievingmagpie, your arrogance is bliss!

Edited by Phoolan Devi, 03 April 2020 - 01:09 PM.

[thievingmagpi]

Tesunie, on 03 April 2020 - 01:03 PM, said:

LRMs do require skill to use well. Key word here is to use well.

They don't. There you go making claims that are incorrect.

The "Skill" here being about equal to tying your shoelaces.

Tesunie, on 03 April 2020 - 01:03 PM, said:

In the case of LRMs, you now need to be aware of their arch with direct fire, as well as indirect fire arch and possible obstructions above the typical fighting grounds. Is this a hard skill? Not saying if it is or isn't. (Just as one example.)

LMAO. That's some serious high skill. Does the crosshair light up red after I shoot my missiles? If no, back up a bit. If yes continue as normal.

Phoolan Devi, on 03 April 2020 - 01:07 PM, said:

After reading this thread I feel like fielding my LURM-Mechs again!

Thanks @thethievingmagpie, your arrogance is bliss!

As usual, nothing of substance to add from the peanut gallery.

[CFC Conky]

Blood Rose, on 03 April 2020 - 11:14 AM, said:

...

Anyway I shouldnt have come back here. It is a stark reminder of how many of the newer players dont know a thing about the lore or the universe and just want to play call of doody or wot with giant robots.

...

From what I understand, MWO doesn't play too much like TT, if at all, so it shouldn't really matter if newer players know anything about the lore, should it?

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

Edited by CFC Conky, 03 April 2020 - 01:24 PM.

[Sniper09121986]

LRM do require some skill to use. About 20 nodes of it. Really the only productive way to play them seems to be the same way you play ATM, albeit with some more range. About the only way indirect fire can be useful is to scare off other people with a LRM warning.

[ghost1e]

Blood Rose, on 03 April 2020 - 11:14 AM, said:

It is a stark reminder of how many of the newer players dont know a thing about the lore or the universe and just want to play call of doody or wot with giant robots. Gods, I miss beta. Beta was fun. The complaining actually had basis. now its "oh my gods I got seen by someone andnow missiles are raining down... What do you mean I should bring countermeasures?!?!".

lol
so you are offended when we assume you play LRMs as we see you defending them, but yourself are allowed to draw the conclusion we don't know **** about TT? well, let me tell you that I know most TT rules by heart, but those are just not fully compatible with the concept of a shooter game. Or would you like all weapons to have a cooldown of 10 seconds? Because that actually is TT round length. Would you like to have the 1/36th chance of headshot that is in TT instead of the insanely small cockpit hitbox?

But yeah, I guess I know what people like you want. An automated and randomized aiming system, so every weapon behaves like LRMs do and actual player skill doesn't matter. And guess what, this is not gonna happen. MWO is not meant to be TT, it is meant to be a shooter "set in the BattleTech universe" . So if you want a battle where skill doesn't matter (and you could actually win xD), go play tabletop, maybe even HBS BattleTech, but this is MWO.

VonBruinwald, on 03 April 2020 - 10:10 AM, said:

I'm afraid I skimmed past your first request, I do intend to explain at some point. Not feeling too wordy atm though.

ok, well let's see how wordy you have to feel, and especially how many brain cells your explanation will kill...

[MTier Slayed Up]

Tesunie, on 03 April 2020 - 11:40 AM, said:

Majority and "all" are two different things though. I like using LRMs, but at the same time I've seen many people using LRMs that was just painful to watch...

I'm absolutely sure you fall in that category.

Sniper09121986, on 03 April 2020 - 01:36 PM, said:

LRM do require some skill to use. About 20 nodes of it. Really the only productive way to play them seems to be the same way you play ATM, albeit with some more range. About the only way indirect fire can be useful is to scare off other people with a LRM warning.

I'm hammered and I took a LRM Jaeger with tag. Know what the hardest thing for me was? Holding my own lock.

Gtfo. I'm tired of seeing these idiotic posts about LRMs requiring skill.

[Tesunie]

thievingmagpi, on 03 April 2020 - 01:17 PM, said:

They don't. There you go making claims that are incorrect.

The "Skill" here being about equal to tying your shoelaces.


LMAO. That's some serious high skill. Does the crosshair light up red after I shoot my missiles? If no, back up a bit. If yes continue as normal.

Okay, then what about all those players I see shooting dirt with their weapons, or an allies backside because they failed to realize that their arm mounted weapons are blocked? I guess that knowing the positions of your weapons paths isn't a skill? As I said that was one example. Very similar to direct fire weapons, except it isn't just in front of the weapon's location you need to worry about, but also the arch your missiles will travel and their travel times.

CFC Conky, on 03 April 2020 - 01:24 PM, said:

From what I understand, MWO doesn't play too much like TT, if at all, so it shouldn't really matter if newer players know anything about the lore, should it?

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

I believe that they should have the ability to learn of the BT lore through the game, not need to know it before they join. However, I do believe that this game has failed a bit in that department. (This, though, has no relation to weapons or mech balance.)

[Phoolan Devi]

thievingmagpi, on 03 April 2020 - 01:17 PM, said:

As usual, nothing of substance to add from the peanut gallery.

Why are you writing then, if you have nothing to add of substance?

[Moochachoo]

Sniping requires you to aim, that’s the difference.

i think all high level play is focused on long range, back before the summoner got its PPC quirk nerfed, it was a meta mech for tournaments with its fembot 2 ERPPC build, if you watched the tournament game play you see plenty of PPCs being shot across the map.

also there is no weapon in the game that has 1000+ effective range, I use to do a triple ERLL build for sniping, while I could hit targets from way across the map, at the end of the match my damage was pretty abysmal, it’s not as good as you think.

though something I noticed about long range weapon though, it is a very effective psychological weapon, being hammer repeatedly by something like a lbx2 from range forces people to duck for cover, this can be useful for suppression.

Edited by Moochachoo, 03 April 2020 - 02:58 PM.