284 replies to this topic

[VileKnight]

Horseman, on 10 December 2020 - 11:21 PM, said:

Cue pilots getting pissed because their idiot teammate took the VIP straight into enemy firing line, disconnected, went into zimbabwe instead of the evac point etc or because they were forced to play the VIP instead of their preferred personal mech.

So.... you are saying no because someone MIGHT not play the match correctly? If that's the case, shouldn't we just take away all match types except skirmish? Just because a player might throw a fit and be TFG, doesn't mean we can't consider new match types.

[Vercors]

I have made a first proposition here for the matchmaker in quick play. I will complete it with an interesting proposition (in my opinion) from Vorpal Puppy here about the grouped and solo players:

Vorpal Puppy, on 16 December 2020 - 10:51 AM, said:

Remove the guarantee that everyone grouped up will end up on the same team! They will just be in the same game.

---------------------------
- Match will be 3 lights, 3 mediums, 3 heavys and 3 assaults in each team.
- Grouped players and solo players can play together.
---------------------------

- Before lauching a game, Grouped players HAVE TO chose four tonnage category of mech (I explain why below). Solo player can chose between one to four tonnage category of mech. Every players chose tonnage category in the order they prefers to play them.

- When players click the play button (and imagine we have grouped and solo players in this game):
1) The matchmaker make a distribution in each team, according to the skill of the players. Grouped players can be in opposite team.
2) The matchmaker select the tonnage category of solo players, according to the order of arrival in the game.
3) The matchmaker select the tonnage category of grouped players, according to the free spaces (that why grouped players have to select four tonnage category, and not between one to four tonnage category: the matchmaker will bug if one grouped player select one tonnage category and that there is no more free space available in this category). Because grouped players come simultaneously in the game, this will be a random selection.
4) The matchmaker let players chose map and gameplay.

- Player chose a mech in the category assigned to them.

- Then we play.

Why do I propose this "solution" ?
- PGI can keep grouped and solo players together. Moreover, grouped players can be more than four players because they will be assigned to different teams (maybe with a limit of eight grouped players ?).
- Teams better balanced according to the skills of the players.
- No more complains about tonnage distribution.
- Players choses mech according to the map (but this is not the more important aspect for me).

English not my native language, sorry for error. Ask if you don't understand a point. I don't say this this THE solution, just try to help.

Edited by Vercors, 17 December 2020 - 01:32 PM.

[AnAnachronismAlive]

Re-Evaluate MM / PSR changes and finish and/or refine the existing formula or else the general approach to improve the situation in terms of player skill disparity (once groups come into play).

[Nightbird]

AnAnachronismAlive, on 19 December 2020 - 04:14 AM, said:

Re-Evaluate MM / PSR changes and finish and/or refine the existing formula or else the general approach to improve the situation in terms of player skill disparity (once groups come into play).

It's over, the existing effort is only to ensure nothing rocks the boat until the enad deal closes.

[Grumpy Old Man]

As someone that has been driven away by the changes in soup queue, match maker would be the biggest thing that would make me come back.

Maybe I am overly optimistic, but something as simple as sorting people by average match score would work for me. The way I understand it is the match maker tries to fill one side first and then tries to match players for a second side. Maybe the solution that would work is for the match maker to look for 24 people right away, not 12. And then sort by AMS. If one side has the 4 people with the highest match score in the match, it will also get those 4 people with the lowest match score, assuming the groups in the game allow for it.

As far as modes go for Solaris, what I feel could make the mode become alive is to give the players the tools to run their own events and tournaments, no matter what Tier Mechs are in. Why can't there be a player organised official Urbanmech World Championship? Standard Tournament modus, people have X amount of time to try find a common time to play against each other, all Urbanmech builds allowed, one round per week, eventually crowing "The Urbanmech 2020 World Champion" fully with ingame title for bragging rights. Same for a World Light Mech Championship. World Team Urbie Championship (2v2). World Annihilator Championship. Etc. Etc. Etc. You guys do not have the manpower to run dozens or hundreds of events. But you might have the manpower to give the players the tools to run something they are interested in.

[dario03]

Solaris

-Add casual unranked mode.
-Let players select to search ranked/unranked in whatever divisions they want all at once.
-If match maker finds a closely ranked match and both have ranked selected then its a ranked match. If one player has unranked selected and other has both then its unranked.
-If match maker can only make a match with a large gap in points then its unranked. As long as both had unranked selected, if not selected no match is made.

-Adjust points to make it rewarding to play without making it possible to just play a lot to get top ranked.
-It shouldn't be possible to beat someone 30+ times and then lose once and come out with less points than you started with. It shouldn't even be possible to go something like 3-1 (maybe even 2-1) and have that happen. Point movement range should be something like 10-30 for example (maybe even tighter).
-With 10-30, if you win 3 matches against a lower ranked player thats just within ranked range then you should have gained something like 12,11,10 points for 33 points gained. If the other player is still within ranked range and wins the fourth match they would gain 30.
-If the lower ranked player fell out of ranked range then those players would just play unranked matches in that division until their points are closer together.

-Maybe allow players to ready up different mechs in each division. One for unranked, one for ranked.
-Get rid of or again lower the first 10 match boost. If a player ended a previous season above 1500 in a division, have them start between 1500 and their previous rank. So for example if the seeding is at half and they were ranked at 2000 in the last season that they played 25 games in, then they start at 1750. Players who were under 1500 start at 1500.
-Maybe spread out the prizes for Solaris some. Spread the top 3 extras out so that all of top 10 is the same, shift some to other ranks.

The prize changes and more so the unranked and points range changes are to make it so players don't feel punished for playing. Currently a newer player just trying to figure out the mode feels punished because if they play a vet they will probably lose and their points go down unless that vet already ranked up a lot, and even if the vet was already ranked up the new player still sees the loss on their record. Also its risky for a vet to play a newer player or even a vet that just hasn't played much this season because they will only gain a tiny amount of points on a win, and lose a lot on a loss. These are the main things of the current system that encourage players to dodge and win trade to keep their rank up. I believe with these changes the issues should be lessened and more players will spend time in Solaris.

I think these would be easy to do changes (except maybe the all divisions search?) that don't require a overhaul of the mode. If overhauling the mode is an option though then I would do more, like short events that set a division to just one or a few mechs and builds. That way matches aren't just decided in the mechlab and some under used mechs could see some Solaris time and do well.

Edited by dario03, 19 December 2020 - 01:36 PM.

[Zephonarch II]

(I already posted on the game-modes in another pinned dev-topic, so sorry about the strikeouts.)
Review / Update Game Modes
Solution for Faction Play
Solution for Solaris

• General Match Maker Improvements: Sometimes the mm is drunk. I think its because it doesn't take into consideration the weapons on the mechs. The way the game is, the mm needs to account for the roles of the player builds. I propose.... A BUILD TAGGING SYSTEM. It sounds simple enough to implement, the highest dmg alpha you got is considered your main weapon and that weapon's optimum range determines your build class. Then the mm takes that and ensures a good dispersion of builds when enough people are online. If no one is online, however, the mm will match whoever is available without using build classes as criteria because it slows queues down.

8v8 vs 12v12

• Solo / Group Queues: No real opinion on this...
  
• Examine Match Scoring (AMS): Its okay atm.
  
• Remove 2 Minute Requirement for Reconnection: Yes. This is here to stop trolls from dc'ing early, but I think dcs are mainly caused by players with bad/busy connections and random errors that rip players from games for no reason.
  
• Private Lobby Updates (More Options, Maps, Host Assignment, More Spectators): No opinion again.
  
• Dailies/Weeklies: We kind of get these already with events, but when an event releases C-bills, MC, or GSP... players immediately(well free ones) play for those. Dailies/weeklies would also make the grind faster for new players... if they have the right mechs/weapons etc. etc.

[General Solo]

VileKnight, on 16 December 2020 - 07:42 AM, said:

So.... you are saying no because someone MIGHT not play the match correctly? If that's the case, shouldn't we just take away all match types except skirmish? Just because a player might throw a fit and be TFG, doesn't mean we can't consider new match types.

If the game allow you to do it and you win it is correct
The game is the umpire
not some internet persons opinion imo lol

[PCHunter]

Daeron Katz, on 16 November 2020 - 01:00 PM, said:

In this thread, lets discuss ideas for updating or adding to our current modes in MechWarrior Online, such as:

Review / Update Game Modes
Incursion is the only type that really no one wants to play and seldom ends up the way it was intended. Players usually kill off the other team then damage the base for the win. Rarely rogues will attack the enemy base on their own, but usually they act alone and get killed off by the closest enemy mech. Better to make this either attack or defend base with one team doing either role.

Solution for Faction Play
No comment for this since I do not play Factions or care to.

Solution for Solaris
No comment for this since I do not play Solaris or care to.

General Match Maker Improvements
Until there are more players who can even out the field better, we need a two-step process. One is to make sure there are an equal number of experienced players on each team to avoid the seal clubbing that occurs. The next is to make adjustments based on team weight and mech classes. Why we continue to have teams with 6 assaults vrs. 1 is incredible. Or to have teams with 4 assaults and 8 lights, or, well you get the picture. I have seen all forms of insane combinations. Before one argues about it being more about the player skill, remember that the more armor a team fields and damage it can absorb, the better their chances. If you cannot do this, then it is time to handicap mechs and players by restricting capabilties based on an average team rating. You want to pit a Tier 1 team against Tier 3 players, cut them to 30% damage output, for example. Almost every MMORPG uses handicapping in some form to reduce seal clubbing.

8v8 vs 12v12
No comment for this since I do not play groups.

Solo / Group Queues
Face it, groups have a large influence in the map and match type selection as well as the outcome of a match. They vote as a bloc. They are mostly formed and equipped for a specific match type - Conquest or Incursion, for example. If the map choice goes against them, they become a drag on their team. The group should be required to have at least one of each mech weight. One thing I have not seen yet is a group composing 1 weapon type, like LRMs or ATMs. Matter of time. My preference is to keep solo and group matches separate. Until there are more players and this can be done, modify some of the group rules.

Examine Match Scoring (AMS)
I've been saying this for years. The match scoring is skewed against any mech that doesn't create tons of damage. That damage is rated in absolute numbers, not adjusted for mech class. A light mech doing 400 damage is far more efficient than an assault doing 750. Award damage related scores based on a multiplier of the weight class, not absolute damage numbers. Also, there is not enough credit for caps of either resources or a base. Or base destruction, as in Incursion matches. You can run a light and NARC the entire opposing team for the entire match, or cap every resource point, or cap a base for the win, or cap the domination beacon and find your PSR tanking. The AMS factor is pretty nice though doesn't go far enough in awarding match score points for contributions.

Remove 2 Minute Requirement for Reconnection
When the game crashes, I find that 2 minutes is generally barely enough time. Keep the requirement, but extend it to 3 minutes for now. Increase or decrease as more data come in.

Private Lobby Updates (More Options, Maps, Host Assignment, More Spectators)
Not really sure what you're looking for here. I do like the idea of allowing people to watch other players' matches, but without commenting to the players themselves. That would be too distracting and might ending up being an advantage.

Dailies/Weeklies
Don't really think we need that many of these so long as there are more regular events to earn stuff, esp. skill points.

That's my quick take.

[Frabby]

Did not find a more suitable thread, so here's a few random jumbled thoughts from me regarding suggestions on gameplay and modes. Please keep in mind that I'm a relatively new player - I've only really begun playing three months or so ago.

Randomize Maps
Make it so that even experienced players can be surprised:

• Seed a random amount of walls, buildings or boulders (which might turn nascar routes into dead ends) in random places.
  
• Seed gun turrets in random places that will attack either one specific team (perhaps depending on the mission), or anything that moves.
  
• Seed "minor" resource points in random places that must be found first to make scouting worthwile even on Polar Highlands.
  
• Assign ranges instead of set values for gravity, ambient temperature, light and visibility (fog/snowstorms) to maps. Randomize the exact value within those ranges for each game that starts

Change the Reward system

As it stands, it seems you're basically only rewarded for raw damage. That's not wrong per se but it does make actual mission play less appealing versus simply steamrolling the enemy. It also means it's not worht playing fast light 'Mechs to, say, scout or capture resource points or enemy bases. My suggestion is to re-balance rewards (I'll just summarily call XP, GXP and CBills "rewards") in a way that emphasizes mission play much more compared to damage dealt. This is a team game, after all, and you need to fight off the opposition anyways as a means to achieve the actual mission goal. Specifically,

All game modes:

• Give extra rewards or perhaps even a reward multiplier based on time remaining when all mission goals are completed, to give an incentive to actually get the mission done asap.

Domination:

• Treat enemy Alpha and Beta targets like an enemy 'Mech for scoring purposes, in addition to the added timer. Gives a reason to go after them beyond the rare occasion where you need to up the timer but haven't lost yet.
  
• Give rewards for every timer second you're scoring for your team (and 1.5 times that if you're the only friendly 'Mech in the domination zone)

Assault:

• Base capture timer needs to move much faster; as it stands, there is little if any point in trying unless you've curbstomped the other team already.
  
• Have an inner "attacker" perimeter (required for capturing) and an outer "defender" perimeter (having a 'Mech in the outer perimeter is enough to prevent enemies in the inner perimeter from capturing) around the bases.
  
• Allow stealthed 'Mechs to capture base.
  
• Perhaps add Alpha and Beta targets similar to Domination mode near the bases; destroying one of these each will make the base capture time move faster, or count towards 10 seconds of capture.

Skirmish:

• For lack of other mission goals that can be achieved, give a (small!) overall rewards bonus, like 20%, compared to the rewards for other modes to compensate.

Incursion:

Looks interesting, but seems to never get selected. I only played this three or so times, and didn't quite get the hang of it so I cannot really comment on that mode.
I do like the base layout from Incursion though, perhaps a subtype of Assault could be made using the walled-off Incursion base with a very short capture timer?

Siege:
No suggestions.

Queue

• Why is the FP queue not locked in for a given faction once their counter has hit 12 players?
  
  I quit the game once after I was skipped over not once but thrice in the FP queue while staying in the queue all the time for well over 20 minutes. It is endlessly frustrating, even enraging, to wait for severaly cycles to finally have 12 players per team, only to get kicked from the queue because (apparently) a bigger group just joined and your team jumps from 11 (or even 13 in one case) to over 20 applicants. This is a phenomenal waste of my precious gaming time and isn't endearing FP or MWO in general to me. And it's not helped by that weird message that claims I have a priority spot now (after the timer runs out once) when that's clearly not the case.
  
• Why does FP not immediately launch when both teams have hit 12+ players? The 2 minute countdown is annoying, and sometimes I feel like some players are just scouting for their big team, bringing them in shortly before the timer runs out and thereby robbing other players in the queue of their spot.
  
• Speaking of wasting my time, why is it not possible to be in both QP and FP queue at once (perhaps with a priority selector)?
  
• I can join a QP game while another 'Mech is still locked in another active game. When I can have two games going, why can't I have one queue and the Mech Lab?
  
  I should be able to select a 'Mech and submit that for QP queue, FP queue, or both. And while I'm waiting for a game to start, I should be able to select another 'Mech and work on it in the 'Mech Lab.

Edited by Frabby, 26 December 2020 - 03:27 AM.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Quote

Randomize Maps
Make it so that even experienced players can be surprised:

• Seed a random amount of walls, buildings or boulders (which might turn nascar routes into dead ends) in random places.
  
• Seed gun turrets in random places that will attack either one specific team (perhaps depending on the mission), or anything that moves.
  
• Seed "minor" resource points in random places that must be found first to make scouting worthwile even on Polar Highlands.
  
• Assign ranges instead of set values for gravity, ambient temperature, light and visibility (fog/snowstorms) to maps. Randomize the exact value within those ranges for each game that starts

thats only with random generated Maps thats generated with Algorithms ,not with handcrafted Maps ...we not can becomes all- interesting and good (with Good mapmakers and not like the last new Maps soalris or Uglylite Brown) Handcrafted Maps or bad looking Random Maps thats all looks the same

Edited by MW Waldorf Statler, 26 December 2020 - 09:08 PM.

[Danjo San]

We need asymmetrical game modes in Quick Play.

Team 1 needs to hold a designated area (base) and defend assets (Radio Towers), while Team 2 is attacking.
You could have 3 zones outside the base to aid the attackers (Long Tom, Aerial Support, Signal Jammer)
Team 1 is using the Radio Towers to transmit valuable data, a Mech needs to be in the zone to activate transmission. Once all the data is transmitted Team 1 wins. Team 2 can slow the transmission, by forcing the Mech out of the zone or using the Signal Jammer.
Team 2 could spawn in random locations as a full group, so the attack angles would be somewhat less predictable.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

Danjo San, on 27 December 2020 - 04:23 AM, said:

We need asymmetrical game modes in Quick Play.

Team 1 needs to hold a designated area (base) and defend assets (Radio Towers), while Team 2 is attacking.
You could have 3 zones outside the base to aid the attackers (Long Tom, Aerial Support, Signal Jammer)
Team 1 is using the Radio Towers to transmit valuable data, a Mech needs to be in the zone to activate transmission. Once all the data is transmitted Team 1 wins. Team 2 can slow the transmission, by forcing the Mech out of the zone or using the Signal Jammer.
Team 2 could spawn in random locations as a full group, so the attack angles would be somewhat less predictable.

seeing the System in Battlefield Bad Company 2 ,or the Battlefield V Campaign system for a good FP (BFV is now Cheating Field,Random Teams and no Lobby, and with a stupid Vehicle spawn System and unbalanced like Hell)..its by all Games now the Same...fastest Stressfull gameplay, no Lobbys, and many useless content for microtransactions and many blink Blink

BF V is from Dice and Dice is by the Shareholder Company 7EG tahts now have buying MWO

Edited by MW Waldorf Statler, 29 December 2020 - 01:16 AM.

[MovinTarget]

Horseman, on 08 December 2020 - 09:56 AM, said:

The gotcha is that the roles in those games are usually pre-defined by your class / vehicle / character. In MWO there is no such hard restriction, so we get geniuses who try to build things like lrm support Atlases and fail to play even that correctly.
More buckets?

I see no difference from other BT titles and MWO as far as building stupid mechs. Okay, one difference, MWO has a PvP reward system when most of the others did not which, at heart is the point of contention.

Right now the majority of the rewards stem from:
- Teamwork
- Damaging and/or destroying mechs

Objectives do diddly squat for match score and often times objectives require team play which is unreliable when queuing solo. Having role queue could address part of that, at the expense of more buckets... but at least these are buckets players have some control by queuing for a role that is needed.

On top of that, by "declaring" you are fulfilling a role, there could also be a pretty clear metric for most/all roles to indicate you are "good" at that role so if someone repeatedly queues for a role that they are poorly suited for they would eventually either get frozen out for a time or have a poor rating and not get picked so easily.

Yes, its a bit more complicated, but it would not be THAT complicated as you are getting rated for a particular job and how well you do it.

[Horseman]

VileKnight, on 16 December 2020 - 07:42 AM, said:

So.... you are saying no because someone MIGHT not play the match correctly? If that's the case, shouldn't we just take away all match types except skirmish? Just because a player might throw a fit and be TFG, doesn't mean we can't consider new match types.

I'm saying no because putting a player in the VIP role gives a single rando the power to inflict an instant loss on the entire team. For quickplay, that's ******* terrible design.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Horseman, on 28 December 2020 - 06:37 AM, said:

I'm saying no because putting a player in the VIP role gives a single rando the power to inflict an instant loss on the entire team. For quickplay, that's ******* terrible design.

Doesn't end up that bad in CoD, then again MWO has more spuds than CoD. I mean would you say that if they got to pilot the superarmored Atlas that currently is used by the VIP in escort? Also the escort would need two pickup locations not just one.

[pbiggz]

A battlefield style asymmetric rush gamemode with shifting map boundaries and respawns would be a pretty nifty addition to the game, and perhaps a more interesting alternative to the current faction play gamemodes. They might fit well into a faction play event that actually gets people into the queue.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

pbiggz, on 28 December 2020 - 12:04 PM, said:

A battlefield style asymmetric rush gamemode with shifting map boundaries and respawns would be a pretty nifty addition to the game, and perhaps a more interesting alternative to the current faction play gamemodes. They might fit well into a faction play event that actually gets people into the queue.

Like the Idea from the First days ...otherside How realistic by a Game from PGI , thasell to a Shareholder Company ,with a Russ thats looking for new own IP,a Game thats since 1(or better 2) Years in maintance mode and not have a technical Crew ???

Edited by MW Waldorf Statler, 29 December 2020 - 10:26 AM.

[pbiggz]

MW Waldorf Statler, on 29 December 2020 - 01:19 AM, said:

and How realistic by a Game from PGI , thasell to a Shareholder Company ,with a Russ thats looking for new own IP,a Game thats since 1(or better 2) Years in maintance mode and not have a technical Crew ???

This is a thread for new game modes. I have recommended a new game mode.

[MW Waldorf Statler]

pbiggz, on 29 December 2020 - 09:32 AM, said:

This is a thread for new game modes. I have recommended a new game mode.

of course https://static.mwomercs.com/forums//public/style_emoticons/default/wink.png and fine ...only nothing hear or read it from PGI ,and Dearon & Co have other Basic Problems with PGI and his working Flow ,or better no working flow..im Thinking we can make a Happy party when 7EG not close the MWO work in next Year

we writes side by side here in the Command Chair Treads, and reads nothing Feedback or Statements to the Ideas

Edited by MW Waldorf Statler, 29 December 2020 - 10:23 PM.