36 replies to this topic

[D A T A]

What about unlocking the possibility to remove the jump jets in omnmechs?

honestly, omnimechs quite suck and these restrictions make close to no sense at all nowadays, they are just a remnant of an old game where inner sphere mechs had no quirks and clan batlemechs did not exist

[Nightbird]

8 tons back on the Executioner? Hell yes, new top tier assault mech. That been said, do clans need a buff that badly?

[Y E O N N E]

There are a lot of things in this game that don't necessarily need a buff, but are still not very fun to play.

[The6thMessenger]

Nightbird, on 20 November 2020 - 04:21 PM, said:

8 tons back on the Executioner? Hell yes, new top tier assault mech. That been said, do clans need a buff that badly?

8 more tons would be nice, but meta always had liked the torso builds and you can't do a lot with Exe's torso, I would love to have a Cherbi.

Also without JJ, the Kitfox can mount a Gauss in the Torso highmounts, likewise the Timberwolf with the S-Torsi would be a lot more prolific since they mount the most hardpoints. You literally cannot double heavy-ballistic on symmetrical side because the Timberwolf only has the S with 2 locked JJ for a left-torso ballistic.

This change would open up a LOT of good options for Clan, and I would welcome it. But ****'s pretty stable now, I don't think we should be messing with it a lot more than we need to.

[VonBruinwald]

D A T A, on 20 November 2020 - 04:11 PM, said:

What about unlocking the possibility to remove the jump jets in omnmechs?

honestly, omnimechs quite suck and these restrictions make close to no sense at all nowadays, they are just a remnant of an old game where inner sphere mechs had no quirks and clan batlemechs did not exist

No.

Omnimechs have the option of switching hardpoints in exchange for fixed equipment. If you don't like the fixed equipment pick a different mech.

If we go down this road we should allow battlemechs to switch their weapon hardpoints.........

[D A T A]

VonBruinwald, on 20 November 2020 - 05:28 PM, said:

No.

Omnimechs have the option of switching hardpoints in exchange for fixed equipment. If you don't like the fixed equipment pick a different mech.

If we go down this road we should allow battlemechs to switch their weapon hardpoints.........

Are you aware that omnimechs with combined omnipods just barely get at the same level of default battlemechs, but with 3k extra restrictions? This happens because omnimech default omnipods are just pure garbage. Omnimechs fixed equipment means "get nerfed just because you dare to reach the same level of battlemechs counterpart
I guess you are not aware of that, because otherwise you wouldn't write such nonsense.

Example, timberwolf needs to combine 2-3 variants in order to be able to load 8 energy weapons.....and gets fixed **** because of that.....a marauder ii has that by default with no nerfs.....a black knight 6b has 9 by default, and has quirks too on top of that just because some pugs cried clan op

Edited by D A T A, 20 November 2020 - 06:12 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Weren't the TBR and BLK both used in Div A for laser vomit in the same couple of seasons? Despite the former having locked JJs and no quirks?

Seems like the issue is less the locked JJs and more the mobility nerfs, weapons nerfs, and further durability buffs to everything else. I don't think the unlocking the JJs will do much to help the TBR. EXE and MLX? Sure. TBR? Nah.

[VonBruinwald]

D A T A, on 20 November 2020 - 06:07 PM, said:

Are you aware that omnimechs with combined omnipods just barely get at the same level of default battlemechs, but with 3k extra restrictions? This happens because omnimech default omnipods are just pure garbage. Omnimechs fixed equipment means "get nerfed just because you dare to reach the same level of battlemechs counterpart
I guess you are not aware of that, because otherwise you wouldn't write such nonsense.

Are you aware that 90% of battlemechs are garbage because they don't have the magical combination of hardpoints and quirks needed to make them viable? This is the tier list in game:

• Top 10% of quirked battlemechs
  
• Omnimechs
  
• Remaining 90% of Battlemechs
  
• Blanner
  
• Spider

If we're gonna buff we need to buff from the bottom up, not "half way up where it's convenient for me".

[TELEFORCE]

Omni pods had removable jump jets when they were first introduced years ago. 'Mechs like the Summoner and Nova did not get removable jump jets since they were locked to the chassis. The Timber Wolf S pods benefited greatly from this, as did the Kit Fox. At the time, the devs felt this was not balanced and thus locked the jump jets to the pods.

[RickySpanish]

The Executioner is already quite good, with that much extra tonnage it's going to be flat out cray cray.

[The6thMessenger]

Miss Greene, on 20 November 2020 - 06:17 PM, said:

Seems like the issue is less the locked JJs and more the mobility nerfs, weapons nerfs, and further durability buffs to everything else. I don't think the unlocking the JJs will do much to help the TBR. EXE and MLX? Sure. TBR? Nah.

Seeing more competent dakka builds on the Timberwolf would be nice though. Guy always had been best with energy.

But it could be done by simply introducing variants without JJ. Hell, a 3B Highmount LT like the 3E highmount of the A would be god damn pretty.

Edited by The6thMessenger, 20 November 2020 - 06:38 PM.

[LordNothing]

i have no problem with with fixed equipment so long as there are omnipod options without it or with different equipment. like the kit fox.

Edited by LordNothing, 20 November 2020 - 10:09 PM.

[D A T A]

Miss Greene, on 20 November 2020 - 06:17 PM, said:

Weren't the TBR and BLK both used in Div A for laser vomit in the same couple of seasons? Despite the former having locked JJs and no quirks?

Seems like the issue is less the locked JJs and more the mobility nerfs, weapons nerfs, and further durability buffs to everything else. I don't think the unlocking the JJs will do much to help the TBR. EXE and MLX? Sure. TBR? Nah.

You are not correct.
Laser vomit is out of comp meta since early 2017
Timber is out of meta since 2015-2016
And even then, timber was used only because it was THE ONLY laser vomit available in the game back then, not because it was the best one......there were no other heavy laser vomits.....

Edited by D A T A, 21 November 2020 - 03:14 AM.

[D A T A]

VonBruinwald, on 20 November 2020 - 06:22 PM, said:

Are you aware that 90% of battlemechs are garbage because they don't have the magical combination of hardpoints and quirks needed to make them viable? This is the tier list in game:

• Top 10% of quirked battlemechs
  
• Omnimechs
  
• Remaining 90% of Battlemechs
  
• Blanner
  
• Spider

If we're gonna buff we need to buff from the bottom up, not "half way up where it's convenient for me".

Give quick look to how real players play real games in comp (which means, outside of your comfort zone that extends max to 1 meter ahead of your nose) and you will find out that you are not correct.

Most unquirked battlemechs are flat out better than omnimechs.....and most quirked battlemechs are still better than omnimechs

RickySpanish, on 20 November 2020 - 06:25 PM, said:

The Executioner is already quite good, with that much extra tonnage it's going to be flat out cray cray.

Executioner is semi decent BECAUSE of jump jets.
Without them it just becomes worse, not better

[Monkey Lover]

Sounds good lets do it. Lets not talk about it for 9 months just do it.

[martian]

The6thMessenger, on 20 November 2020 - 04:39 PM, said:

8 more tons would be nice, but meta always had liked the torso builds and you can't do a lot with Exe's torso, I would love to have a Cherbi.

I think that there will be a Christmas Sale in a month. Good opportunity to buy "Cherbi".

[RickySpanish]

D A T A, on 21 November 2020 - 03:22 AM, said:

Give quick look to how real players play real games in comp (which means, outside of your comfort zone that extends max to 1 meter ahead of your nose) and you will find out that you are not correct.

Most unquirked battlemechs are flat out better than omnimechs.....and most quirked battlemechs are still better than omnimechs


Executioner is semi decent BECAUSE of jump jets.
Without them it just becomes worse, not better

It's the MASC that makes the Executioner good at what it does imo. You could totally drop to two jets or even one jet and maintain the ability to climb up most moderate inclines with MASC and jets. MASC gets you back into cover after blasting your laser vomit, it lets you play aggressively with a 90kph escape velocity if things go wrong, and it lets you twist damage more effectively. You might have trouble filling internal slots though if you drop the jump jets, depending on your build.

Edited by RickySpanish, 21 November 2020 - 07:13 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

D A T A, on 21 November 2020 - 03:10 AM, said:

You are not correct.
Laser vomit is out of comp meta since early 2017
Timber is out of meta since 2015-2016

The Black Knight is also out of meta since 2015-2016, so what's your point? Most 'Mechs are out of meta.

I'm not arguing that we should keep the locked JJs on the 'Mech. I am saying that if you think unlocking the JJs will help the TBR then you are failing to recognize what is actually wrong with the TBR. The TBR has never struggled to fit good firepower, even with its over-sized engine and locked JJs and that is not what makes it bad. What makes it bad in 2020 is crappy hitboxes, crappy accel/decel, crappy turning, crappy size, and mostly crappy weapon mounts. Unlocking the JJs will not help it in any of these categories.

Quote

And even then, timber was used only because it was THE ONLY laser vomit available in the game back then, not because it was the best one......there were no other heavy laser vomits.....

You are not correct.

The TBR was also the dominant brawling 'Mech at the same time it was one of the dominant laser vomit 'Mechs. It was also being used with ERPPC and Gauss right up until the NTG replaced it and there were many debates over the merit of its speed versus the NTG's firepower until the Summoner got the nipple mounts to permanently put it out of that job; the PPC-Gauss TBR was still being used in MWOWC16.

There were also other laser vomit options in the EBJ and the HBK, but they were not as good because the former has similarly mediocre geo and less armor and the latter cannot fit the same firepower because it uses FF instead of Endo.
You can unlock the TBR's JJs today and the 'Mech will still be trash because it can't turn, can't accelerate, has mediocre hitboxes, and most low-slung weapons. It's a Cataphract with a snoot you can boop.

You don't need to take my word for it, either, you can go re-watch the MRBC5 through 7 and MWOWC16 recordings for yourself.

[The6thMessenger]

martian, on 21 November 2020 - 03:35 AM, said:

I think that there will be a Christmas Sale in a month. Good opportunity to buy "Cherbi".

Not unless it's under 1600 MC lol.

[General Solo]

Fix Match making rather than nerf buff mechs and weapons.
Big No OP