619 replies to this topic

[Davegt27]

Caldron could please buff light PPCs so I dont get shot in the back for 3 mins by an Light PPC Locust , just put me out of my misery

[Khobai]

justcallme A S H, on 28 June 2021 - 03:33 AM, said:

NARC is already a death sentence for the mech it hits and you wanna add +15s to it?

Heavens above... Another absolutely unbalanced idea.

huh? I dont know how you play the game but narc is not a death sentence at all.

ecm completely negates narc. you can also just hide in cover until the narc' duration ends.

[justcallme A S H]

So yesterday...

"Canyon was too open/not enough cover, brawling is too hard/ruined"

Today...

"Just find cover, NARC isn't a problem"

[Khobai]

pbiggz, on 28 June 2021 - 05:39 AM, said:

Giant NARC buffs are the kind of thing someone suggests when they don't understand what they're talking about.

seriously does everyone else just roll over and die when they get narcd?

am I the only one that knows how to counter being narcd?

justcallme A S H, on 29 June 2021 - 10:12 PM, said:

So yesterday...

"Canyon was too open/not enough cover, brawling is too hard/ruined"

Today...

"Just find cover, NARC isn't a problem"

You took my quote out of context. My quote about Canyon was with regard to brawlers and specifically the CENTER of the canyon map. There is a serious lack of cover in the CENTER where brawlers need to cross over. The rest of the map has cover.

Also theres other ways to counter narc like staying near a mech with ECM.

how are you a top tier player if you cant deal with being narcd? I mean really... narc is extremely easy to counter even a mediocre player like me has no difficulty dealing with being narcd.


Furthermore unless youre playing in a group theres not even any guarantee of having LRMs on your team. So taking NARC as a solo player ends up being a risky proposition. So even if NARC doesnt get a base duration adjustment, NARC absolutely needs to be buffed in a way that makes it more useful for solo players to take in the event their team isnt packing LRMs.


And I see no issue with buffing the base duration of NARC and changing/removing the NARC skills since it saves you from having tp waste skill points to get the NARC duration buffs. Its no different from Cauldron buffing mobility or jumpjets so people dont have to put points in the mobility or jumpjet skill trees. But of course you ignored the whole part of my post where I talked about changing or even removing the enhanced narc skill nodes.

Add +15s to base duration of narc. remove -15s from the enhanced narc skill nodes. its the exact same effect without the narc user having to waste precious skill points. the goal being to make it less penalizing to use NARC.

Thats also the point of adding utility hardpoints to certain mechs so they can take utility equipment like TAG/NARC without giving up a weapon hardpoint. Again so mechs arnt penalized as much for taking NARC.

Edited by Khobai, 29 June 2021 - 10:37 PM.

[Vxheous]

Khobai, on 29 June 2021 - 10:16 PM, said:

seriously does everyone else just roll over and die when they get narcd?

am I the only one that knows how to counter being narcd?



You took my quote out of context. My quote about Canyon was with regard to brawlers and specifically the CENTER of the canyon map. There is a serious lack of cover in the CENTER where brawlers need to cross over. The rest of the map has cover.

Also theres other ways to counter narc like staying near a mech with ECM.

how are you a top tier player if you cant deal with being narcd? I mean really... narc is extremely easy to counter even a mediocre player like me has no difficulty dealing with being narcd.


Furthermore unless youre playing in a group theres not even any guarantee of having LRMs on your team. So taking NARC as a solo player ends up being a risky proposition. So even if NARC doesnt need a duration buff, NARC absolutely needs to be buffed in a way that makes it more useful for solo players to take in the event their team isnt packing LRMs.


And I see no issue with buffing the base duration of NARC and changing/removing the NARC skills since it saves you from having waste of skill points to get the NARC duration buffs. Its no different from Cauldron buffing mobility or jumpjets so people dont have to put points in the mobility or jumpjet skill trees. But of course you ignored the whole part of my post where I talked about changing or even removing the enhanced narc skill nodes.

Dealing with Narc is easy, since it's just hide behind cover until it fades, except that is an extremely unfun mechanic, much like getting getting hit with flamers. Narc basically has the ability to nullify someone for the duration of it's effect, or that person risks getting nuked by lock ons from every direction (of course dependent on the opposing team actually having lock ons).

Dealing with narc is fine, just means you sit there and be completely passive, which is the part that's an issue. This is unlike a brawler finding ways to use cover to approach without being seen/etc, because even that cover doesn't always block LRM fire (which if you're narc'ed as a brawler, you're not closing, period).

Edited by Vxheous, 29 June 2021 - 10:31 PM.

[Dogstar]

Vxheous, on 29 June 2021 - 10:28 PM, said:

much like getting getting hit with flamers. Narc basically has the ability to nullify someone for the duration of it's effect,

Isn't that a valid design point though? It might be difficult for that person for that brief period but having a variety of weapon effects allows for a broader range of gameplay. Narc and flamers have their uses and their counters, so to me it's worth keeping them even if the precise intensity/duration of their effects are balanced.

[Khobai]

Vxheous, on 29 June 2021 - 10:28 PM, said:

Dealing with Narc is easy, since it's just hide behind cover until it fades, except that is an extremely unfun mechanic, much like getting getting hit with flamers. Narc basically has the ability to nullify someone for the duration of it's effect, or that person risks getting nuked by lock ons from every direction (of course dependent on the opposing team actually having lock ons).

Dealing with narc is fine, just means you sit there and be completely passive, which is the part that's an issue. This is unlike a brawler finding ways to use cover to approach without being seen/etc, because even that cover doesn't always block LRM fire (which if you're narc'ed as a brawler, you're not closing, period).

But im not looking to increase the duration of NARC beyond whats already possible.

Merely removing the involvement of skill points to get the same duration

[Ekson Valdez]

@everyone,
the topic of the thread is the balance of light mechs. If you like to discuss other balance aspects like certain equipment, please open another thread about such.

[PocketYoda]

Its easy to balance light mechs.. make them bigger and slow them back to legitimate BT speeds.

[pattonesque]

MechaGnome, on 30 June 2021 - 05:30 AM, said:

Its easy to balance light mechs.. make them bigger and slow them back to legitimate BT speeds.

I know it is very scary to have to aim but it is entirely possible and you should try it instead of freaking out every time you see a light

[MechNexus]

MechaGnome, on 30 June 2021 - 05:30 AM, said:

Its easy to balance light mechs.. make them bigger and slow them back to legitimate BT speeds.

I hope this is sarcasm.

[pbiggz]

MechNexus, on 30 June 2021 - 05:38 AM, said:

I hope this is sarcasm.

You know it isn't

[Vyx]

As an aside, what do you all think about the following idea?

Why not grant the ECM skill nodes the additional effect of reducing NARC duration?

For example-
"Enhanced ECM +22.5%" : Decreases the Max Range at which an ECM-protected 'Mech can be targeted, decreases the Cooldown Duration required before Stealth Armor can be re-activated, and decreases the NARC Duration effect after being NARCed by an enemy.

Being that you need to invest 1 slot and 1 ton and a significant portion of the Sensor Skill tree to gain some necessary empowerment, wouldn't it be nice if they truly reflected 'Enhanced ECM'? Reduction of NARC Duration seems only natural, IMO.

Thoughts?

[SafeScanner]

would'nt be much point a narc cannot transmit its location while under ecm bubble then it just comes to playing smart and staying inside bubble till effect wears off

[Vyx]

NARC nullifies your ECM when you are hit.

This proposal would reduce the NARC Duration you personally must endure -- due to having 'Enhanced ECM'.

Edited by Vyx, 30 June 2021 - 06:55 AM.

[ThreeStooges]

I got a rvn 2x set up for narcing. People still have no clue what narc is or does. Waste of tons and skill tree is what it really is. Why 2x? It has the much faster cd on missiles unless you want to wait 7 seconds. -.06 cd quirk on 3l is a joke.

How about you start making non-ecm mechs and the other lights over 20 tons more capable of combat as the game rewards damage above all else? Scouting is nothing more than spend 80,000 on two uavs since you know every one is going to lemming to the same spot any way. Even the redo highlands proves this as dom point is still h9.

[Khobai]

ThreeStooges, on 30 June 2021 - 07:12 AM, said:

How about you start making non-ecm mechs and the other lights over 20 tons more capable of combat as the game rewards damage above all else?

The problem is thats not battletech.

a 20 ton mech is not supposed to be equal to a 100 ton mech in combat.

the only way to make light mechs feel like their battletech counterparts is to introduce roles for them besides combat.

[SafeScanner]

Vyx, on 30 June 2021 - 06:49 AM, said:

NARC nullifies your ECM when you are hit.

This proposal would reduce the NARC Duration you personally must endure -- due to having 'Enhanced ECM'.

you can stack ecm so if one ecm mech got hit by a narc a second ecm mech will cover plus if there is more than mech in the bubble it turns into a roulette

anyways this is a light too powerful thread not a narc buff,

if a light with ecm/stealth get narced it can just run into a friendly ecm (assuming it does not get lrm'ed to death) and be safe and depending on location it could use the time to destealth and cooldown for another run

[Vyx]

Khobai, on 30 June 2021 - 08:09 AM, said:

The problem is thats not battletech.

a 20 ton mech is not supposed to be equal to a 100 ton mech in combat.

the only way to make light mechs feel like their battletech counterparts is to introduce roles for them besides combat.

Sadly, while this is true, it is well beyond the scope and willingness of PGI to address.

It has been this way for years. Anything other than the twitchy, 15 min, e-sport mentality is beyond them.

[YueFei]

pattonesque, on 30 June 2021 - 05:32 AM, said:

I know it is very scary to have to aim but it is entirely possible and you should try it instead of freaking out every time you see a light

Some people can't admit to being outplayed.

Some Light mech players move predictably and I can actually hit them (sometimes ).

Other Light mech players are able to consistently "read" when I'm tracking/pulling-lead and juke my every shot, and make me look stupid. That's not Light mechs being overpowered, that's just me getting outplayed. Maybe I should be less predictable in when and how I pull the trigger?