Jump to content

Is Ac20 Seem Useless?


92 replies to this topic

#21 Dogstar

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 1,725 posts
  • Twitch: Link
  • LocationLondon

Posted 11 July 2021 - 11:41 PM

I find that almost anything with an AC20 is fun but even so I don't fit them to Maulers. My go to AC20 mechs are the Urbanmech, Centurion, and a Triple AC20 Victor

#22 PocketYoda

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Shredder
  • Shredder
  • 4,147 posts
  • LocationAustralia

Posted 12 July 2021 - 12:47 AM

View PostDogstar, on 11 July 2021 - 11:41 PM, said:

I find that almost anything with an AC20 is fun but even so I don't fit them to Maulers. My go to AC20 mechs are the Urbanmech, Centurion, and a Triple AC20 Victor


I usually go heavy gauss on mine and they work Amazingly but i wanted to play some variant without heavy gauss.. having six mechs with all the same builds gets old.. I've run 6 ac2 which is also really good but in the end i've decided 4x lbx 5 work.

#23 SPNKRGrenth

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 184 posts

Posted 12 July 2021 - 01:04 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 10 July 2021 - 09:28 PM, said:

Literally like throwing slow beach balls at the enemy.. These were once great but now i'm not sure what others think but they are incredibly slow and feel terrible to use..

What the hell happened to them.


At what point were they once great compared to their current state. I genuinely want to know what you're comparing them against. 2013 when it was only slow IS mechs and no armor or structure quirks?

Ever since their velocity buff this March/April to what, 900 velocity? Their projectile has factually become the fastest it has ever been in the entirety of the game.

That said, just like with any weapon system, it matters how you're trying to use them, on what mech they're installed, and what playstyle you're trying to use with said mech and said loadout.

#24 Dogstar

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 1,725 posts
  • Twitch: Link
  • LocationLondon

Posted 12 July 2021 - 07:27 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 12 July 2021 - 12:47 AM, said:

I usually go heavy gauss on mine and they work Amazingly but i wanted to play some variant without heavy gauss.. having six mechs with all the same builds gets old.. I've run 6 ac2 which is also really good but in the end i've decided 4x lbx 5 work.


Hmmm...

The Mauler builds I've got at the moment are...

MAL-KO - 4xLRM15+2xML
MAL-1P - 2xGR+2xPPC
MAL-1R® - 4xLRM15a+4xMG
MAL-MX90 - 4xRAC2

Time to switch it up I think and try some fun Mauler builds from here: https://grimmechs.is...chname&s=Mauler

#25 Bl00dbeard

    Member

  • PipPip
  • The Scattershot
  • The Scattershot
  • 24 posts

Posted 12 July 2021 - 09:01 PM

Yeah IS AC/20's are garbage. Don't mix them with SRM's or MRMS, and definitely do not ever put them all on an Atlas or an IS Orion with them fat, fat armor quirks.

That's my job. I will face hug you. And I will win.

I'm a literal trash tier player. My only 900+ damage matches ever have all involved the above combo. Stay out of my garbage heap. You should stick with machine gun lights or ppc mediums. :)

#26 PocketYoda

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Shredder
  • Shredder
  • 4,147 posts
  • LocationAustralia

Posted 14 July 2021 - 07:16 PM

View PostSPNKRGrenth, on 12 July 2021 - 01:04 AM, said:

At what point were they once great compared to their current state. I genuinely want to know what you're comparing them against. 2013 when it was only slow IS mechs and no armor or structure quirks?

Ever since their velocity buff this March/April to what, 900 velocity? Their projectile has factually become the fastest it has ever been in the entirety of the game.

That said, just like with any weapon system, it matters how you're trying to use them, on what mech they're installed, and what playstyle you're trying to use with said mech and said loadout.


I get your point but i found them ok in 2017 and a bit onward. I had dual AC20 two ml on my mauler and a king crab with flamers and machine guns minced me in seconds.. I fired about 6 AC20 into his core and he had a brown paper doll.. After that i gave up using them, too slow, useless..

View PostBl00dbeard, on 12 July 2021 - 09:01 PM, said:

Yeah IS AC/20's are garbage. Don't mix them with SRM's or MRMS, and definitely do not ever put them all on an Atlas or an IS Orion with them fat, fat armor quirks.

That's my job. I will face hug you. And I will win.

I'm a literal trash tier player. My only 900+ damage matches ever have all involved the above combo. Stay out of my garbage heap. You should stick with machine gun lights or ppc mediums. Posted Image

Dual rac 5s work way better on Atlas. hell even an lbx 20 is better

View PostDogstar, on 12 July 2021 - 07:27 AM, said:


Hmmm...

The Mauler builds I've got at the moment are...

MAL-KO - 4xLRM15+2xML
MAL-1P - 2xGR+2xPPC
MAL-1R® - 4xLRM15a+4xMG
MAL-MX90 - 4xRAC2

Time to switch it up I think and try some fun Mauler builds from here: https://grimmechs.is...chname&s=Mauler

I never use lrms its a life choice if i have to use missiles i'll use srms or mrms.. Using Lrms makes me feel dirty and are a disservice to my teams.

Edited by MechaGnome, 14 July 2021 - 07:23 PM.


#27 My Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Major General
  • Major General
  • 475 posts

Posted 15 July 2021 - 12:19 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 14 July 2021 - 07:16 PM, said:

Dual rac 5s work way better on Atlas. hell even an lbx 20 is better


Why would you want to use a weapon that forces you to face tank after the Atlas has gotten such a signifcant mobility buff?

#28 MechNexus

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • The Guide
  • The Guide
  • 187 posts

Posted 15 July 2021 - 04:32 AM

Atlas can roll damage pretty well if you're on top of your twisting. It is not a mech you want to stare with, and that's exactly what RACs make you do.

Legit, AC20s are powerful weapons. 20 damage pinpoint is bloody scary.

#29 Dogstar

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 1,725 posts
  • Twitch: Link
  • LocationLondon

Posted 15 July 2021 - 05:31 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 14 July 2021 - 07:16 PM, said:

I never use lrms its a life choice if i have to use missiles i'll use srms or mrms.. Using Lrms makes me feel dirty and are a disservice to my teams.


Maybe the way you play but I can assure you that a quad lrm15 mech with plenty of ammo and a bit of aggression can put some serious hurt on an enemy team

#30 MyriadDigits

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Shredder
  • Shredder
  • 282 posts

Posted 15 July 2021 - 12:54 PM

View PostMechaGnome, on 14 July 2021 - 07:16 PM, said:


I get your point but i found them ok in 2017 and a bit onward. I had dual AC20 two ml on my mauler and a king crab with flamers and machine guns minced me in seconds.. I fired about 6 AC20 into his core and he had a brown paper doll.. After that i gave up using them, too slow, useless..


https://mech.nav-alp...4ad34e32_MAL-2P

https://mech.nav-alp...9fe6353_KGC-000
There's no way you actually managed 6 shells into CT if the paper doll showed a fresh CT. Flat out that's gonna be about 75% of the CT armor gone, which is more than enough to get a color change, however if the KGC was fresh when it engaged you that wouldn't be enough damage to bust through the CT armor into structure unless somebody else had worked on the crab before it got to you. Either you didn't see how much you rekt the CT armor by the time you died (and mistook the fresh structure as fresh mech), or you didn't actually hit CT as you claimed (unlikely, KGC CT is very easy to hit especially when its a 90m face hug staredown build).

That said, if you were twisting as one should with an AC20 build (especially an AC20 build facing a staredown mech), you should've had plenty of time to beat down that absolute meme of a KGC if you actually were planting shells in CT as you claimed. Of course flamers are a factor here, but those don't push past 90%, if the Mauler was skilled you'd be well within the realm of ignoring the flamers.

You losing against that KGC was not a matter of AC20 sucking, it falls more in the realm of a PEBKAC error than anything else.

Also, AC20 velocity against a face hugging staredown King Crab of all things would be entirely irrelevant in the fight. Don't know why you're complaining about AC20 velo when getting spanked in a fight where the velo was an actual non factor to the outcome of the fight that made you suddenly decide AC20 is bad.

#31 PocketYoda

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Shredder
  • Shredder
  • 4,147 posts
  • LocationAustralia

Posted 17 July 2021 - 05:12 PM

View PostMy Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, on 15 July 2021 - 12:19 AM, said:

Why would you want to use a weapon that forces you to face tank after the Atlas has gotten such a signifcant mobility buff?


Because its an Atlas..

#32 My Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Major General
  • Major General
  • 475 posts

Posted 17 July 2021 - 05:33 PM

View PostMechaGnome, on 17 July 2021 - 05:12 PM, said:

Because its an Atlas..


Yes, its an Atlas and has a torso twist rate that competes with and is even better than some heavies. So why throw that out and braindead face tank people?

#33 Katrina Steiner

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 161 posts
  • LocationTharkad

Posted 17 July 2021 - 06:34 PM

My main mech of choice is the boomjager as I love it. The AC/20 is a great weapon and whats better than 1 AC/20...2 of them. Take a mech with quirks though. Also you have to lead faster mechs when shooting them.

#34 Wildstreak

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Civil Servant
  • Civil Servant
  • 5,154 posts

Posted 17 July 2021 - 06:41 PM

AC20 is fine, my Champion with AC20 + 4MLs is doing OK.

#35 Elizander

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 7,540 posts
  • LocationPhilippines

Posted 17 July 2021 - 08:11 PM

View PostMechaGnome, on 10 July 2021 - 09:28 PM, said:

Literally like throwing slow beach balls at the enemy.. These were once great but now i'm not sure what others think but they are incredibly slow and feel terrible to use..

What the hell happened to them.


From personal experience, AC20s only feel great near the end of a match. DPS-wise they aren't worth writing home about so against a fully armored mech, reducing 20 damage in 1 shot or doing it over a 1.3 second burn from lasers isn't any different at all when you're talking about 80+ points of armor and even more internals.

AC20s feel nice near the end because you get those 1 shot hits when the mechs are heavily damaged and that is when they feel impactful.

I play my HBK-4G a lot and for 70% of the game I feel severely undergunned. 35 alpha damage for a 50 tonner? It's a joke. Not enough armor to facetank spam the faster ROF of the AC20 either. The highly boosted AC20 velocity on the 4G is what I feel the baseline speed should be.

Compared to LB20X which has higher velocity, that feels so much better to use even if the damage is spread.

I think that all the underlying problems with the AC20 lies with the projectile velocity. They need to bump it up and not be shy about it and they need to kick the ghost heat up to 2. We go back to Dual H.Gauss and no one I know can give a good reason why 2 AC20s can't shoot together.

The AC20 is supposed to be a big gun, but doesn't feel that way until you're shooting a half-dead target. The projectile speed is too slow to accurately target components on a moving target which reduces it's pinpoint front-loaded damage role when you can't even hit the same spot twice. If nothing else, they should just boost the projectile velocity and not in these pansy +100 m/s numbers. Posted Image

#36 The Basilisk

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Mercenary
  • The Mercenary
  • 3,270 posts
  • LocationFrankfurt a.M.

Posted 17 July 2021 - 11:12 PM

View PostMechNexus, on 11 July 2021 - 08:04 AM, said:

AC20s are fine. The velocity isn't an issue for the range you're meant to use them in, and slapping someone with 20 points of damage pinpoint is hard to argue with. Sure, Hgauss hits harder, but it's heavy af and has a charge time. The classic AC20+SRMs combo is hard to beat, and AC20+Triple snub is even spicier. AC20+MRMs are also quite effective.


Actually I prefer the 4MRM10 and AC20 Loadout on my Atlas, since its nice to have some range flexibility in QP.

#37 The Basilisk

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Mercenary
  • The Mercenary
  • 3,270 posts
  • LocationFrankfurt a.M.

Posted 17 July 2021 - 11:21 PM

View PostDogstar, on 15 July 2021 - 05:31 AM, said:


Maybe the way you play but I can assure you that a quad lrm15 mech with plenty of ammo and a bit of aggression can put some serious hurt on an enemy team


Jep, the Nightstar Wolf Phoenix with quad ALRM15 and 4 medium lasers BAP and Sensorquirks.
At 320-350m this goes right through most ams barricades.

#38 pattonesque

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 1,449 posts

Posted 18 July 2021 - 06:15 AM

View PostMechaGnome, on 17 July 2021 - 05:12 PM, said:


Because its an Atlas..


The Atlas in this game is able to tank an extraordinary amount of damage — over 900 in many cases — but I am very sorry to tell you that this requires you to actually utilize the mech’s strengths rather than staring at the enemy and wondering why you keep dying immediately

#39 MechNexus

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • The Guide
  • The Guide
  • 187 posts

Posted 18 July 2021 - 08:22 AM

View Postpattonesque, on 18 July 2021 - 06:15 AM, said:

The Atlas in this game is able to tank an extraordinary amount of damage — over 900 in many cases — but I am very sorry to tell you that this requires you to actually utilize the mech’s strengths rather than staring at the enemy and wondering why you keep dying immediately


To add onto this, the atlas, like any mech in the game, will absoloutely melt under sustained fire if you just stare at the enemy. However, if you utilise it's extremely narrow CT hitbox running through most of the body by staying on top of your twisting, you can roll an impressive amount of damage. Utilise high impact, slow firing weaponry like Snub PPCs, Heavy gauss, SRMs, MRMs, and AC/LB/UAC20s to maximise damage for minimal facetime. There's a reason why almost every atlas build is primarially a ballistics+missiles brawler.

#40 Alex Morgaine

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Bad Company
  • Bad Company
  • 2,049 posts

Posted 18 July 2021 - 04:48 PM

makes for a fun game of dodgeball :D





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users