33 replies to this topic

[Davegt27]

we tried to tell them let the map guy work on truly bad maps first

that way he can work on his map modding skills

the good things about HPG
nice wide rams (very cool)
fixed the NASCAR problem (not a problem for me)

what I like to say about HPG is you fixed the broken arm but the patient died

I recommend moving on to other maps
leave HPG alone for the time being it not super bad (I just don't vote for it anymore)

onward and upward Alpine peaks maybe ?

how about the original Terra Therma just double the size of the choke points (or block off the center)

did I mention narrow choke points are very bad

[zzoxx]

justcallme A S H, on 09 September 2021 - 04:24 AM, said:

Just because they are on the wall does not mean they are sniping.


Anyway some of you guys probably need to watch this video

Well dear Ash, this was just 3 days after release. It's another world now. Believe me.
People are fleeing to the basement after spawning, that's part of the reality too.
Nice video of BrioS anyway, appreciate the work he put into this.

[ScrapIron Prime]

I quite like the map, actually. It’s very rewarding to generalist builds which I favor. (Mix of weapons such as LL/PPC/AC10/LBX backed by SRM or ML. You can brawl and also shoot back at the long range folks.) The ramps give you ample opportunity to hunt the wall humpers and if you don’t stand around in the middle like a fool, there’s plenty of cover.

honestly, I should do a tutorial on it, but I’m not sure the haters would stop hating the map even with instructions and illustrations of where and how.

Edited by ScrapIron Prime, 10 September 2021 - 04:30 AM.

[justcallme A S H]

zzoxx, on 10 September 2021 - 02:48 AM, said:

Well dear Ash, this was just 3 days after release. It's another world now. Believe me.
People are fleeing to the basement after spawning, that's part of the reality too.
Nice video of BrioS anyway, appreciate the work he put into this.

Given I've played I would guess 80 matches on the map and the majority was after a week of the map being out there.

I'm not seeing anymore snipers on the walls - I'm actually seeing less. I have not say on the wall really apart from maybe 2-3 games. The rest is fought in the mid ground exactly as Brios describes.

Yes there are a small portion of people playing long range (just as there always was). It is up to players to use the abundance of cover that now exists in the mid ground and there is, plenty.

HPG is almost always getting voted for. If it was 'so hated', why does it continue to be voted for? Those two things just do not align I'm afraid.

[zzoxx]

justcallme A S H, on 10 September 2021 - 07:15 AM, said:

Given I've played I would guess 80 matches on the map and the majority was after a week of the map being out there.

I'm not seeing anymore snipers on the walls - I'm actually seeing less. I have not say on the wall really apart from maybe 2-3 games. The rest is fought in the mid ground exactly as Brios describes.

Yes there are a small portion of people playing long range (just as there always was). It is up to players to use the abundance of cover that now exists in the mid ground and there is, plenty.

HPG is almost always getting voted for. If it was 'so hated', why does it continue to be voted for? Those two things just do not align I'm afraid.

OK, i have a slightly different experience. But i only played probably 20 matches. Maybe that's not the complete picture. Why is it voted for often? The map gets voted because it's the new map. And players are always starved for new maps, like i am too. But i feel the percentage of votes for HPG already already dropping. And like i said one evening the first call on voip on my team was "Lets go basement!" on 2 of 3 drops. And then people go there. I think there are other ways, but maybe more guys need to watch the video. Just hoping that hiding in the cellar will not become the new nascar.

I don't agree with the "only small portion of players" part regarding extreme long range. It is a lot of it right now in my opinion. And people don't just do their sniping thing like they used to, which would be absolutely fine. There are individuals that are not with the team anymore in any way or at least take advantageous positions. Like the HPG walls. It is even worse than that. These guys sit on the out of bounds border / red line by themselves with Clan ER Larges / ECM and take potshots the whole match. In weird spots you never seen anybody ever. Like B7 on River City or literally the spawns of the old Frozen maps. Usually they die last, snatch a kill or 2 on the remaining beaten up reds that are trying to get there across the open. Just for the personal victory. Really strange. Maybe these guys just drop extreme long range all the time to finally get on top of these sweet HPG walls? These guys sit completely way back and chill almost every match you meet them. Must be a reason for that and new HPG is my personal suspect.

I liked the map when it dropped, i don't feel the need to have it changed neither. But i hope people adapt and the quota of just annoying matches, for me personally, will be a little lower. If it's voted, i'll take it and hope for the best. But it's not the big love for HPG anymore.

[justcallme A S H]

Provide me some proof then that it is more than 1-3 mechs per match more often than not.

I literally watch a collective 15-20hrs of twitch streamers a day at the moment and all Tiers, most matches, it's 1-3 snipers max.
If it's a lot, I'm not seeing it, not anywhere - hence I'm very sure many making comments around it are not being in any way objective or understanding the greater landscape.

Map changes and weapon balance changes will result in players using new areas of maps. So what you're saying, while having an issue with it, is completely normal and actually smart. Doing the same thing, playing the same way, on a revamped map - isn't smart.

Edited by justcallme A S H, 10 September 2021 - 05:07 PM.

[zzoxx]

justcallme A S H, on 10 September 2021 - 05:05 PM, said:

Provide me some proof then that it is more than 1-3 mechs per match more often than not.

I literally watch a collective 15-20hrs of twitch streamers a day at the moment and all Tiers, most matches, it's 1-3 snipers max.
If it's a lot, I'm not seeing it, not anywhere - hence I'm very sure many making comments around it are not being in any way objective or understanding the greater landscape.

Map changes and weapon balance changes will result in players using new areas of maps. So what you're saying, while having an issue with it, is completely normal and actually smart. Doing the same thing, playing the same way, on a revamped map - isn't smart.

Well, if you are watching 15 - 20 hrs of MWO Twitch streams a day you must be right. I can't compete with that.
Forget about it. I see where this is going. 07.

[MadDach5und]

A lot of the posts in this thread are sour grapes coming from lifelong brawlers who just itch to circle the drain and don't shoot a single thing until they are ten steps away. Guess what? The game was designed with LRMs, PPCs, and Gauss Rifles for a reason. You just forgot what it was.

The result of the new HPG design and it's immediate popularity has changed the whole game, not just that singular map. Long range is cool again! Sniping long range maps like Alpine Peaks and Rubellite Oasis have come back from the voting graveyard to be played again. Because players have ADAPTED their mechs accordingly, and vote to their design advantage.

I'm further grateful for this change because of pilots being forced to take out a half dozen tiny lasers to put in a PPC or something with longer range, LRMs are no longer fringe, and pilots can no longer be ignorant of the need for TEAM cooperation getting missile locks and actually USING their UAV consumables. We actually NEED team communications to call out where snipers are lurking.

It's a good thing. I'm not going to tell brawlers to "Git Gud" because most already are - but games and maps that don't pander to your best side are not "Wrong"

What IS wrong -- Not modifying your play, or mech design - and blaming someone/something else for your poor performance.

[randomxtc16]

Side note to the Devs....

People have missed the point of this thread,

SO I will clarify it,
The map looks like **** and you need to clean it up.

Fix the holes that are along the walls and in the basement (level out the terrain around the ramps)

Make the ground inside the walls FLAT, None of this stupid "furniture" or uneven terrain that people keep getting stuck in

& for FFS

Fix the Assualt base spawn points.
That **** is so unbalanced: The F line Base spawn side is in the middle where the mechs spawn but the C/D Base spawn line is off to the left and right next to the wall entrance. FIX THAT ****.

I dont care about the nascar wallsniping basement brawling. I care about the map itself looking like a child was given the keyboard and allowed to "mess around with the settings."


PGI, WE KNOW YOU JUST WANT PEOPLE TO SPEND MONEY ON YOUR PRODUCT SO "YOU CAN MAKE A LIVING" BUT FOR ACTUAL F#CK SAKE, PUT FORTH SOME EFFORT, SURELY GREED FOR A DOLLAR HASNT OVERCOME LOVE FOR THE BRAND/WHAT YOU DO??? A BETTER PRODUCT = MORE $$$ (YAY FOR EVERYONE) > CHEAP SOLUTIONS (WOMPWOMP)

I hope this reaches someone important with actual decission making authority to "Do Good," TY and have a pleasant day!

[MadDach5und]

randomxtc16, on 11 September 2021 - 11:06 AM, said:

Fix the Assault base spawn points.
That **** is so unbalanced: The F line Base spawn side is in the middle where the mechs spawn but the C/D Base spawn line is off to the left and right next to the wall entrance. FIX THAT ****.

Why the hell does that matter? Players instantly move when they get dropped, and the other team isn't going to scramble over so the whole map SO fast that the extra 100 yards to the left is an impossible distance to overtake.

There's a crapload of cosmetic / visual gaps at the bottom of the walls between the dirt and the superstructure, and it DOES look really sloppy. But I haven't gotten hung up in any spots yet, so I'm assuming the collision blocks have been placed correctly.

[PraetorGix]

Davegt27, on 09 September 2021 - 07:48 PM, said:

we tried to tell them let the map guy work on truly bad maps first

Yeeeah, this is gonna be awkward, dunno how to tell you this... HPG WAS one of the truly bad ones. Top 3 truly bad maps even.
Maybe spend less time fearing the snipers and more time moving to the center zones, you know, the ones with a crapton of cover? And then the big bad snipers won't have visual on you for as long as you take cover.

On a different topic, this map is sorely in need of a cleanup. Francois seems to be great at high level conceptualizing and game flow design, but pretty weak at detail and polishing. We still have floating rocks in Canyon, and this is his most sloppy work yet. Please PGI let him take some time to clear and clean all the tiny and not so tiny mistakes in the already released maps before continuing with other maps.

[Mochyn Pupur]

justcallme A S H, on 10 September 2021 - 07:15 AM, said:

Given I've played I would guess 80 matches on the map and the majority was after a week of the map being out there.

I'm not seeing anymore snipers on the walls - I'm actually seeing less. I have not say on the wall really apart from maybe 2-3 games. The rest is fought in the mid ground exactly as Brios describes.

Yes there are a small portion of people playing long range (just as there always was). It is up to players to use the abundance of cover that now exists in the mid ground and there is, plenty.

HPG is almost always getting voted for. If it was 'so hated', why does it continue to be voted for? Those two things just do not align I'm afraid.

. . then you most certainly need to replace those rose tinted glasses you're wearing - lmao!

justcallme A S H, on 10 September 2021 - 05:05 PM, said:

Provide me some proof then that it is more than 1-3 mechs per match more often than not.

I literally watch a collective 15-20hrs of twitch streamers a day at the moment and all Tiers, most matches, it's 1-3 snipers max.
If it's a lot, I'm not seeing it, not anywhere - hence I'm very sure many making comments around it are not being in any way objective or understanding the greater landscape.

Map changes and weapon balance changes will result in players using new areas of maps. So what you're saying, while having an issue with it, is completely normal and actually smart. Doing the same thing, playing the same way, on a revamped map - isn't smart.

Also guessing you are very much sleep deprived watching that amount of streaming; no wonder you are seeing (or rather not seeing) what everyone else is . . . . bad map, worse game play than ever before.

[bcbovee78]

I have a few maps I just leave when i see them selected. I'm here to have fun playing a game I like. I used to like this map, but now its a crap show with too many players on walls. its worse than the old Canyon network, as in, you are pretty much stuck in a valley the whole match, like fish in a barrel, and no way up unless I run all the way around to their spawn. ummm, yeah...not going to make it, cause, fish in a barrel....so, this is now, (leave as soon as i see it pop) map....stop breaking things that arent broken, and fix what actually needs to be fixed on these maps....the whole map is now an area of concern.....and this is the last time i concern myself with it....

[ScrapIron Prime]

bcbovee78, on 21 September 2021 - 10:08 AM, said:

I have a few maps I just leave when i see them selected. I'm here to have fun playing a game I like. I used to like this map, but now its a crap show with too many players on walls. its worse than the old Canyon network, as in, you are pretty much stuck in a valley the whole match, like fish in a barrel, and no way up unless I run all the way around to their spawn. ummm, yeah...not going to make it, cause, fish in a barrel....so, this is now, (leave as soon as i see it pop) map....stop breaking things that arent broken, and fix what actually needs to be fixed on these maps....the whole map is now an area of concern.....and this is the last time i concern myself with it....

I think the counter argument has been "any map that only allows ring-around-the-mountain-in-the-middle" as a play style is in fact broken and needs work. It might have been a comfortable mountain, but it was still limiting.