27 replies to this topic

[Thorqemada]

Byte Size Tech about 32GB vs 64GB Ram:
Is 64 GB of RAM Overrated? - YouTube

Somewhere around 7 minutes he admits he play Battletech...that is why i brought it up.
The RAM diskussion is a luxury problem, either size is good enough for gaming PCs.

[ScrapIron Prime]

You don’t even need 32 unless you’re crunching databases. No game is written with 32 in mind or the complaints of trying to play it would kill sales.

[LordNothing]

i got by on 8 for years, then 16 in my previous machine, now im running 32. thats probibly more than enough unless you are doing a lot of multitasking or productivity tasks or running virtual machines (which is why i wanted 32). if you are just playing games, 16 is probibly enough.

Edited by LordNothing, 16 April 2022 - 02:12 PM.

[Meep Meep]

As a rule since the days of the 386 I've always doubled the ram over what was considered the current standard amount as the extra cost is minimal and removes the possibility of not finding another ram stick with the same brand and specs if you needed to upgrade. I currently have 32 gigs but that is pure overkill as most games still run perfectly fine on 8 gigs though more and more are starting to go over that limit but few use more than 16 unless its a complex simulation or has very large maps like some turn based strategy games.

[LordNothing]

minecraft can and will use all the ram. especially on newer versions with the new world height limits. its the only thing i have that eats enough ram to justify 32+gb.

on windows 11, at least the clean install (plus drivers and antivirus) on my previous machine, the system seems to reserve 4gb (out of 16gb) for itself. in this day and age 4gb is not much, but i considerer it unacceptable that the system eats up a quarter of the ram. so id say 32 is a good number for a windows 11 machine.

if you are running minecraft on windows 11, then you could justify 64. thats the only common scenario in which id recommend 64gb.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Minecraft doesn't have to use that much RAM. If you have the view distance cranked out and are hosting multiple players then it does, otherwise you can go to the Java entry in your control panel and enter a runtime parameter to limit the range of memory its allowed to use.

[Meep Meep]

I use java minecraft to run the rlcraft mod and it rarely gets to 3 gigs system memory usage even though I have it set to use up to 4 gigs. The mod does use an older version of minecraft so that might be why.

[latinisator]

I have to confess that I liked Tech Deals some time ago when he was doing reasonable builds and offering smart advice. Quite frank, do you have multiple games at once opened?! Come on, that is just nonsense. Oh yeah, WoWarships needs time to load. Boo-hoo, cry me a river..

My main rig (i7 8700, RTX 2060) has 32GB, but do I need them? Nah. Bought them because they were cheap (few years ago) and looked nice. Would I need 64GB? Again: nah.
My office "rig" sports 16GB and is fine with that - even with the APU (R7 5700g; overkill, I know) while gaming. If I were to build a new computer, then I would most probably go with 32GB DDR5 (and reasonable speed - APU again) but not 64GB. Waste of money and imho better to be invested in buying a larger and/or better SSD / NVMe.

[LordNothing]

ScrapIron Prime, on 18 April 2022 - 01:16 PM, said:

Minecraft doesn't have to use that much RAM. If you have the view distance cranked out and are hosting multiple players then it does, otherwise you can go to the Java entry in your control panel and enter a runtime parameter to limit the range of memory its allowed to use.

no, but if you give it ram it will use ram. i have a world with a rather large array of farms they are spaced out for spawn control. and its nice to be able to have everything loaded so the ssd doesnt have to spend so much time playing catch up. i give it a full 16gb (half of total), sometimes it uses all of it.

the only other game i have that eats ram is kerbal space program. its possible to install so many mods that the game gets utterly huge. i could play stock, but then i wouldnt be able to do interstellar transfers on old boom boom.

Edited by LordNothing, 20 April 2022 - 06:43 AM.

[LordNothing]

Meep Meep, on 18 April 2022 - 02:30 PM, said:

I use java minecraft to run the rlcraft mod and it rarely gets to 3 gigs system memory usage even though I have it set to use up to 4 gigs. The mod does use an older version of minecraft so that might be why.

you need to mess with the java command line to get it to allocate more. if you do it will use it to cache chunks as you move about the world.

[Meep Meep]

LordNothing, on 20 April 2022 - 06:46 AM, said:

you need to mess with the java command line to get it to allocate more. if you do it will use it to cache chunks as you move about the world.

What would be the benefit? Not really getting any chunk loading lag and I have it set to 16. On the other hand I do have it installed on an nvme drive with a 3.5gig read speed.

[LordNothing]

Meep Meep, on 20 April 2022 - 11:24 AM, said:

What would be the benefit? Not really getting any chunk loading lag and I have it set to 16. On the other hand I do have it installed on an nvme drive with a 3.5gig read speed.

my ssds could easily keep up with any typical loading scenario. but if you got the ram and it aint doing anything might as well use it.

[Thorqemada]

ScrapIron Prime, on 16 April 2022 - 09:33 AM, said:

You don’t even need 32 unless you’re crunching databases. No game is written with 32 in mind or the complaints of trying to play it would kill sales.

Blattletech disagrees with that - on 16GB it runs for 2 or 3 missions and than the slowdowns become insufferably painful.
Ofc it is a sign of inefficient coding from the OS and Engine makers etc. but the only solution is to add more RAM and RAM is dirt cheap regarding DDR4.

In fact my experience is that if you mod your games you should go with no less than 32GB RAM - it will become smoother, more responsive, loading can accelerate and usually you will have no slowdowns or crashes from memory leaks over a longer duration of playtime.

I am very gald i did opt for 32GB (2x16GB DDR4 3600 Dual Rank) right away, bcs ofc you can update but 2 RAM sticks usually are more stable than 4 Ram sticks bcs the electrical burden on the memory subsystem is less.

Edited by Thorqemada, 23 April 2022 - 06:44 AM.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Thorqemada, on 23 April 2022 - 06:43 AM, said:

Blattletech disagrees with that - on 16GB it runs for 2 or 3 missions and than the slowdowns become insufferably painful.
Ofc it is a sign of inefficient coding from the OS and Engine makers etc. but the only solution is to add more RAM and RAM is dirt cheap regarding DDR4.

In fact my experience is that if you mod your games you should go with no less than 32GB RAM - it will become smoother, more responsive, loading can accelerate and usually you will have no slowdowns or crashes from memory leaks over a longer duration of playtime.

I am very gald i did opt for 32GB (2x16GB DDR4 3600 Dual Rank) right away, bcs ofc you can update but 2 RAM sticks usually are more stable than 4 Ram sticks bcs the electrical burden on the memory subsystem is less.

I’m sorry, but speaking as a dude whose EE degree was in microprocessor architecture and design and who has 30 years in as a computer engineer, you lost me at “electrical burden on the memory subsystem.” That’s word salad. I too have a preference for running 2 sticks of memory rather than 4, but there’s no “electrical burden”. Replace most of what you said with “manage your system settings better” in terms of registry or settings files.

[Meep Meep]

I run four sticks of single rank because it allows one stick to refresh as the other goes about its business gaining a small boost over two dual rank sticks. This is dependent upon the quality of the mobo though as four sticks can stress the imc and make oc a bit more of a hassle. I'm using a quality msi z490 mobo so that isn't an issue as its good to oc compatible ram all the way out to 5000 if you win the chip lottery. I bought 3600 speed and can get to 4800 before it starts to toss errors but decided to just run it at 3600 because it didn't really make much of a difference in games. Also apparently four sticks can enhance the performance of certain amd cpu if its the right speed and cas latency.

[Thorqemada]

ScrapIron Prime, on 23 April 2022 - 07:21 AM, said:

I’m sorry, but speaking as a dude whose EE degree was in microprocessor architecture and design and who has 30 years in as a computer engineer, you lost me at “electrical burden on the memory subsystem.” That’s word salad. I too have a preference for running 2 sticks of memory rather than 4, but there’s no “electrical burden”. Replace most of what you said with “manage your system settings better” in terms of registry or settings files.

I was an educated electrician too especially in digital circuits and you either do not understand me bcs my english is to funky or you have forgotten that every digital circuitry is fundmentally an analog circuitry that gives out a digital signal but works along the rules of analog and high frequency electronic realized with some semiconductor witchcraft and 4 sticks are higher burden than 2 so people with 4 sticks usually have more stability issues and i eperienced it myself too when i doubled the RAM in my old sys from 2x4 to 4x4GB.

That has nothing to do with software as long the drivers are not bad...its simply cheap tech running at the limits of its constructive capability.

Edited by Thorqemada, 24 April 2022 - 04:13 AM.

[Meep Meep]

Here is that hardware unboxed test of two vs four sticks.

[LordNothing]

i don't even buy motherboards with more than 2 slots. i like mini-itx or chopped micro-atx boards which usually only have 2 slots. i only buy the latter if for some reason i need another pcie card other than the gpu. there is little point in buying full atx unless you are building a workstation. there are so many full featured mini-itx boards that cover all the bases now.

[Meep Meep]

Two sticks are perfectly fine for the absolute majority of users and if you buy dual rank sticks you get almost the same benefit as four single ranks. The catch is that dual rank sticks tend to be much more expensive for the same capacity and speed as a four single rank stick setup. The main users of four sticks are going to be high end gaming/benchmarking where every frame counts so you can run higher settings and those that do professional work where higher performing ram can shave minutes or even hours off of a complex render or encode.

[Meep Meep]

Muuuwaaahahahaha.. Minecraft with full raytracing here I come.

Edited by Meep Meep, 27 April 2022 - 03:52 PM.