101 replies to this topic

[Novakaine]

Would you please look at the MG and small pulse laser vomit you have plagued us with.
It is a cancer the few friends recently I've managed to con into playing said "F" this game.
Veteran players know how to avoid the mayhem new players simply do not.
A blind deaf man in a snow storm knows how horrible it is.
It's past the point of just pathetic.
Oh might as well toss this one in the ring AMS that fires thru buildings and mountain side is just lazy programming.
On a side note the "Git Gud Mechanauti" can go kick rocks.
I'm sure the usual suspects will drop in any moment.

[w0qj]

Agree with you that mechs you mentioned strongly encourage players to quit MWO even before they have learnt the ropes. I myself almost quit MWO, two years ago when I started playing MWO again with "zero" balance.
(For what it's worth, I only stuck around and died many times, because of my founder package mechs, and Solaris7 package just purchased back then).

There are counters to these mechs, but only MWO experts, good aiming vs Lights, and perhaps even Seismic Sensors. (Newcomer: so what's a Seismic Sensor??)

- - - - - - - - - - - -
Lights are OP!

PIR-1 / PIR-2 / Piranha Cipher
and now Viper VPR-F

For those nay sayers, please go and play Jenner IIC of your choice for 1 month, and come back, look at me in the eyes and say Piranha & VPR-F is not OP due to weapon hardpoint inflation!

Edited by w0qj, 17 May 2022 - 09:31 AM.

[Nightbird]

Paper OP, Scissors fine
- Signed Rock

Play more than LRM boats and you'll see that SPL/MG is pretty useless most of the time other than feasting on a few self-isolating builds and playstyles.

[Der Geisterbaer]

w0qj, on 17 May 2022 - 09:01 AM, said:

For those nay sayers,

That kind of wording is a good way to "poison the well", so that this discussion will go just as bad as any of the previous "Machine Gun Lights are OP"-threads that have come before.

w0qj, on 17 May 2022 - 09:01 AM, said:

please go and play Jenner IIC of your choice for 1 month, and come back, look at me in the eyes and say Piranha & VPR-F is not OP due to weapon hardpoint inflation!

Now what would you say if I proposed the idea that neither Piranhas nor the VPR-F are "O[ver]P[owered] due to weapon hardpoint inflation" (which happens to exist on quite a few other chassis as well) but that the Jenner IIC - along with many other Lights - is actually "seriously U[nder]P[owered]"?

Edited by Der Geisterbaer, 17 May 2022 - 10:20 PM.

[caravann]

Majority of the horror is mental. If you are hit by machine guns you going to notice it as much being hit by LRM.
Viper plays as a light mech which is its drawback being a medium mech, Vipers have armor of a light mech and plays like a light mech. I can not tell the differences between a viper and an arctic cheetah or a mist lynx. If we look at the disadvantages this medium mech has no way to remove jump jets to make the most uses of its tonnage and the only thing that keep it together is the buff who increase ammo because without it, a viper without the quirk buff can't even kill an ice ferret on its own. It's good when a mech is opened as it deals structural damage. Viper who runs like a light mech is outmatched by LRM boats and heavy guns as it has legs made out of glass. Its strength is that it has the ability to jump, which allow it to scout and get away from ambushes. It's not in any way the mech who is the backbone on its team. Internet want you to believe that light mechs are OP not considering that there are matches where you dealt almost no damage and battles where you dealt lots of damage. Light mechs are pending between very good results and very bad ones. Changing how vipers work and how machineguns work won't stop the micropulse lasers on a piranha by making small pulse lasers worse because it's the most cost effective based on its size. The best weapon is still going to be the ER large laser. This is hubris that you think that because they're of a lighter class that the guns who are mounted on the mech somehow got a debuff. It's not even how the game plays out because you're not attacked by one light mech, a single light mech dies faster than it can fart.

[Curccu]

w0qj, on 17 May 2022 - 09:01 AM, said:

PIR-1 / PIR-2 / Piranha Cipher
and now Viper VPR-F

Not really see why some people are fans of Cipher, PIR-1 ok against potatoes, PIR-2 is better because you don't have to stare all the time but still competent players kill them eez.
Why no PIR-A in your list? Isn't it just pretty much better PIR-1?
VPR is also bigger target, easier to hit.

w0qj, on 17 May 2022 - 09:01 AM, said:

For those nay sayers, please go and play Jenner IIC of your choice for 1 month, and come back, look at me in the eyes and say Piranha & VPR-F is not OP due to weapon hardpoint inflation!

Play one of the worst for mechs for a month why? So I can say PIR and VPR are better? Yes better not OP.

PS. I don't have that VPR yet so only XP from those is me fighting against those and they do not feel OP sry.

Edited by Curccu, 17 May 2022 - 12:08 PM.

[Novakaine]

Right on schedule my guy.

[Curccu]

Novakaine, on 17 May 2022 - 01:14 PM, said:

Right on schedule my guy.

No **** sherlock, what do expect by creating thread like this? Loads of Yes mens to agree with you?

These 100% assaults & heavies only players with their freakin' massive alphas and DPS who are not willing to learn how to shoot light always find a way to QQ about lights and no way in hell they can see other way around how it feels to eat those 40-90 damage alphas as light mech and get cripled/killed by 1 shot 3-6 times further away than they can even dent a paintjob of those said assaults.

GIT GUD, LEARN TO SHOOT!
[/thread]

edit: PS. What is even your suggestion for PTS? I can only see multiple lines of QQ without single suggestion or solution in your post.

Edited by Curccu, 17 May 2022 - 01:38 PM.

[Novakaine]

Curccu, on 17 May 2022 - 01:31 PM, said:

No **** sherlock, what do expect by creating thread like this? Loads of Yes mens to agree with you?

These 100% assaults & heavies only players with their freakin' massive alphas and DPS who are not willing to learn how to shoot light always find a way to QQ about lights and no way in hell they can see other way around how it feels to eat those 40-90 damage alphas as light mech and get cripled/killed by 1 shot 3-6 times further away than they can even dent a paintjob of those said assaults.

GIT GUD, LEARN TO SHOOT!
[/thread]

Was not talking to "you" my friend.
But that particular attitude is a good reason our population is brown refuse.
On a side note I am retired law enforcement #notsherlock - sherlock.

Edited by Novakaine, 17 May 2022 - 01:38 PM.

[Teenage Mutant Ninja Urbie]

god forbid anybody can touch my lurmboat/sniper .. "there".

[Novakaine]

Teenage Mutant Ninja Urbie, on 17 May 2022 - 01:44 PM, said:

god forbid anybody can touch my lurmboat/sniper .. "there".

Don't be silly.

[Teenage Mutant Ninja Urbie]

Novakaine, on 17 May 2022 - 02:08 PM, said:

Don't be silly.

".. look at the MG and small pulse laser vomit you have plagued us with."

[Ihlrath]

Playing devil's advocate here....

I run around (or used to) in lights and I'll still run the Shinurbie but thats MPLs....but I digress.

My Murderchicken (Locust PB) would absolutely murder a LRM boat or slow moving sniper if I caught it alone. That's small lasers and MG's. Running around in a murder fish decked out with machine guns will do unspeakable things to the backside of an Atlas in way, way too short of a time frame. Its one of the main differences between MWO and the game its' based on Battletech. In BT your 5 bazillion MGs are going to do 2 DMG apiece and be scattered around at random over 8 different damage locations. Which means that PIR that just snuck up on the Atlas better have done it using its entire movement rating and built up a significant penalty to hit for the Atlas pilot or he's going to turn around and swat it like the pest it is. On MWO... all that damage can be concentrated, especially if the target is slow or immobile. It's not really in the spirit of BT for a light to absolutely murder an Assault in the span of 3 - 5 seconds. But this is MWO and we're talking about min/maxing which has never been in the spirit of BT. You have to stop looking at MWO as a BT successor or anything close because its been invaded by the CoD mind set of kill everything super fast rather than it feel like a slugfest as it should feel.

So no... light mechs shouldn't be able to do the things they do but they have to have some viability and that's one way to do it. They can absolutely be smacked down from 1k+ away by some 8 ERLL boating sniper so there's a balance there at least.... or at least some semblance of it.

[Knownswift]

Min maxing is very much in the spirit of BT.

You think they just unintentionally power creeped the game over it's lifespan?

[Ihlrath]

Knownswift, on 17 May 2022 - 02:32 PM, said:

Min maxing is very much in the spirit of BT.

You think they just unintentionally power creeped the game over it's lifespan?

Perhaps that was a bad term to use. In some builds that was the idea, especially once the clan era hit. However, a lot of mechs had a particular role they were designed for and while that can still play a factor in MWO the name of the game is 'Do Damage Bro' which wasn't always the case in BT.

[Andrewlik]

I'm sorry you seem to be having a bad time, light mechs can be annoying to deal with.

Light mechs are very strong in very specific circumstances, but player skill and team cohesion can prevent such circumstances from occuring, as well as mitigating the effects of such a light mech chasing you around. Due to the nature of the 12 v 12 "skirmish" format, such circumstances are rare, which make the times a piranha does successfully cut you off from the team and shred you to pieces all the more jarring, and those are the times we remember.
Though I'm far from a perfect player (as well as far from a perfect light pilot myself), I'm willing to teach you (or anyone who is struggling with light mechs, both as or against them) what I know.
I am @andrewlik on all the major Battletech discords
I even have a Jenner IIC streak-boat as an anti-piranha light mech specifically if you want to see some carnage

[Novakaine]

I'm simply saying "new players" particularly some of my friends who just said "nope" to this game.
And that's kinda sad.

[w0qj]

It is MWO who wants new players (and returning MWO players) to come back into the game.

OP's opinion, and my own (above) personal experience serves as an indicator of the new player experience (or the lack thereof).

Again, it is MWO who wants new players. OP and I are simply reflecting this from new players' perspective.
MWO has been warned.

Novakaine, on 17 May 2022 - 05:21 PM, said:

I'm simply saying "new players" particularly some of my friends who just said "nope" to this game.
And that's kinda sad.

[LordNothing]

sometimes i honestly think that the mwo community is isolationist. then again if it weren't for us grognards this game would have been taken down years ago.

Edited by LordNothing, 17 May 2022 - 06:27 PM.

[Ihlrath]

I mean they're not wrong.

How are new players supposed to come in and even get a chance to see how much fun they can have when there's just such a small margin for error? The reduction of time to kill to mere seconds in most cases makes this a CoD clone, not a game with giant walking tanks that were supposed to be able to take a beating. I think ultimately it's going to cost them new players sticking around.

Who are the 'lulz git gud' crew going to seal club then?