25 replies to this topic

[w0qj]

Are High Explosive missile skill nodes worth it (New Skill Tree 2022) ?

Now that each skill is discrete, it's time to examine if the 2x Skill Nodes for missile High Explosive is indeed worth it?

[panzer1b]

In general they boost crits so i would say yes (especially with how minimal the cost is).

Same applies to other easy to get nodes that are prety much a no-brainer. Laser duration for anything that has lasers on it that arent used once in a blue moon like say a PDC array of ERSLs on LRM boat that generally doesnt use it in normal fighting. LBX spread for LBXs (again, 2 nodes is nothing). Anything that uses ammo gets the mandatory ammo skills.

The only one that i never use (as im just too used to not using it) is the gauss charge as it screws with my timing and is generally not helpful anyways as i never run around with gauss precharged unless im abotu to peek out of cover or something.

[Zeddicuus]

I find it makes a difference on the missile boat I have going. Crits dealing more damage is always a good thing, even more so when you're blotting the sun with so many. That many more chances of a crit happening.

[Curccu]

w0qj, on 03 June 2022 - 09:43 AM, said:

Are High Explosive missile skill nodes worth it (New Skill Tree 2022) ?

Now that each skill is discrete, it's time to examine if the 2x Skill Nodes for missile High Explosive is indeed worth it?

Nothing have changed for effectiveness of those nodes? Now they are just easier to pick.
If mech is using missiles hard to see that those wouldn't be worthy for just two nodes.

[TheCaptainJZ]

Like all things, it's more valuable the more of that weapon you have. SRM boats, MRM boats, ATM boats, or LRM boats. If it's not your primary weapon system, or you're in a light mech that can't boat so much, probably better to skip.

Edited by TheCaptainJZ, 03 June 2022 - 12:31 PM.

[Meep Meep]

Zeddicuus, on 03 June 2022 - 11:59 AM, said:

I find it makes a difference on the missile boat I have going. Crits dealing more damage is always a good thing, even more so when you're blotting the sun with so many. That many more chances of a crit happening.

Crits in mwo are not damage multipliers. They are a special damage type that attacks mounted components once the armor is stripped away. A damage multiplying crit system would be your worst nightmare. Imagine a ppfld build that rolls a damage crit? Poof your mech.

[RickySpanish]

No, they are probably the most useless nodes in the game. They multiply critical damage, as in you must crit first, and then that damage is multiplied. You can only crit components, so basically they only help against blowing up weapons/ammo etc once the target has no armour left. And that damage multiplier is what, 30%? Useless.

[Weeny Machine]

I tested them and I feel no difference. Most likely a lot of people also use the crit reduction skill

[Moldur]

You'll appreciate range more than pretty much any other weapon node. I'll do gauss cooldown and sometimes laser duration, but honestly both are tiny slivers compared to how much of a boon increased range is. A lot of the node tree is filler, but they hand out range pretty freely and it makes the biggest difference imo. Being able to delaying damage dropoff as much as possible is just huge.

[John McClintock]

Moldur, on 03 June 2022 - 09:56 PM, said:

You'll appreciate range more than pretty much any other weapon node. I'll do gauss cooldown and sometimes laser duration, but honestly both are tiny slivers compared to how much of a boon increased range is. A lot of the node tree is filler, but they hand out range pretty freely and it makes the biggest difference imo. Being able to delaying damage dropoff as much as possible is just huge.

Indeed, if you graph the surface area of your increased effective area denial, what you gain from range increase is quite significant, all the heat nodes are also a no brainer, unless you are running a gauss boat there is no reason to not take every heat node in firepower and operations.

[feeWAIVER]

RickySpanish, on 03 June 2022 - 06:51 PM, said:

No, they are probably the most useless nodes in the game. They multiply critical damage, as in you must crit first, and then that damage is multiplied. You can only crit components, so basically they only help against blowing up weapons/ammo etc once the target has no armour left. And that damage multiplier is what, 30%? Useless.

Do you not crit structure as well?

[RickySpanish]

feeWAIVER, on 13 June 2022 - 05:37 AM, said:

Do you not crit structure as well?

My understanding is no, because in Mechwarrior 'Critical Hit' means something entirely different to every other ruleset ever invented by humankind with respect to that term.

Every RPG: Critical Hit - An unlikely event where your attack deals extra damage to whatever it has hit.

Mechwarrior: Critical Hit - An unlikely event where your attack ADDITIONALLY hits equipment that occupies critical slots, for an amount equal to the damage dealt to the location's structure.

Now can you critically hit engines as they occupy critical slots? My understanding is no - an engine is destroyed when the location which contains it has its structure depleted to zero.

Someone correct me please, if what I have written is rubbish.

Edit: I have been corrected!

Edited by RickySpanish, 13 June 2022 - 10:52 AM.

[LordNothing]

im leaning towards the affirmative. with the sandblast nature of missile weapons, the ability to obliterate the open bits is very useful.

[Der Geisterbaer]

RickySpanish, on 13 June 2022 - 07:01 AM, said:

Now can you critically hit engines as they occupy critical slots?

Yes and no.

RickySpanish, on 13 June 2022 - 07:01 AM, said:

My understanding is no - an engine is destroyed when the location which contains it has its structure depleted to zero.

Indeed, MW:O doesn't seem to track engine criticals (or gyro ones) as it should by the BT rules (which are usually reference as "the lore" while actually being "crunch" and only implicitly affecting "lore"). However, MW:O still abides to the "three engine criticals = death" rule when it comes to side torso destruction on an IS XL engine.

[feeWAIVER]

RickySpanish, on 13 June 2022 - 07:01 AM, said:

My understanding is no, because in Mechwarrior 'Critical Hit' means something entirely different to every other ruleset ever invented by humankind with respect to that term.

Every RPG: Critical Hit - An unlikely event where your attack deals extra damage to whatever it has hit.

Mechwarrior: Critical Hit - An unlikely event where your attack ADDITIONALLY hits equipment that occupies critical slots, for an amount equal to the damage dealt to the location's structure.

Now can you critically hit engines as they occupy critical slots? My understanding is no - an engine is destroyed when the location which contains it has its structure depleted to zero.

Someone correct me please, if what I have written is rubbish.

But an LBX10 has 10 chances to crit structure, right?
That's why LBX is so effective against structure, right?
It's critting structure isn't it?

[feeWAIVER]

https://wiki.mwomerc...e=Critical_Hits

Found this on crits, from 2018.

[feeWAIVER]

So if that is correct, a structure hit by a 3x crit will do 15% more dmg.
Buffing it 30% will increase the 15% dmg to either 20% or 45%... Depending on how it's applied.
I would hope 45% considering how rare a 3x crit can be, and anything really spammable is only doing 1 dmg per hit.

But I dunno.

[RickySpanish]

feeWAIVER, on 13 June 2022 - 08:34 AM, said:

https://wiki.mwomerc...e=Critical_Hits

Found this on crits, from 2018.

Interesting! That certainly states that structure takes critical damage. Here's where I got my info from:

https://mwo.fandom.c...ki/Critical_Hit

Edit: Asked a few other players and they agree with you - critical hits deal bonus damage to structure and ALSO have a chance to deal extra hits to components.

Edited by RickySpanish, 13 June 2022 - 10:52 AM.

[caravann]

With 1 damage for each shot you still deal 1 damage with each shot.
to 2 damage for each shot you get 3 damage on crit multiplier.

Wasted if you use LRM. Use ATM or SRM if you want it.

[Curccu]

RickySpanish, on 13 June 2022 - 10:45 AM, said:

Edit: Asked a few other players and they agree with you - critical hits deal bonus damage to structure and ALSO have a chance to deal extra hits to components.

That is my take also because I remember we having talk in unit about how much head armor in our comp mechs should have ....having 31 head hitpoints wasn't 100% sure survival from twin gauss at some point because internals could be critted and taking bit extra damage that you would die by 1 shot.

caravann, on 13 June 2022 - 12:17 PM, said:

With 1 damage for each shot you still deal 1 damage with each shot.
to 2 damage for each shot you get 3 damage on crit multiplier.

Wasted if you use LRM. Use ATM or SRM if you want it.

we got decimals in damage calculation even if we don't see it in UI