24 replies to this topic

[Steel Claws]

As a weapon platform streaks pretty much suck since they were nerfed a while back. They need to have the lock on time reduced and the spread decreased so they will be effective once again.

[Vyx]

I've always thought that:
1) streaks should do like 2.1-2.25 damage per missile (i.e., slightly more than standard srms due to their advanced tech), and
2) streaks should be able to 'dumb-fire' without a lock (similar to the way lrms and atms can)

The lock-on mechanic is a curse when there is no ability to 'dumb-fire'. Two overlapping ECM mechs in your vicinity basically screws a streak boat, and honestly, that is silly.

On a related note, at present, an active probe or an ECM switched to counter can knock out one enemy ECM. If you have both, you have no advantage; you still can only knock out one ECM. I always thought this was a poor ruling. If you want to invest in a full-on counter-ECM suite (i.e., an active probe and an on-board ECM), why not let it cancel two enemy ECMs when you switch to counter?

Thoughts?

[Gasboy]

I think that the streaks should be allowed to dumbfire when you can't get a lock.

The benefit of SRMs in the tabletop game doesn't really translate to the video game: streaks basically negated a miss, you didn't hit, but you didn't waste ammo either.

I think people should be able to fire anyways, knowing that they might not all hit.

Edited by Gasboy, 07 July 2022 - 06:57 AM.

[TheCaptainJZ]

Streaks are most effective against lights but the hardest to get a lock against lights especially up close. There are some nodes that can help but with radar derp, it's easy for a mech to break a lock and hard to get it back. If the lock-on mechanic was decoupled from other missiles, it could be tuned separately.

[Meep Meep]

A few medium mechs that can mount enough streaks along with tag can be a menace to lights but generally are just an annoyance to heavier mechs due to the way they spread out to each component. However I do like streaks on the flea romeo. Perfect to lure in other lights thinking they are going to duel a small laser flea then the two ssrm2 fire up. Also works well to bully certain pilots who freak out when they hear the srms hitting.

FleFlicker

If you prefer mg lights then this also works well especially in a lance.

Flee!

[D o z e r]

Streaks are very powerful against lights. I also run a 6 Streak 6 MadDog in quicks that is fun and performs pretty well in general. But overall Streaks are a very use-case-specific weapon. Problem is, if you make them more powerful in general they would be totally OP against lights... which they are already devastating against...

Edited by D O Z E R, 07 July 2022 - 09:24 AM.

[caravann]

I run streaks on Osiris and can tell that it has helped me against light mechs.

Considering those dire wolf who now found out how to jump jet up a skyscraper and haxs who shoot gauss rifles without a throttle up and macro uac to fire faster than the eye.

I can take on an atlas but if a light mech with a machine gun fire at my Osiris it's toasted.

Knowing that 90% of all protection is structure it endure better against cannon fire than small guns.

The streak srm2 with 2s in cool down is better than streak srm4 because it takes 3 seconds, in the long run the streak 2 is better as it catches up in dps.

Streak and atm doesn't cost any tonnage to add artemis. Yet people still play with C-artemis lrm15 when atm deals 18 dmg.

atm3 is only 0.5 ton heavier and most benefit of streaks on clan is when using atm9.

For IS , the streaks is the only reason why to use artemis as you pay a penalty of using LRM which you won't pay with streaks.

Streaks for IS is used with MRM40 and chainfired with 3 streak srm2's because they're better in dps than streak srm4.

With Streak you don't pay any ghost heat of firing SRM's with MRM. ECM mechs becomes someone else's problem as you can't do anything than putting a beagle active probe who won't register mechs who overheat which is the nemesis number one.

If a mech overheat you are screwed. You can't target lock an overheated mech because the game do not consider it a shutdown mech. You're not allowed to fire streaks as ATM or LRM. This is why 0.5ton extra to remove the stuck lock on is worth it on clan mechs.

Now since we come this far we're able to conclude that streaks on clan is obsolete because ATM is meant to be a SRM weapon.
Benefits are too many to not use ATM3 instead of streak SRM. For IS there's where we have the most benefits with Light ppc, still the beagle is a little too heavy. The tag is decent, nobody uses light tags in practice for the matter that light tag is too short to be practical on missile boats. The cost of using Streaks is that you can use artemis with no tonnage increase but the same is reverse if you don't have artemis on the mech and you reduce missile tubes if mixed with LRM.

[MechMaster059]

Steel Claws, on 07 July 2022 - 05:46 AM, said:

They need to have the lock on time reduced

Not sure about this.

Steel Claws, on 07 July 2022 - 05:46 AM, said:

and the spread decreased so they will be effective once again.

YES. The spread is HORRIBLE.

Vyx, on 07 July 2022 - 06:19 AM, said:

1) streaks should do like 2.1-2.25 damage per missile (i.e., slightly more than standard srms due to their advanced tech), and

That sounds reasonable though STREAKs have bigger problems than missile damage.

Vyx, on 07 July 2022 - 06:19 AM, said:

2) streaks should be able to 'dumb-fire' without a lock (similar to the way lrms and atms can)

Gasboy, on 07 July 2022 - 06:57 AM, said:

I think that the streaks should be allowed to dumbfire when you can't get a lock.

YES YES YES YES YES

Not able to fire on ECM? How about NOT ABLE TO FIRE ON STEALTH MECHS. Being unable to fire upon stealth mechs means STREAKs are not viable on mechs with only 1 missile slot. You cannot afford to put yourself at that much of a disadvantage against stealth mechs if you only have 1 missile slot. This is why I run 2x SRM 6 Artemis on my LRM mech instead of STREAKs. My LRM mech ROUTINELY gets charged at by light mechs who assume I'm helpless to fight them. I remember being charged at by a light stealth mech who came straight at me. I was barely able to kill it thanks to slamming it in the face with SRM 6 Artemis salvos as it ran circles around me.

D O Z E R, on 07 July 2022 - 09:23 AM, said:

Streaks are very powerful against lights.

if you make them more powerful in general they would be totally OP against lights... which they are already devastating against...

LOL no they're not. STREAKs are TOTALLY USELESS vs stealth mechs and badly sub-par against Urbanmechs which easily tank the damage that gets dispersed all over their frame due to STREAKs HORRIBLE dispersion. STREAKs are decent against non-stealth light mechs but with a little practice and skill, you can do just fine with vanilla SRMs vs light mechs for a huge weight savings.

Edited by MechMaster059, 08 July 2022 - 07:01 PM.

[Meep Meep]

Most streak boats I see are sporting a tag and active probe so ecm and stealth mechs are not an issue. Even ecm mechs are easy kills as long as you stay out of their ecm no lock zone.

[MechMaster059]

I'm not going to swap out a laser on my Arctic Cheetah SH with a TAG just for the sake of one STREAK 4 mount.

Instead I'll keep the laser and slam enemy light stealth mechs in the face with the single SRM 6 mounted on it for more damage and I don't have to wait around for a lock.

Keeping a TAG on a light stealth mech running circles around you would be insanely difficult.

Edited by MechMaster059, 07 July 2022 - 10:12 PM.

[Meep Meep]

Your choice but the counters exist.

[Dogstar]

Meep Meep, on 07 July 2022 - 09:57 PM, said:

Most streak boats I see are sporting a tag and active probe so ecm and stealth mechs are not an issue. Even ecm mechs are easy kills as long as you stay out of their ecm no lock zone.

When you consider how heavy streaks are in the first place, the fact that you need even more weight to use them effectively makes them even worse than they are on paper

At the very least streaks should have better lock time or cut through ECM - give them some of the effect of a tag or active probe built in

[caravann]

Dogstar, on 08 July 2022 - 01:32 AM, said:

When you consider how heavy streaks are in the first place, the fact that you need even more weight to use them effectively makes them even worse than they are on paper

At the very least streaks should have better lock time or cut through ECM - give them some of the effect of a tag or active probe built in

Won't work for the same reason why Streaks doesn't have artemis even if it's supposed to have it already installed and the reason behind the tonnage increase. An active beagle would create an exploit where it stacks with active probe and would stack with LRM and ATM. Just by carrying a single streak srm2 with no ammo will increase the lock for LRM by 2x The range of detection increased by 2x of having both active probe and streak srm allowing gauss snipers to make an easy game of killing mechs and for all snipers.

Better lock time can't be made because the lock time is hard coded into the LRM and atm.
The skill who makes it hard to get a lock is not part of beagle active probe. That skill point is rendered pointless as any mech who has 100% gets 100% all the time that increasing the chances of getting lock for longer time isn't happening as it is reduced by 100% when the mech moves away from direct firing line.

There's nothing that need to be added, there are skill points who need to be removed because their only function is to remove the purpose of the lock on mechanic.

Player logic 101 and balance= I dont' want to use AMS, thereby locks must be removed.

The LRM do not have the problem of streaks. because they're allowed to fire at any time.
The beagle active probe do not work because mechs who overheat are not countered by active probe.

How to counter streaks? Overheat your mech with alpha strike and they can't fire.
Shut down the mech and they're able to fire because beagle active probe only counter shut down mechs.
Hug the mech and they can't fire since the lock on mechanic has a short range limit.
The streak is going to be used in direct line of fire where each tonnage matter and each gun you can add to the mech because you need the dps. Tag has a use for LRM and not much for streaks because where are you going to get the tonnage?
Are you really going to put streaks on an assault knowing that it will lose every brawls since it takes 2 seconds to get a lock.
Wasting time doing too many tasks, it simply takes too much time to lock a target with tag to let you fire the gun.

The solution is already there for LRM and ATM and there's no need of adding a lot of features who will never work.
You're allowed to fire LRM at any time why shouldn't it be the case for streaks?

Edited by caravann, 08 July 2022 - 02:32 AM.

[TheCaptainJZ]

caravann, on 07 July 2022 - 10:25 AM, said:

I run streaks on Osiris and can tell that it has helped me against light mechs.

Considering those dire wolf who now found out how to jump jet up a skyscraper and haxs who shoot gauss rifles without a throttle up and macro uac to fire faster than the eye.

I can take on an atlas but if a light mech with a machine gun fire at my Osiris it's toasted.

Knowing that 90% of all protection is structure it endure better against cannon fire than small guns.

The streak srm2 with 2s in cool down is better than streak srm4 because it takes 3 seconds, in the long run the streak 2 is better as it catches up in dps.

Streak and atm doesn't cost any tonnage to add artemis. Yet people still play with C-artemis lrm15 when atm deals 18 dmg.

atm3 is only 0.5 ton heavier and most benefit of streaks on clan is when using atm9.

For IS , the streaks is the only reason why to use artemis as you pay a penalty of using LRM which you won't pay with streaks.

Streaks for IS is used with MRM40 and chainfired with 3 streak srm2's because they're better in dps than streak srm4.

With Streak you don't pay any ghost heat of firing SRM's with MRM. ECM mechs becomes someone else's problem as you can't do anything than putting a beagle active probe who won't register mechs who overheat which is the nemesis number one.

If a mech overheat you are screwed. You can't target lock an overheated mech because the game do not consider it a shutdown mech. You're not allowed to fire streaks as ATM or LRM. This is why 0.5ton extra to remove the stuck lock on is worth it on clan mechs.

Now since we come this far we're able to conclude that streaks on clan is obsolete because ATM is meant to be a SRM weapon.
Benefits are too many to not use ATM3 instead of streak SRM. For IS there's where we have the most benefits with Light ppc, still the beagle is a little too heavy. The tag is decent, nobody uses light tags in practice for the matter that light tag is too short to be practical on missile boats. The cost of using Streaks is that you can use artemis with no tonnage increase but the same is reverse if you don't have artemis on the mech and you reduce missile tubes if mixed with LRM.

Just so you know, Artemis does NOT improve Streaks or ATMs. For the longest time, it was bugged and did affect Streaks, but that has been re-coded so now it offers no benefit.

[caravann]

TheCaptainJZ, on 08 July 2022 - 05:24 AM, said:

Just so you know, Artemis does NOT improve Streaks or ATMs. For the longest time, it was bugged and did affect Streaks, but that has been re-coded so now it offers no benefit.

yeah we're in the case that artemis is broken and that surely made it 100% better. The tonnage is still there and you paid for the tonnage of using artemis.

[Nightbird]

caravann, on 08 July 2022 - 06:30 AM, said:

yeah we're in the case that artemis is broken and that surely made it 100% better. The tonnage is still there and you paid for the tonnage of using artemis.

What? You know that Streaks and ATMs not have additional tonnage with Artemis, and Artemis itself uses no tonnage right?

Edited by Nightbird, 08 July 2022 - 06:55 AM.

[caravann]

Nightbird, on 08 July 2022 - 06:54 AM, said:

What? You know that Streaks and ATMs not have additional tonnage with Artemis, and Artemis itself uses no tonnage right?

Exactly and that's why you pay for tonnages you not having any choice to pay.

Look at what it says: Missile guidance and you pay for this upgrade but you don't get anything?

I doubt anyone actually see a difference and it can be because it's broken.

Take a close look , a really close look at the stats on the artims lrm and artemis srm and don't bs about it.
Look close and tell me = Where's the differences between a LRM and an Artemis.

same stats, same velocity, same spread. same everything. You don't get anything from artemis because the skill point counters the tracking and SRM doesn't have any guidence, good luck.

[Nightbird]

caravann, on 08 July 2022 - 09:19 AM, said:

Exactly and that's why you pay for tonnages you not having any choice to pay.

Look at what it says: Missile guidance and you pay for this upgrade but you don't get anything?

I doubt anyone actually see a difference and it can be because it's broken.

Take a close look , a really close look at the stats on the artims lrm and artemis srm and don't bs about it.
Look close and tell me = Where's the differences between a LRM and an Artemis.

same stats, same velocity, same spread. same everything. You don't get anything from artemis because the skill point counters the tracking and SRM doesn't have any guidence, good luck.

LRM+Artemis gets 30% spread reduction in line of sight and holding your own locks right? SRM+Artemis gets 30% spread reduction at all times since no locks are needed.

[caravann]

Nightbird, on 08 July 2022 - 09:32 AM, said:

LRM+Artemis gets 30% spread reduction in line of sight and holding your own locks right? SRM+Artemis gets 30% spread reduction at all times since no locks are needed.

Does the stats say SRM artemis gets a reduction?

I heard other stories that Artemis increase velocity. I think artemis has soft magic effect since the story changes.

I can't tell that this is the case. Try test ground and tell me if it really changes how the missiles hits the target.

[LordNothing]

the reason streaks suck is that light mechs also suck. you cant buff the former without pissing off proponents of the latter. and you cant buff the latter until we all admit that light mechs are not op and stop complaining about the one thing they can still do to get points.

Edited by LordNothing, 08 July 2022 - 10:39 AM.