91 replies to this topic

[LordNothing]

JediPanther, on 08 October 2022 - 01:43 PM, said:

spider 5v
is jenners
any lct minus pb and the 1e
raven 2x,4x
pnts except kk

So many useless under gunned mechs or horrible weapon placement.

the raven 4x makes a good boom boom bird. fit either a uac10 or 20 and aim for rear torsos. it is oddly effective.

[Pixel Hunter]

I'd go so far as to say any mech that doesn't have a lot of hardpoints could be a bad mech. Unless it's hyper quirked to counter that if you're rocking the heaviest version of some gun it's just not as good in my opinion. I think in table top you'd shake in your cooling suit boots against an Orion with a heavy guass, heavy PPC and 2 medium lasers. In game you just smile, jam on override and shoot your barrage of 1 ton medium lasers at them. come to think of it, why is the heavy gauss so short of range? 25 damage is scary...but it takes up an ungodly amount of space, shakes the cockpit and has low ammo.

[Meep Meep]

Pixel Hunter, on 11 October 2022 - 06:34 PM, said:

I'd go so far as to say any mech that doesn't have a lot of hardpoints could be a bad mech. Unless it's hyper quirked to counter that if you're rocking the heaviest version of some gun it's just not as good in my opinion.

Locust 1v says hi!

Snubcust

Snipecust

The snubcust is better in a light lance and the snipecust is the most annoying thing ever on the maps that allow for sniping.

However on the er laser side this is also quite annoying because a well driven spider is fing hard to kill.

PewFromWho?

[ScrapIron Prime]

Pixel Hunter, on 11 October 2022 - 06:34 PM, said:

I'd go so far as to say any mech that doesn't have a lot of hardpoints could be a bad mech.

Exactly, it depends on what you’re putting in those hardpoints. It doesn’t matter that the Shadowhawk 2K only has 3 energy hardpoints, for example, if you’re filling them with large pulse lasers. Fill anything up to its ghost heat limit and it’s enough.

[foamyesque]

ScrapIron Prime, on 11 October 2022 - 08:02 PM, said:

Exactly, it depends on what you’re putting in those hardpoints. It doesn’t matter that the Shadowhawk 2K only has 3 energy hardpoints, for example, if you’re filling them with large pulse lasers. Fill anything up to its ghost heat limit and it’s enough.

LPLs are nice but I personally adore the triple PPC Hawk. Fire and forget, baby,

[TheCaptainJZ]

Volume, on 11 October 2022 - 09:26 AM, said:

Ice Ferret is the only chassis that I renamed "NEVER AGAIN" - I only leveled it for extremely fast capturing in faction scouting (a game mode removed from the game, btw) - the fridge is just awful in almost everything I tried to do with it. I think the build that I sucked the least in was 4 HML and an SRM6 or something like that, can't remember honestly.

Uziel isn't awful. I have a 6MPL one with XL300 that was a great skirmisher. I haven't played it in a long time, admittedly.

Vindicator, depending on the variant, can be carried by its quirks. V1X has a missile cooldown quirk that really boosts the MRM40, for example. Very high armor and toughness for a medium, decent maneuverability. I don't think it's awful. Definitely off-meta, but not unplayable.

Then again, even the EXE-A is playable in the right hands, so...

"Fridge" lol. Yep, that's the look all right.
I've actually seen a couple in matches recently sprouting 2 HLL. They actually were quite deadly so not totally garbage after all. Makes me hate heavy lasers even more. I've never actually played the Vindicator. The hardpoints and tonnage looks better than the Panther, which I have, but it's never been popular in this game. I've played the Uziel a little. I don't particularly like the look of it either. It was the poster boy for MechWarrior 4 and MechAssault 2 iirc.

[ScrapIron Prime]

foamyesque, on 12 October 2022 - 08:42 PM, said:

LPLs are nice but I personally adore the triple PPC Hawk. Fire and forget, baby,

Agreed. I named mine "Thor Shoulder."

[Bowelhacker]

There are no **** mechs, only **** pilots.

[foamyesque]

ScrapIron Prime, on 13 October 2022 - 01:12 PM, said:

Agreed. I named mine "Thor Shoulder."

I'm boring and named mine Mini-Awe. I'm more proud of what I called my triple ERPPC Tbolt: Tsunderstruk. :v

Edited by foamyesque, 13 October 2022 - 03:34 PM.

[PocketYoda]

Osiris as mentioned above.
Javelins are pretty poor
Spiders to me are bad, not because they can't function but because they add nothing to a team.

Vindicators are pretty bad.
Assassins have fallen to the curb.
Storm Crows have fallen and can't get up.
Black Lanners have been trash since they joined

Ebon Jags are way to flimsy
Hellfires are pretty crap.
Roughnecks are not great.
Summoners are not great.

Atlas are bullet magnets
Kodiaks are bullet magnets
Blood Asps are Bullet death..
Banshees are trash
Highlanders are too under armed.
Victors are too under armed.

Hatamotos are ****.


And anything that needs super quirks to function.

Edited by PocketYoda, 13 October 2022 - 09:22 PM.

[martian]

PocketYoda, on 13 October 2022 - 08:30 PM, said:

Osiris as mentioned above.
Javelins are pretty poor
Spiders to me are bad, not because they can't function but because they add nothing to a team.

Vindicators are pretty bad.
Assassins have fallen to the curb.
Storm Crows have fallen and can't get up.
Black Lanners have been trash seen they joined

Ebon Jags are way to flimsy
Hellfires are pretty crap.
Roughnecks are not great.
Summoners are not great.

Atlas are bullet magnets
Kodiaks are bullet magnets
Blood Asps are Bullet death..
Banshees are trash
Highlanders are too under armed.
Victors are too under armed.

Hatamotos are ****.


And anything that needs super quirks to function.

My experience is different:

Javelin is a solid light 'Mech, for example JVN-11A that PGI gave for free some time ago.

Assassin is still good in its niche, as is Black Lanner.

Stormcrow is not the OP medium 'Mech as it was in 2015, but it is still a pretty mobile and versatile OmniMech.

Ebon Jaguar is still a solid and versatile Clan heavy OmniMech.

I have seen people doing well in the the Hellfire or in the Roughneck.

I have had a lot of fun with the Summoner both in the Event Queue and in the Quick Play in the last few weeks.

The Blood Asp is still powerful Clan Assault OmniMech with multiple strong configurations.

Almost forgot: If you feel that 'Mechs such as the Highlander, Banshee, Victor or Hatamoto-Chi are underpowered, use smaller engine and invest into weapons. Those BattleMechs do not have fixed engines, so they feel underarmed if you build them that way..

Etc.

[mytilus edulis]

martian, on 13 October 2022 - 08:59 PM, said:

My experience is different:

Javelin is a solid light 'Mech, for example JVN-11A that PGI gave for free some time ago.

Assassin is still good in its niche, as is Black Lanner.

Stormcrow is not the OP medium 'Mech as it was in 2015, but it is still a pretty mobile and versatile OmniMech.

Ebon Jaguar is still a solid and versatile Clan heavy OmniMech.

I have seen people doing well in the the Hellfire or in the Roughneck.

I have had a lot of fun with the Summoner both in the Event Queue and in the Quick Play in the last few weeks.

The Blood Asp is still powerful Clan Assault OmniMech with multiple strong configurations.

Almost forgot: If you feel that 'Mechs such as the Highlander, Banshee, Victor or Hatamoto-Chi are underpowered, use smaller engine and invest into weapons. Those BattleMechs do not have fixed engines, so they feel underarmed if you build them that way..

Etc.

Javelin is decent. Assassin is decent but easy kills for competent players. EBJ is OK but somewhat outclassed by other options. RGH in a similar place. HLF has its place but there's only one good one really. The rest aren't fast enough to make up for awful hitboxes and convergence. Summoner good. Basp is good at lower tiers and terrible against competent players. There's only one decent HTM variant and the rest are pretty bad. Banshees are in a similar state, only a couple good variants and even those are easy to kill.

[Gasboy]

Volume, on 11 October 2022 - 09:26 AM, said:

Then again, even the EXE-A is playable in the right hands, so...

Nothing says "OH SHI-" like an assault showing up where it shouldn't be.

[Zeddicuus]

Bad mechs? can such a thing really exist? Or perhaps it's just a mech that a particular person doesn't like to use for reasons that are valid to that individual?

I mean, I have read a wide range of mechs that are considered bad so far, and some of the ones one claimed as bad are ones I find work pretty good for how I play. Yet some mechs I've seen people lauding as excellent mechs I find I don't like using.

I admit I haven't tried them all yet, but I haven't yet seen a mech that is 100% by everyone considered bad.

[Dogmeat1]

PocketYoda, on 13 October 2022 - 08:30 PM, said:

Osiris as mentioned above.
Javelins are pretty poor
Spiders to me are bad, not because they can't function but because they add nothing to a team.

Vindicators are pretty bad.
Assassins have fallen to the curb.
Storm Crows have fallen and can't get up.
Black Lanners have been trash since they joined

Ebon Jags are way to flimsy
Hellfires are pretty crap.
Roughnecks are not great.
Summoners are not great.

Atlas are bullet magnets
Kodiaks are bullet magnets
Blood Asps are Bullet death..
Banshees are trash
Highlanders are too under armed.
Victors are too under armed.

Hatamotos are ****.


And anything that needs super quirks to function.

what's your metric for determining if a mech is bad? There is a difference betwen a mech being subpar, and a player using it in a subpar way. All mechs will perform badly if someone builds and/or uses it badly and player agency is a big factor in this game.

Nearly every mech you have listed is one that performs well in QP & FW, and some are even main choices in comp play Black lanners, assassins, blood asps, banshees, highlanders, javelins and summoners are all strong mechs. Atlases, kodiaks, hatamoto chis, ebon jaguars, vindicators and spiders are good too but they are more situational and tend to require players who are confident in their skills and map knowledge. Literally the only mechs in your list I don't feel are particularly good are the osiris and the stormcrow, and even those can be made to work.

Your results may differ but most players need to take a hard look at what they are doing wrong themselves before they can really make a reasonable assessment on what is good and what is not. You wouldn't expect someone who is still a learner driver to give accurate reviews of car performance because their perspective is heavily limited by their lack of experience and abilities.

[PocketYoda]

Dogmeat1, on 15 October 2022 - 08:11 PM, said:

what's your metric for determining if a mech is bad? There is a difference betwen a mech being subpar, and a player using it in a subpar way. All mechs will perform badly if someone builds and/or uses it badly and player agency is a big factor in this game.

Nearly every mech you have listed is one that performs well in QP & FW, and some are even main choices in comp play Black lanners, assassins, blood asps, banshees, highlanders, javelins and summoners are all strong mechs. Atlases, kodiaks, hatamoto chis, ebon jaguars, vindicators and spiders are good too but they are more situational and tend to require players who are confident in their skills and map knowledge. Literally the only mechs in your list I don't feel are particularly good are the osiris and the stormcrow, and even those can be made to work.

Your results may differ but most players need to take a hard look at what they are doing wrong themselves before they can really make a reasonable assessment on what is good and what is not. You wouldn't expect someone who is still a learner driver to give accurate reviews of car performance because their perspective is heavily limited by their lack of experience and abilities.

My metric is other mechs can do what they do far superior. They can have good games but as a whole they are sub par to the rest of the line up. I noticed Martian overlooked Vindicators and Osiris. Those Assaults aren't the pits its mostly they have a reputation and are so large everyone focuses them instantly, death in seconds.. Atlas especially.

As others said competent players will eat them up. Banshees should be great in theory but they are so wide they get cored before they can do enough to the enemies.. should be as strong as Atlas as they are bigger than Atlas.

As for ebon and summoners they really should be a little stronger like Timberwolves.

Edited by PocketYoda, 15 October 2022 - 09:13 PM.

[Vxheous]

PocketYoda, on 15 October 2022 - 08:53 PM, said:

My metric is other mech can do what they do far superior. They can have good games but as a whole they are sub par to the rest of the line up. I noticed Martian overlooked Vindicators and Osiris. Those Assaults aren't the pits its mostly they have a reputation and are so large everyone focuses them instantly, death in seconds.. Atlas especially.

As others said competent players will eat them up. Banshees should be great in theory but they are so wide they get cored before they can do enough to the enemies.. should be as strong as Atlas as they are bigger than Atlas.

As for ebon and summoners they really should be a little stronger like Timberwolves.

Your metric immediately fails then on the Summoner, since there's no other heavy that can poptart 3 CERPPC like the Summoner can (by that I mean superior to, since yes, the Night Gyr can poptart as well, but it's a 67kph vs 81kph mech)

Edited by Vxheous, 15 October 2022 - 09:18 PM.

[martian]

PocketYoda, on 15 October 2022 - 08:53 PM, said:

My metric is other mechs can do what they do far superior. They can have good games but as a whole they are sub par to the rest of the line up.

Sorry, but the original post of this thread stated:

Dekallis, on 08 October 2022 - 11:41 AM, said:

What Are The Worst Mechs?

I'm curious what the worst mechs in the game are, ...

See? "The worst 'Mechs in the game". Being slightly less powerful than the best 'Mechs in the game does not make them "the worst in the game".

The Cauldron-Born might be slightly less powerful than the Mad Cat, but that does not make it "the worst in the game". Most definitely not. The Cauldron-Born is still a good choice for any game mode.

PocketYoda, on 15 October 2022 - 08:53 PM, said:

I noticed Martian overlooked Vindicators and Osiris.

I did not. The Osiris is not the most powerful light 'Mech in the game, but in my personal opinion even some feeble Osiris variants are still better than for example SDR-5V Spider. At least they still have better firepower than two medium lasers of SDR-5V.

The Vindicator can still be useful in the game, but people have no big reason to take if some other more powerful 'Mechs are available. Again, being worse than some other 'Mechs does not make the Vindicator "the worst 'Mech in the game" on par with SDR-5V.

[Dogmeat1]

PocketYoda, on 15 October 2022 - 08:53 PM, said:

My metric is other mechs can do what they do far superior. They can have good games but as a whole they are sub par to the rest of the line up. I noticed Martian overlooked Vindicators and Osiris. Those Assaults aren't the pits its mostly they have a reputation and are so large everyone focuses them instantly, death in seconds.. Atlas especially.

As others said competent players will eat them up. Banshees should be great in theory but they are so wide they get cored before they can do enough to the enemies.. should be as strong as Atlas as they are bigger than Atlas.

As for ebon and summoners they really should be a little stronger like Timberwolves.

Again there is an issue here of player agency and ability that you are ignoring. You claim that summoners are bad and worse than timberwovles yet it is the summoner that is used in comp by top level players and not the timberwolf. Are you suggesting they are using an inferior mech on purpose or is your position that you know these mechs better than the best competitive players in this game? You said competent players will eat them but who are these competent players that you play against? Based on your stats you are likely around tier 3 or 4 and it’s unlikely you are being matched against anyone particularly skilled on a regular basis. The skill level even at tier 1 isn’t particular good and in general there aren't a lot of highly skilled players left playing QP regularly but a lot of the mechs you listed are ones I am confident I can carry my team in even in the rare cases I'm matched against a group of actual skilled players.

So the question that needs to be asked is; are you performing poorly in these mechs because they are bad mechs, or do you perform poorly in them because you play/build them ineffectively? Why do these mechs work for me against higher skilled opposition? Objectively speaking if skilled players are using them effectively against other skilled players then it’s likely that the fault for underperformance lies with the player and not the mech.

[Chloe Cole Kerensky]

I LOVE ANNIHILATORS, on 08 October 2022 - 12:06 PM, said:

Kintaro is pretty bad, Osiris is quite bad too.

As a current owner of an OSR-3D... You aren't wrong. I just checked the planned buffs for this patch. Literally none of them effect any loadout in the 3D that I would ever consider carrying. I've tried short range, and it's too weak to survive, I've tried long range and you while you can fit a couple LPL or PPC, it's a glass cannon. There are some loadouts where it really brings the pain in CQB, but again, it's a glass cannon. Not saying I never get a good game in it, but it's not survivable in any kind of stand up fight. Oh, and by the time you fit two 7 ton weapons, your speed is severely diminished. Most of the mechtech loadouts are "5mpl" type builds, which is brawler territory, and it's a glass cannon. 3LPPC is not too bad, and you can fit 4, so a HSL +1LPPC could be a reasonable buff that doesn't make it overpowered. But I have to scratch my head about the planned buffs. Small lasers? Really? as stated, it just doesn't have the survivability to brawl, and no ECM to survive to get close enough to brawl. By the time you max the engine you are pretty much stuck with small lasers, so I can see some method in the madness.

Anyways, Im still looking for something that works reliably, but it's just so fragile that the brawling loadouts are not really viable. If I were to describe it in terms of RPG it's a squishy DPS that needs to only run in a wolfpack.