236 replies to this topic

[-K H A N]

LordNothing, on 04 December 2022 - 01:05 PM, said:

my problem isnt the pug farming, its the fact that pug farming has made 90% of the people who would play fp leave, and results in wait times and dead zones too absurd to bother with. to the point where fp siege should become a comp mode, and the rest should become a replacement for the ever stale and not as quick as advertised qp, or just nuked entiely for a more limited eq default.

As I said, I am only just getting into FP and do agree about the long waits and dead times. I just did not realize the cause.But really it doesnt seem that bad.I have plenty of pug vs pug madness games. The weekends seem to be the real danger time to get murdered but thats when I just play vs my own damage score and try to do more each game against better opponents.As I understand things theres not going to be anymore development of this game beyond some map stuff and the occasional mech. I am just annoyed I seem to of missed the glory days of many players.

[LordNothing]

fp was indeed glorious back in the day, and even though i pugged through most of it i still maintained a w/l=1 for the duration. its just no longer practical for me to play it.

Edited by LordNothing, 04 December 2022 - 03:14 PM.

[-K H A N]

Heres a perhaps mad idea. How about a event mode where its just siege maps only with groups limited to 4 max ? The idea being qp stays qp, FP is where big groups of 12 (even if its just pugs) beat the hell out of each other and the new perm event queue could end up a nice stepping stone for players hesitant to get killed by a 12 man,but want the multi drop and siege maps of FP. From there perhaps these smaller groups might be encouraged to turn into bigger groups and try out FP for 12 man oughtright wars.
Maybe even sync dropping may not be a big problem if theres enough people playing.4 mans are easier to make than 12 or more it seems.My idea is that it is more a stepping stone for qp players to get into FP. But I am new so theres no doubt many many many issues with the idea. Maybe cleverer folk than I could make it work. I just want more folk in FP is all. I did my time in QP and for me FP is just so much better.

Edited by -K H A N, 05 December 2022 - 11:55 AM.

[Dozer6]

Gagis, on 03 December 2022 - 05:40 AM, said:

I'd love a dropdeck, even if just to be able to choose the mech thats better suited for each map.

Agreed 100%.
I don't want to play 4 mechs in a match, just the right ONE, 1, UNO.
I don't know why it is so hard to understand.

[pbiggz]

I wish I could say im surprised by how many people just knee jerk to the "DONT CHANGE ANYTHING" position, but im not surprised.

OP is actually proposing a good idea that would dramatically improve pretty much every aspect of the game, but change is scary, so the mech dads have cast their judgement.

[feeWAIVER]

Lockheed_, on 05 December 2022 - 11:34 PM, said:

As one of the players who is not supporting the OPs idea, I am of course against a change to a game mode that I enjoy very much as is. I do not need change for the purpose of change, that is just stupid. I have played FP and EQ and one of the major reasons why I don't touch either anymore is that I am getting bored to tears playing with drop decks. I do not have the motivation to go through several mechs playing the same map and the same match.

Oh plz, this is hyperbolic AF.
You're so bored playing *up to* 4 mechs on one map, but you're content to play the same maps repeatedly with a 5 minute queue between mechs. I think there's more to story, or maybe much less- but either way JUST DO IT PGI.

Edited by feeWAIVER, 06 December 2022 - 06:55 PM.

[feeWAIVER]

Bonus points if they can make Skirmish the sole game mode that only allows one mech, so people can still vote for a classic match.

[VeeOt Dragon]

honestly if you want drop decks so bad then go play FP. problem solved. they need all the players over there that they can get.

as things sit we have 3 game modes (without being negative, i know odd for me)

QP- relatively quick one and done matches

FP- longer more drawn out matches with drop decks and no MM

EQ- random ****, sometimes one and done sometimes drop decks always with some strange condition added to mix things up. (honestly its a good middle ground between QP and FP)

let the competitive people have their FP elitism and the more casual folks have their QP drops. that way you have something for everyone without dividing the dwindling population into to many separate buckets.

(honestly would it kill PGI to advertise a little. get the game out there so more folks know it even exists.)

Edited by VeeOt Dragon, 07 December 2022 - 02:48 AM.

[VeeOt Dragon]

Lockheed_, on 07 December 2022 - 04:55 AM, said:

Nope, it is exactly how it is.
I rarely vote for the popular maps which builds map vote multipliers really fast.
My queue times are on average below 3 minutes and I really enjoy the little break between matches.

i do the exact same thing. though mostly i save my multipliers to vote for anything but Solaris City (gods above and bellow i hate that map)

[sycocys]

VeeOt Dragon, on 07 December 2022 - 06:11 AM, said:

i do the exact same thing. though mostly i save my multipliers to vote for anything but Solaris City (gods above and bellow i hate that map)

I like the concept of Solaris city, but it is by far the ugliest map I've seen in the game. Like they plopped a casino in the middle of a freeway.

[An6ryMan69]

I'm not totally convinced four mech drop decks belong in quick play. The main reason is I have found in pretty frustrating in EQ matches with drop decks, once a team gets behind, you end up being dropped right into an enemy firing line set up to destroy players as soon as they appear. Having your last couple of mechs drop to certain death is basically terrible, plus, and I know it's a game, but seriously - nobody would do that, drop a single mech into six bad guys staring right at you? I mean, come on.

Now, having a drop deck available to pick from, and only being able to actually drop with one mech once you see the map and mission, that would be worth trying. I know guys have stated it would reduce the kinds of mechs on the field, but a change like that wouldn't have to be written in stone if it didn't work out. There's just something so idiotic about being force dropped into a Solaris City Conquest match with your LRM based Stalker for example, that could be avoided if a drop deck was experimented with.

[feeWAIVER]

An6ryMan69, on 07 December 2022 - 11:31 AM, said:

I'm not totally convinced four mech drop decks belong in quick play. The main reason is I have found in pretty frustrating in EQ matches with drop decks, once a team gets behind, you end up being dropped right into an enemy firing line set up to destroy players as soon as they appear. Having your last couple of mechs drop to certain death is basically terrible, plus, and I know it's a game, but seriously - nobody would do that, drop a single mech into six bad guys staring right at you? I mean, come on.

Now, having a drop deck available to pick from, and only being able to actually drop with one mech once you see the map and mission, that would be worth trying. I know guys have stated it would reduce the kinds of mechs on the field, but a change like that wouldn't have to be written in stone if it didn't work out. There's just something so idiotic about being force dropped into a Solaris City Conquest match with your LRM based Stalker for example, that could be avoided if a drop deck was experimented with.

I dunno which EQ weekend you're talking about.
The recent events have had games ending with everyone having 1-3 mechs left to drop in every game I played, for hours.

[pbiggz]

feeWAIVER, on 07 December 2022 - 04:03 PM, said:

I dunno which EQ weekend you're talking about.
The recent events have had games ending with everyone having 1-3 mechs left to drop in every game I played, for hours.

I think one of the primary concerns being fielded is that matches would last too long, but dropdecks just make actually playing the objective the faster way to end the match.

When's the last time you actually had to defend your base on assault? Because right now its just skirmish with a square for light mechs to grief. Factor in respawns and suddenly its a game mode that begets strategy. And the matches still wont last more than 10 minutes. It also takes no development time to put a 10 minute time limit on matches, so if that's what you really want, its not an unreasonable ask, and drop decks dont make it impossible.

[LordNothing]

thats the biggest issue i have, quick play is supposed to be quick. as it stands, it is not. map voting is a major contributing factor, and i can imagine what just adding mech selection will do. if you get 4 spawns, it will make it longer still. hiting the qp button will lock you into a 20 minute cycle minimum.

decked modes in eq are awesome, just do more of those.

i wouldn't mind a little investigation into live open arena modes though. more traditional deathmatch where you can join and leave a match in progress at will. so you aren't spending so much time searching for games. mega maps with mega objective sequences would be good too. drop a lance work on the current objective, when you die requeue and join again (though too much dev required). or royal rumble style, where a new lance drops on a timer whether the previous players have been burned or not (sort of like team ffa).

Edited by LordNothing, 08 December 2022 - 02:25 PM.

[hypographia]

Reading this thread, which I hope continues to live...it seems like we have a case of dual agendas here, or at least some conflation between two dissimilar ideas with very similar phrasing.

I think there may be some who want a 4-mech drop deck like you see in FP for quick play - to that I say hard pass. Keep QP quick. Event queue? Sure, go for it. I've had the most fun in this game in YEARS with the wacky event queue game modes (all rocket marauders were hilarious).

I think others are proposing a 4 mech selection deck, whereby you can create a QP drop deck that has four variants of a given chassis, and if you get Solaris, you put away the blue lasers in exchange for srms or jumpjets... THAT version, I wholeheartedly support!

I'd love to be able to drop into a match with a map-relevant build versus going with the meta, some min/max atrocity, or suffering through X rounds to get my multiplier up to play the variant I'm keen on at the moment.

To say it would take away from the fun of using different builds seems misguided. It would in fact, encourage MORE time in the Mech Lab, more map/strat-to-build considerations, and more experimentation outside one's comfort zone (i.e. don't just drop with blue lasers all the time, map-be-damned, but throw in a SPL, AC20, or other brawly build for those maps).

[pbiggz]

hypographia, on 08 December 2022 - 03:12 PM, said:

Reading this thread, which I hope continues to live...it seems like we have a case of dual agendas here, or at least some conflation between two dissimilar ideas with very similar phrasing.

I think there may be some who want a 4-mech drop deck like you see in FP for quick play - to that I say hard pass. Keep QP quick. Event queue? Sure, go for it. I've had the most fun in this game in YEARS with the wacky event queue game modes (all rocket marauders were hilarious).

I think others are proposing a 4 mech selection deck, whereby you can create a QP drop deck that has four variants of a given chassis, and if you get Solaris, you put away the blue lasers in exchange for srms or jumpjets... THAT version, I wholeheartedly support!

I'd love to be able to drop into a match with a map-relevant build versus going with the meta, some min/max atrocity, or suffering through X rounds to get my multiplier up to play the variant I'm keen on at the moment.

To say it would take away from the fun of using different builds seems misguided. It would in fact, encourage MORE time in the Mech Lab, more map/strat-to-build considerations, and more experimentation outside one's comfort zone (i.e. don't just drop with blue lasers all the time, map-be-damned, but throw in a SPL, AC20, or other brawly build for those maps).

I want respawns,

and I want the end condition for matches to be that people actually played the objective; if that means skirmish and domination have to be no respawn game modes, fine, but assault, conquest, and incursion were clearly designed with respawns in mind and the lack of them in this, a now 10+ year old game, is kind of embarrassing.

These matches can still be quick; we have a match timer. PGI can set whatever limit they like.

[Gas Guzzler]

I wouldn't mind drop decks where you only get to pick one mech. At least you don't have to be forced to use an unpleasant combination of mech/mode/map. But... this discussion has been beaten to death over the years, we know certain people are going to come out and come up with reasons why we should enjoy playing with the wrong mech for the map.

[hbgpanther]

I'd rather see R&D in making literally any other mode more worth its salt. QP is reasonably stable, but the conversation can never get past it in making a mode worth the long run.

[VeeOt Dragon]

the idea put forth that i sort of like is the idea of having a deck of mechs you get to choose one from after map selection and that is the mech you play in that match (one mech one life). the trouble with this is that the MM is already rather ****** and has enough trouble with groups let alone if each player was picking from a list of mechs after the MM had set the teams. the only way i think that might make this work is either stipulating that all mechs selected must be of the same chassis (though this in itself would further limit the variety of mechs you would see as some are not all that diverse in available hardpoints/quirks.) or restrict it so that all mechs in the deck have to be of the same tonnage. now the second could bring in mechs that are not used as much as you would have to pic all say 85 tonners if your primary mech you want to use is the Stalker.

the biggest problem is again the MM. any form of drop deck be it like FP or the pick one mech type would further throw it out of wack. one of the biggest advantages of QP i the MM as broken as it is. QP is the first mode new players will likely play and as such the MM helps to keep them from being pug farmed by t1 and t2 players. any form of drop deck would further hamper the new player experience in that it would make it even harder for these new players since you only get i think 4 mech bays to start with and perhaps enough c-bills to buy and fit out 1 mech (maybe two if you go with light mechs, it has been a very long time since i was a new player and i don't know how many c-bills you end up with after you get out of training).

as much as we older players may want this or that feature we must always keep the new players in mind as they are what really keep this game going. its the new players that are more likely to spend real money on the game in the way of cosmetics and mech packs where those of use who have been playing for a number of years likely are sitting on quite the stash of c-bills and MC (i know i have more c-bills than i know what to do with and plenty of extra mech bays that have yet to be filled, hell i don't know how many extra engines and other components i floating around in storage from multiple mech rebuilds. i even likely have a number of IS XLs floating around as i normal go with LEs because they are more survivable.)

[PocketYoda]

Even if we had drop decks you wouldn't have to use all of them, PGI could still lock it to one mech a match, you'd just have 4 choices instead of one.