78 replies to this topic

[sycocys]

Widowmaker1981, on 09 March 2023 - 08:07 AM, said:

Ill be honest, i dont care if the terrain is realistic, i care if it leads to (what i consider to be) enjoyable matches.

I dont ever find matches won by rotation to be enjoyable as they are almost always stomps. Id rather lose a close fought game than win a 12-0 stomp, so my primary focus is on wanting maps that prevent rotation - that doesnt guarantee a good match, of course, but it improves the odds a great deal.

I'd rather have more believable terrain and layouts than what's been made, for the most part I think it would also help to shift away from the circling as well across the board.

[Knownswift]

More realistic terrain will not prevent people from playing an arena game like an arena game.


Gimme some outerspace low gravity walk on the ceiling stuff.

[Tam Wolfcry]

I still don't like the system. I was running a 30 ton Javelin, did slightly over 400 points of damage, killed three mechs....my side did lose...and my PSR got the big fat = sign. Are you kidding me? A slow *** 30 ton mech with all of four weapons on it...got three kills and a decent amount of damage...and my PSR stayed the same? That is stupid. I'm sorry, but it honestly is. They really need to take the WIN/LOSS division out of it completely and just make the value off of what you did. I know the game is old...but it is enjoying a resurgence. Do something with PSR. Probably for most players, it really doesn't matter much. They are happy to be where they are at and couldn't care less. But for the players that are actually trying to improve it...the current system does not make sense. Basically, I should just play my archer 100% of the time. That mech typically always gets a PSR boost as long as I don't run afoul of bad luck or doing something stupid. The game really does not encourage trying new builds or mechs....because unless they are designed for the current Damage WINS meta...then most likely you will lose PSR piloting them.

Here's a really easy idea to implement: Cut the amount of PSR lost by 50% across the board. Make it so losses aren't so horrible to have. You are really stingy with gaining PSR. Especially when your success counts on eleven other people not sucking. Make losses hurt less.

This will open up more options for people to explore playing the game without worrying about their PSR rating dropping. They get to experiment more, play more mechs, encourage them to BUY more mechs and not just the current ones that work great in the Meta.

That would be a relatively simple change to make and has benefits across the board for players. We all love positive reinforcement. I was stoked to get such a good match in that Javelin. It only has missiles...which is not really a great thing in the current meta for a light mech. But I had a great game...and because my side lost...I got nothing for it. That really put a damper on my brief celebration.

Lets face it, the expectations you put on light mechs to earn PSR in this game is ridiculous. And if your team loses, nearly impossible to reach. I honestly have no reason why that bar is set so high. Unless you really don't take tonnage into account, or it matters very little...which seems counter-intuitive to any reasonable system. So yeah, I know you aren't going to fix the PSR system...fine...but at least make the amount of PSR you lose, much less.

[Widowmaker1981]

Tam Wolfcry, on 21 April 2023 - 07:21 AM, said:

I still don't like the system. I was running a 30 ton Javelin, did slightly over 400 points of damage, killed three mechs....my side did lose...and my PSR got the big fat = sign. Are you kidding me? A slow *** 30 ton mech with all of four weapons on it...got three kills and a decent amount of damage...and my PSR stayed the same? That is stupid. I'm sorry, but it honestly is. They really need to take the WIN/LOSS division out of it completely and just make the value off of what you did. I know the game is old...but it is enjoying a resurgence. Do something with PSR. Probably for most players, it really doesn't matter much. They are happy to be where they are at and couldn't care less. But for the players that are actually trying to improve it...the current system does not make sense. Basically, I should just play my archer 100% of the time. That mech typically always gets a PSR boost as long as I don't run afoul of bad luck or doing something stupid. The game really does not encourage trying new builds or mechs....because unless they are designed for the current Damage WINS meta...then most likely you will lose PSR piloting them.

Here's a really easy idea to implement: Cut the amount of PSR lost by 50% across the board. Make it so losses aren't so horrible to have. You are really stingy with gaining PSR. Especially when your success counts on eleven other people not sucking. Make losses hurt less.

This will open up more options for people to explore playing the game without worrying about their PSR rating dropping. They get to experiment more, play more mechs, encourage them to BUY more mechs and not just the current ones that work great in the Meta.

That would be a relatively simple change to make and has benefits across the board for players. We all love positive reinforcement. I was stoked to get such a good match in that Javelin. It only has missiles...which is not really a great thing in the current meta for a light mech. But I had a great game...and because my side lost...I got nothing for it. That really put a damper on my brief celebration.

Lets face it, the expectations you put on light mechs to earn PSR in this game is ridiculous. And if your team loses, nearly impossible to reach. I honestly have no reason why that bar is set so high. Unless you really don't take tonnage into account, or it matters very little...which seems counter-intuitive to any reasonable system. So yeah, I know you aren't going to fix the PSR system...fine...but at least make the amount of PSR you lose, much less.

Its beeen said, but I really dont know of another way to say that PSR isnt an XP bar and going up to higher tiers isnt a reward, its simply a matchmaker function to (try to) put people up against similarly skilled opposition.

It used to be easier to climb tiers and it was changed to be harder, because it was functioning too much like an XP bar and not actually doing what its meant to be doing.

If you are good enough to be in T1, you will get there. If your T isnt rising, you dont want to be in T1.

PSR gain / loss is largely based on match score, and lighter mechs get a bonus to that, so it shouldnt be harder to climb in them (eg i get significantly higher matchscore in a 45 ton mech than i do in a 90 ton mech for the same performance). On the face of it, 400 dmg and 3 kills is a reasonable game, but if you got an = it means at least 33% of the players scored better than you did (i think its top 33% go up, middle 33% stay the same and bottom 33% go down, but i could be wrong on the percentages).

[TheCaptainJZ]

Win/Loss doesn't add that much to the calculation. Maybe 25 points? Again, the main deciding factor is damage so of course T1 is going to be dominated by primarily Assault players whereas T5 should be more of the light pilots. It is a good time for PGI to look at PSR and tweak some of those rewards though. It might help.

With more and more players playing assaults (seems every new mech is a heavy or assault) it oversaturates every match so in lighter mechs it's harder and harder to stay competitive. Power creep is real.

Edited by TheCaptainJZ, 21 April 2023 - 08:06 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

TheCaptainJZ, on 21 April 2023 - 08:05 AM, said:

Win/Loss doesn't add that much to the calculation. Maybe 25 points? Again, the main deciding factor is damage so of course T1 is going to be dominated by primarily Assault players whereas T5 should be more of the light pilots. It is a good time for PGI to look at PSR and tweak some of those rewards though. It might help.

With more and more players playing assaults (seems every new mech is a heavy or assault) it oversaturates every match so in lighter mechs it's harder and harder to stay competitive. Power creep is real.

My average match score is significantly higher in mediums than it is in assaults, so id actually have risen faster in PSR if id played mediums exclusively, rather than splitting my time between meds, heavies and assaults fairly evenly (lights can do one as far as im concerned)

In fairness, thats partly because i play more 'random' assault mech builds than i do mediums (IS PPFLD is fun to mess with, but its so heavy assault tonnage is needed to have much room to play around with those type of builds), but id still dispute that its noticeably easier to gain PSR in heavier mechs.

[VeeOt Dragon]

honestly just ignore PSR,

though i do agree on some lvl that there needs to be a little more credit given to objectives. nothing is more hilarious to me than when i am on the losing team based on kills but one enterprising fast mover goes out and wins the match for us by caps. especially if its a stomp that makes it even more fun. sadly people rarely play the objectives other than Conquest (conquest is one that if you don't pay attention to the capture nodes you can lose a match real quick.).

i personally always vote for match types with an alternate win condition. this is mostly because you have people that when they are the last mech standing they run off and hide somewhere, go to an out of the way spot and shut down sort of ****. i'm ok if they are running off to reposition then come back from another angle to attack thats ok, its annoying that it drags out the match but they are doing something. its the ones that run and hid that piss me off. (had two matches the day of this post where the last mech just ran off and hid (one was domination the other i think was Assault) and i called out on coms to just take the objective and not bother chasing him. both won by cap ending the match with at least a 3rd of the match timer left.) no one wants to sit there and wait for the clock to run out because of a coward who just want to preserve some arbitrary KDR. i'm happy if i get at least one kill per match and 400dmg (most often i do far better than that if you include KMDD)

as others have said you really don't want to be in T1 anyway. it starts getting boring the more so called "Elite" players you go against. you start only seeing a handful of chassis and only 2 or three real build types. the diversity and fun just vanishes. i am happy here in T3 enough challenge to be fun while i rarely ever feel like i am clubbing seals or beating my head against a wall. (oh you have times where the T1 groups game the system to pull down their average Tier so they can go club seals but that is never going to change unless they change the MM. easy enough change but they only ever seem to cater to the T1 comp players anyway.)

as for the OP's build yeah that is way light on weapons even for a Locust. then again you did chose the missile Locust. Missile weapons are in general tonnage hungry (Ballistic is more other than MGs). most of the locust builds i see are MGs and energy of some kind. (then again i can't give any advice on that as the only Light mech i play are the Urbies)

Edited by VeeOt Dragon, 21 April 2023 - 09:15 AM.

[BLACKR0SE]

I have not seen one of those who say "ignore psr" choose a large map.
Whenever I reach level 3, you always fight on small maps.
or it's hot maps
I have yet to see a cold map selected.

They don't like laser builds.
full balistic

Edited by TAMTAMBABY, 21 April 2023 - 06:58 PM.

[BLACKR0SE]

At this rate, I will make all the machines ballistic.

[Heavy Money]

Tam Wolfcry, on 21 April 2023 - 07:21 AM, said:

Here's a really easy idea to implement: Cut the amount of PSR lost by 50% across the board. Make it so losses aren't so horrible to have. You are really stingy with gaining PSR. Especially when your success counts on eleven other people not sucking. Make losses hurt less.

Guys if you're struggling to get PSR up and you're not even in t1 why do you want to have it made easier to get? You're just going to move up and get harder matches. And then you're going to come on here and complain. What do you think is actually going to happen if you get what you're asking for? There's no reward.

Tam Wolfcry, on 21 April 2023 - 07:21 AM, said:

This will open up more options for people to explore playing the game without worrying about their PSR rating dropping. They get to experiment more, play more mechs, encourage them to BUY more mechs and not just the current ones that work great in the Meta.

No it won't do any of that. It will take the bottom tiers, who are currently mostly safe, and it will throw them straight into the shark tank against t1's. The forums are already full of complaints about match making disparities.

Tam Wolfcry, on 21 April 2023 - 07:21 AM, said:

That would be a relatively simple change to make and has benefits across the board for players. We all love positive reinforcement. I was stoked to get such a good match in that Javelin. It only has missiles...which is not really a great thing in the current meta for a light mech. But I had a great game...and because my side lost...I got nothing for it. That really put a damper on my brief celebration.

Splat lights and fast mediums are good. There's nothing wrong with them. People run them in high tiers all the time. You don't understand what the meta actually is. I'm not saying this to make fun of you or be mean. I'm saying you really don't know what you're asking for. Group up with some t1 players and spend time in higher tier matches and you'll understand quickly.

Tam Wolfcry, on 21 April 2023 - 07:21 AM, said:

Lets face it, the expectations you put on light mechs to earn PSR in this game is ridiculous. And if your team loses, nearly impossible to reach. I honestly have no reason why that bar is set so high. Unless you really don't take tonnage into account, or it matters very little...which seems counter-intuitive to any reasonable system. So yeah, I know you aren't going to fix the PSR system...fine...but at least make the amount of PSR you lose, much less.

Light mechs are perfectly capable of dealing damage and earning PSR. They aren't as effective at farming low tier players, but in a balanced match where people don't let you just farm them that divide disappears. And there's not really any penalty for losing. There's the incidental penalty that you need to be alive to deal damage, and if your team crumbles you'll not get the chance, sure. But ranking up on a loss isn't difficult if you're actually doing well.


Your entire complaint is that you're having trouble placing in the top 3rd of the match. And your solution is...to have you get put into even harder matches. That's not going to help. You're going to end up ranking down even on wins if you do that.

Edited by Heavy Money, 21 April 2023 - 07:10 PM.

[BLACKR0SE]

Heavy Money, on 21 April 2023 - 07:02 PM, said:

Guys if you're struggling to get PSR up and you're not even in t1 why do you want to have it made easier to get? You're just going to move up and get harder matches. And then you're going to come on here and complain. What do you think is actually going to happen if you get what you're asking for? There's no reward.

Do you think I don't know that?

A person cannot live without purpose. There is no pleasure in living without purpose.
People always have goals.
the reward you seek is in your mind.

[Heavy Money]

TAMTAMBABY, on 21 April 2023 - 07:09 PM, said:

Do you think I don't know that? A person cannot live without purpose. There is no pleasure in living without purpose. People always have goals. the reward you seek is in your mind.

If you'd like to experience higher tier matches, you're welcome to send me a friend request in game. We can group up and you'll get dragged up into the higher tiers. You can have the high PSR experience all you want

(Also note that I added more to that post you quoted after you replied.)

[BLACKR0SE]

Heavy Money, on 21 April 2023 - 07:11 PM, said:

If you'd like to experience higher tier matches, you're welcome to send me a friend request in game. We can group up and you'll get dragged up into the higher tiers. You can have the high PSR experience all you want

(Also note that I added more to that post you quoted after you replied.)

I get invitations from many people like you. Thank you, I have no doubt that many of you have good intentions. but I would be happy if you play with someone you can communicate with instantly by typing and speaking. not someone like me who uses translation while typing. this is a mountain that i have to climb alone

Have fun.

[Heavy Money]

TAMTAMBABY, on 21 April 2023 - 07:22 PM, said:

I get invitations from many people like you. Thank you, I have no doubt that many of you have good intentions. but I would be happy if you play with someone you can communicate with instantly by typing and speaking. not someone like me who uses translation while typing. this is a mountain that i have to climb alone

Have fun.

Ah, I understand. Good luck!

[PocketYoda]

It should be based on KMDDs heh.

[Heavy Money]

PocketYoda, on 22 April 2023 - 06:43 AM, said:

It should be based on KMDDs heh.

Its mostly based on damage, so it mostly is.

[crazytimes]

Nine-Ball, on 22 April 2023 - 01:20 AM, said:

If your solo quickplay then raising your PSR can be tricky due to numerous factors outside your control

Yeah I don't really see that. Makes no sense. Over a large sample size, any metric that assesses your ability to influence outcomes is going to do exactly that. If the result of the metric is you're at the point you should be... then that's what it is.

The communities biggest issue is that the old system was just an XP bar, and there was effectively no way for most people to go down. Post the resets and new system, it's not perfect, but at least there is scope for downwards movement. The people at the lower end of the spectrum feel there was something taken away from them.