79 replies to this topic

[VaelophisNyx]

genuinely, explain to me why having their spread REDUCED was a good thing
they already were far too capable of sniping before this patch, and probably needed a spread increase.

this makes me wonder what on earth PGI is thinking when it comes to balance, and is certainly reinforcing the mindset that they enjoy sniper gameplay and nothing else

[RickySpanish]

Time between pellets was increased; twist more.

[ComradeHavoc]

RickySpanish, on 19 September 2023 - 06:08 PM, said:

Time between pellets was increased; twist more.

Doesn't solve the issue of them being a better overall UAC for clan.

[martian]

VaelophisNyx, on 19 September 2023 - 05:08 PM, said:

genuinely, explain to me why having their spread REDUCED was a good thing
they already were far too capable of sniping before this patch, and probably needed a spread increase.

this makes me wonder what on earth PGI is thinking when it comes to balance, and is certainly reinforcing the mindset that they enjoy sniper gameplay and nothing else

PGI does what Cauldron boys tell them to do.

[Vonbach]

martian, on 19 September 2023 - 08:50 PM, said:

PGI does what Cauldron boys tell them to do.

Snipers need their OP weapons

[Meep Meep]

RickySpanish, on 19 September 2023 - 06:08 PM, said:

Time between pellets was increased; twist more.

While there is some merit in this after testing it out all day today I can't tell that hags were changed in any way. Still running cool still hitting all my pellets but now more hit the component I was aiming at.

~shrug~

[Samziel]

Vonbach, on 19 September 2023 - 10:06 PM, said:

Snipers need their OP weapons

Still not really a sniper weapon.

I don't really get why HAGs got a buff for spread but they did nerf them with the duration quite a bit. Damage is now much easier to spread around and its much harder to shoot moving targets at medium to long ranges effectively.

If you're the kinda person that just stares at the enemy standing still then of course they delete you fast. Same as any other weapon at that point.

I feel like they're still bit too powerful ton to ton but they didn't just straight up buff them.

Edited by Samziel, 19 September 2023 - 10:58 PM.

[VaelophisNyx]

Samziel, on 19 September 2023 - 10:30 PM, said:

Still not really a sniper weapon.

I don't really get why HAGs got a buff for spread but they did nerf them with the duration quite a bit. Damage is now much easier to spread around and its much harder to shoot moving targets at medium to long ranges effectively.

If you're the kinda person that just stares at the enemy standing still then of course they delete you fast. Same as any other weapon at that point.

I feel like they're still bit too powerful ton to ton but they didn't just straight up buff them.

Quite a bit is....0.3s
that's barely anything

[Samziel]

VaelophisNyx, on 19 September 2023 - 11:15 PM, said:

Quite a bit is....0.3s
that's barely anything

Gotta admit it feels much longer in game. Regardless it hits their effectiveness in longer ranges. Didn't really need the spread reduction though.

Edited by Samziel, 19 September 2023 - 11:22 PM.

[Meep Meep]

VaelophisNyx, on 19 September 2023 - 11:15 PM, said:

Quite a bit is....0.3s
that's barely anything

Try .03 seconds additional duration between pellets on the hag30. The first few times I noticed the longer delay just a bit because I had been playing it right before the patch hit. But just a few shots into practicing jj shooting on a test map and was nailing all the shots as usual. I can see agile mechs being able to dodge a bit more of it at range but they could already do that before.

[Necroconvict]

They did not need increased accuracy, they needed it decreased.

Snipe Warrior

[VeeOt Dragon]

pretty much, the Cauldron folks are all about long range sniping and **** anything else.

[CFC Conky]

RickySpanish, on 19 September 2023 - 06:08 PM, said:

Time between pellets was increased; twist more.

As long as you know you're being shot with one...

Good hunting,
CFC Conky

Edited by CFC Conky, 20 September 2023 - 02:33 PM.

[PocketYoda]

There is nothing like a good HAG suck it up..

[The6thMessenger]

I'd rather they retained the 0.11s interval, consistent with UACs burst-fire, and just reduced projectile speed to something like 1650m/s to 1500 m/s.

Samziel, on 19 September 2023 - 10:30 PM, said:

Still not really a sniper weapon.

It kind of is, as big part to the playstyle is the long-range, and boy it is accurate enough.

It's face-time and multiple-pellets doesn't really discount it: laser has the longer burn, and the pellet is largely problematic with fast moving targets -- means viable to slow-*** heavies and assaults, and even though it's not 15 PPFLD a pop, it's 20-40 damage all the same that can compensate for it.

[RickySpanish]

All you have to do is twist your 'Mech to spread the damage. That's it, the Big Bad Midrange Sniper cannot possibly land every pellet in the same location if you block them with some other part of your 'Mech. Just wiggle your joystick side to side for a moment, you'll break LRM lock but at least you won't eat a face full of skill.

[Ken Harkin]

Spread is Down
Duration is Up

The answer for those being targeted by them is to KEEP MOVING. With these changes a stationary target will eat the damage from all the shots, and not uncommonly in the same component. If you are moving though it is likely some will miss entirely or be spread across components.

The why it works this way or if it should be this way is secondary. That is what the Cauldron wants and they get what they want. We need to simply deal with it.

[ComradeHavoc]

Ken Harkin, on 21 September 2023 - 06:39 AM, said:

[...]The why it works this way or if it should be this way is secondary. That is what the Cauldron wants and they get what they want. We need to simply deal with it.

How about we don't acquiesces to the top 1% of sweaties that always end up ruining games by pushing their boring 1 dimensional metas until it becomes the only viable playstyle, in this case a bunch of meta mechers playing nothing but high alpha long range.

"Cauldron balance" is already a slogan for this, and its' starting to catch on.

Keep moving and twist isn't a solution, that's something you can apply to everything, and HAGs pack a punch of 20~40 per burst, run cool, and fire consistently, they're just a straight up upgrade to C-UACs that pushes the worst boring aspects of Cauldron playstyle.

[Karhyy]

ComradeHavoc, on 21 September 2023 - 07:43 AM, said:

they're just a straight up upgrade to C-UACs that pushes the worst boring aspects of Cauldron playstyle.

Exactly. Are HAGs OP in the literal sense? The debate is still ongoing. Are they very strong and clear powercreep? Absolutely. I'm willing to bet that the recent buffs to UACs were made solely just to catch up littlebit with HAGs, but it was nowhere near enough.

[RickySpanish]

ComradeHavoc, on 21 September 2023 - 07:43 AM, said:

How about we don't acquiesces to the top 1% of sweaties that always end up ruining games by pushing their boring 1 dimensional metas until it becomes the only viable playstyle, in this case a bunch of meta mechers playing nothing but high alpha long range.

"Cauldron balance" is already a slogan for this, and its' starting to catch on.

Keep moving and twist isn't a solution, that's something you can apply to everything, and HAGs pack a punch of 20~40 per burst, run cool, and fire consistently, they're just a straight up upgrade to C-UACs that pushes the worst boring aspects of Cauldron playstyle.

It's literally the solution. Well that, and not eating a full load to the face to begin with.