27 replies to this topic

[Meep Meep]

Well well well..




Sooo any bets on a coming lockonageddon? Currently the balance had me even on max sensor boosted mechs just barely missing getting a lock in most situations when ecm was involved. Now I'm going to be getting waaaaaay more locks which means at least one salvo out where none were possible before. Will be interesting to see if this survives more than one patch cycle.

[Weeny Machine]

Meep Meep, on 05 April 2024 - 02:16 PM, said:

Well well well..




Sooo any bets on a coming lockonageddon? Currently the balance had me even on max sensor boosted mechs just barely missing getting a lock in most situations when ecm was involved. Now I'm going to be getting waaaaaay more locks which means at least one salvo out where none were possible before. Will be interesting to see if this survives more than one patch cycle.

As soon as assault players cry, the show is over. If a sniper gets his day ruined by LRMs, they will for sure even put in an extra patch.

Edited by Weeny Machine, 05 April 2024 - 03:01 PM.

[Moadebe]

I dont see a lrmageddon from this. Not yet at least. ECM sensor range reduction would need to be lowered for that to happen. Along with radar dep being nerfed just a little more.

However. Probably right. If the assault snipey players die even once from em its going to be hilarious.

[Captain Caveman DE]

also, remember that fact that somebody has to get that lock ;D


while this might be a buff for anybody direct firing, getting his own locks,
we all know and love those "get me a lock, and I'll make it rain" people.
we'll have to see how it changes their "playstyle".
I wouldn't bet against "keeping the ecm changes, but nerfing IDF some more" in the next patch.
-which would be an okay way to solve this.

[Sjorpha]

Current lock on missiles are way too weak for that to cause a "Lurmageddon", you could remove ECM and AMS from the game and they still wouldn't be competitive weapons.

I think it's a good change though.

Edited by Sjorpha, 06 April 2024 - 06:01 AM.

[ComradeHavoc]

If only we had some kind of anti-missile system that everyone could equip so as a group it would screen lockons.

[CFC Conky]

Am I wrong to think this will boost Streaks more than LRMs? I don’t use either very much.

Good Hunting,
CFC Conky

[Vincefeld]

ECM has way too many things for 1t.
Something needed to go. They left 2x lockon slowdown, i'd remove it entirely, but restore ECM sensor range reduction.

Harder to spot ECM user, but if he got too close he should be punished for it and its fair.
Radar derp really needs to be looked into. Ideally radar derp 5 vs target decay 5 should looks like radar derp 0 vs target decay 0

Constantly disappearing and appearing blips on radar are annoying and straight up cheese game mechanics of sensor spotting.

[Meep Meep]

ComradeHavoc, on 06 April 2024 - 07:18 AM, said:

If only we had some kind of anti-missile system that everyone could equip so as a group it would screen lockons.

And not get my extra ton of ammo or armor or uprated engine etc?

But yeah if lock ons do become more viable in quick play then expect to see more ams and even more ecm.

[Be Rough With Me Plz]

Sounds like the people who have been responsible for continually ******** on lock-on weapons and the people that use them, while also never using them in any meaningful capacity, wanted to try the new Thunderbolt missiles and are finally realizing how difficult it is to use against ECM and/or max Radar Derp.

Hilarious.

[Weeny Machine]

Be Rough With Me Plz, on 06 April 2024 - 05:00 PM, said:

Sounds like the people who have been responsible for continually ******** on lock-on weapons and the people that use them, while also never using them in any meaningful capacity, wanted to try the new Thunderbolt missiles and are finally realizing how difficult it is to use against ECM and/or max Radar Derp.

Hilarious.

This is the way of Cauldron "balancing". Things they like get buffed. Things they don't like rot. Guess what they don't like...

The same goes for mech classes

Edited by Weeny Machine, 07 April 2024 - 05:03 AM.

[Cyborne Elemental]

I still think that the skilltree should be adjusted for ECM/Radar Dep.

ECM mechs should be incapable of any radar dep, as well as skilltree sensor range bonuses.

The three skills need to be divided.

Then have quirks adjusted accordingly.

The whole Triple stack of bonuses from that 1 single tree is ridiculous.

[feeWAIVER]

I don't use ECM, so nothing will change for me.

[martian]

feeWAIVER, on 07 April 2024 - 07:08 AM, said:

I don't use ECM, so nothing will change for me.

Only one or two 'Mechs, that I run more often, carry ECM.

[foamyesque]

Meep Meep, on 06 April 2024 - 03:55 PM, said:

And not get my extra ton of ammo or armor or uprated engine etc?

But yeah if lock ons do become more viable in quick play then expect to see more ams and even more ecm.

you don't understand meep


that 25th cDHS is critically important to my build

[Be Rough With Me Plz]

Weeny Machine, on 07 April 2024 - 05:02 AM, said:

This is the way of Cauldron "balancing".

Believe me, I know. Roughly 90-95% of my matches I drop in Brawlers. I've been around since 2013-2014 and after the whole Clan v. IS tech/mech flamewars/debates I mostly stopped coming to the forums. The whole topic pretty much died once PGI released the 90% clan win rate against IS and only the truly obstinate people wanted to continue downplaying the massive advantage the Clan side had/has.

This whole topic about lock-on weapons is very similar to the Clan v. IS arguments in regards to the people trying to *explain* to us non-CS players how hard it is and how skilled you need to be to put out damage from 1,000 meters out on people who have 0 ranged weapons v. using LRM's specifically and how much more situational and positional awareness you need when you're firing in-direct on-the-move where people are more than unwilling to expose their own armor to get locks for others. The situational/positional awareness comes even more into play when you're flanking with an LRM boat to get better angles against environmental obstacles or repositioning to get your own los-lock.

The difference in this debate is that the people who have a clear and heavy bias against LRM's are in an actual position to make changes in the game that conforms with their biases. That's incredibly stupid and the game has suffered because of it.

Good LRM use requires the same skills as brawling, but I doubt you'll hear anyone in a position to make changes to this game admit that.

Personally, I stopped bothering with responding to the Cauldron changes once I got Bassault to admit his bias against LRM's in this entertaining thread.

https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__6506467

[Ignatius Audene]

I don't rly understand where this idea comes from. The only nerv I can remember cauldron implemented was the velocity nerv. They did in fact nerv radar deprivation, ECM range (bubble and sensor impact), now ECM lock on time.
The lock on changes where made before cauldron and are no easy thing to change because of Frankenstein engine.
I think the velo nerv could be reverted and I think ECM can lose lock on time increase (I rarely run ECM and only 3 radar derp and have no issues with Lrm). Much more buffing would be problematic without destroying tier 5 and 4 experience.) if Lrm are good in tier 1 play they will shred tier 5.

Edited by Ignatius Audene, 08 April 2024 - 12:16 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

Quicksilver Aberration, on 07 April 2024 - 08:42 PM, said:

[Redacted]

You don't want to imply that ERPPC/Gauss long range fire is as challenging and requires as much repositioning as LRMs?
The myriads of assaults which park themselves at a high point at the beginning of the game and then never ever move disagree.

The next problem is that there are so many ECM mechs that getting locks isn't that easy and if you try to get them they unload a high alpha and till your slow moving lrms reach them they are in cover again.

And this is from someone who plays lock on weapons for the fun only now and then

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Weeny Machine, on 08 April 2024 - 09:40 AM, said:

You don't want to imply that ERPPC/Gauss long range fire is as challenging and requires as much repositioning as LRMs?
The myriads of assaults which park themselves at a high point at the beginning of the game and then never ever move disagree.

I could say the exact same about bad players using LRMs as you can about bad players using ERPPC/Gauss. Cherry-picking bad play on both sides doesn't do the conversation any good.

[Weeny Machine]

Quicksilver Aberration, on 08 April 2024 - 11:01 AM, said:

I could say the exact same about bad players using LRMs as you can about bad players using ERPPC/Gauss. Cherry-picking bad play on both sides doesn't do the conversation any good.

No, the point is that even if you do such a thing, you can get good scores with PPCs and Gauss. Why? Simply because you have no ECM bubble interfering with your fire and when you shoot LRMS without locks the speed is still terrible. Not to mention that you can fire Gauss and ERPPCs across half the map

So please, do not use the skill strawman in this argument.

Edited by Weeny Machine, 08 April 2024 - 01:23 PM.