88 replies to this topic

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Yeah, stock mode is more boring than even with customization, some stock mechs are just awful. I can't imagine you'd see any Cicadas for example because of just how awful so many of the stock variants are.

The gulf between haves and have-nots is large in stock mode, especially with Clan vs IS.

Edited by Quicksilver Aberration, 24 August 2024 - 07:11 PM.

[LordNothing]

wonder how it would work out with drop decks. players would have to balance out their available tonnage vs viable variants. might also want to run with 25-50% more ammo.

[VeeOt Dragon]

pattonesque, on 24 August 2024 - 07:00 PM, said:

my guy it's horrible. Only the UAC/5s and ERLLs kind of sync up and it has *34* CT armor with a MG ammo bomb the instant you open it up

ah ok that is ****, i didn't notice the CT armor and the MG ammo being there. the weapon s aren't unworkable (i would put the MGs with the er ML in a group)

[Samziel]

East Indy, on 23 August 2024 - 11:42 AM, said:

Not liked by whom? A fraction of a fraction of the population who metachase no matter what.

I believe your "metachasers" also won that competition.

If we have a game series revolving around customization, and we take it away, I have a feeling its not just the "fraction of a fraction" thats gonna dislike it. Stock IS mechs are slow and hot as hell. Not gonna be very fun to play.

[Novakaine]

Samziel, on 25 August 2024 - 10:29 PM, said:

I believe your "metachasers" also won that competition.

If we have a game series revolving around customization, and we take it away, I have a feeling its not just the "fraction of a fraction" thats gonna dislike it. Stock IS mechs are slow and hot as hell. Not gonna be very fun to play.

That's the whole point - "stock mode".

[Samziel]

Novakaine, on 26 August 2024 - 12:37 PM, said:

That's the whole point - "stock mode".

Yes? And it wasnt liked as a competitive tournament. I'm not arguing how to change stock mode, I'm telling its not popular.

I would try it in EQ though. But I dont think player count would last a weekend event.

[PelinalWhitestrake]

A true mechwarrior knows how to work with limitations

Stock mode would be great as long as there are maps, and PGI finally deciding that we should be moving to 3153 for balance reasons because we are still stuck on the Fed Com Jihad for almost 10 years.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

PelinalWhitestrake, on 27 August 2024 - 08:44 AM, said:

A true mechwarrior knows how to work with limitations

All the good players still dominated stock mode just like they did with customization. The difference is that it was less enjoyable to play AND watch. So what's the point other than to make the meta LESS diverse and LESS enjoyable for all involved?

Not to mention moving the timeline forward does nothing for balance because all the fundamental problems still exist.

Edited by Quicksilver Aberration, 27 August 2024 - 09:58 AM.

[Void Angel]

Quicksilver Aberration, on 24 August 2024 - 07:10 PM, said:

Yeah, stock mode is more boring than even with customization, some stock mechs are just awful. I can't imagine you'd see any Cicadas for example because of just how awful so many of the stock variants are.

The gulf between haves and have-nots is large in stock mode, especially with Clan vs IS.

Oh lord. Stock Clan v. IS... That hurts me just thinking about it...

[pattonesque]

Quicksilver Aberration, on 27 August 2024 - 09:57 AM, said:

All the good players still dominated stock mode just like they did with customization. The difference is that it was less enjoyable to play AND watch. So what's the point other than to make the meta LESS diverse and LESS enjoyable for all involved?

yeah it's this. As it is you can make a workable build out of basically every chassis in the game. stock mode would see anyone with a brain find the ten or fifteen non-terrible variants and use them exclusively

[BlueDevilspawn]

Never ever again.

FWIW - it doesn't matter if it's "meta" custom builds or stock... the best players don't change, so let me dispel the myth that a TT enthusiast will somehow level the playing field. The best players won the one Stock WC (which was crap btw) and even today in meta-filled QP they play stock for a challenge and still do the best in lobby.

Also as an admin for 5 tournaments over the past 3 years.... not a single comp player is interested in a stock tourney.

[LordNothing]

i really dont see how it affects the naysayers if it stays in event queue. dont like it, dont play it. just like any other eq mode. with how stale the game is you would think any change would be welcomed with open arms.

[BlueDevilspawn]

LordNothing, on 27 August 2024 - 04:26 PM, said:

i really dont see how it affects the naysayers if it stays in event queue. dont like it, dont play it. just like any other eq mode. with how stale the game is you would think any change would be welcomed with open arms.

Because EQ is hugely popular and a LOT of thought goes into the configurations. For example, the map pick for Escort, or using clan only for incursion so no stealth base rushing. The configs are chosen very specifically. Stock killed comp and I’ll be damned if I let it kill EQ. Oh btw, the naysayers faaarrrr outweigh those who want stock. Private lobbies exist for it.

[Void Angel]

The EPA called. They want people to stop poisoning wells...

[LordNothing]

BlueDevilspawn, on 27 August 2024 - 05:18 PM, said:

Because EQ is hugely popular and a LOT of thought goes into the configurations. For example, the map pick for Escort, or using clan only for incursion so no stealth base rushing. The configs are chosen very specifically. Stock killed comp and I’ll be damned if I let it kill EQ. Oh btw, the naysayers faaarrrr outweigh those who want stock. Private lobbies exist for it.

the reason eq is popular is because it lets you do a diverse number of things that wouldn't fly well in qp or the game in general. stock mode is just another one of those things. lots of people dont like some of the more goofy modes, and i really dont care much for the solaris modes, but that doesnt make eq any less popular. do a weekend and see what kind of turnout it generates, if it performs poorly, then dont do it again. just because it didn't work out in comp doesn't mean it wouldn't work for the more casual spread in eq. if there is a complaint about eq its mostly that there aren't enough events and stock mode could help fill out the schedule.

Edited by LordNothing, 27 August 2024 - 05:42 PM.

[BlueDevilspawn]

LordNothing, on 27 August 2024 - 05:38 PM, said:

the reason eq is popular is because it lets you do a diverse number of things that wouldn't fly well in qp or the game in general. stock mode is just another one of those things. lots of people dont like some of the more goofy modes, and i really dont care much for the solaris modes, but that doesnt make eq any less popular. do a weekend and see what kind of turnout it generates, if it performs poorly, then dont do it again. just because it didn't work out in comp doesn't mean it wouldn't work for the more casual spread in eq. if there is a complaint about eq its mostly that there aren't enough events and stock mode could help fill out the schedule.

The diverse things are things that let you shoot more and so are goofy in that respect. Not things that let you fantasize about sitting in a tabletop mech. And I said it once and I’ll say it again, each config is thought out well. EQ is not up all the time because the intent is for it to be a periodic thing.

And no, if we EVER tried stock (and that’s already pushing it) it would never be for a whole weekend. You’d get a single session, if that.

[martian]

Stock mode "IS vs. IS" would suck because some IS stock 'Mechs are real junk. People would quickly move to a selected few usable stock 'Mechs and that would be the end of it.

Add stock Clan 'Mechs to the mix and the thing becomes ridiculous.

[Rosarius]

People asking for stock mode haven't played stock mode in private lobbies and it shows.

Consider this:
All these legendary mechs we have now have vastly superior builds than 95% of the stock lore and hero builds in the game. Textbook pay2win
All the champion mechs in the game will enter the match with their champion loadouts. For example, the HBR-F(C) has two heavy large lasers, 4 er medium lasers, ECM, plenty of heat sinks, and a passable armour distribution. Not as pay2win as legendary mechs, but still pay2win
All the trial mechs will make the champion mechs look tame in comparison.

But by all means, bring on stock mode. My STK-4N(T) is ready

[Void Angel]

To be fair, you can get the same thing with other Event Queues. Solaris, for example, tends to reward a few 'mechs over others - take the Crael in a 1v1 or 2v2 Heavy environment. But stock matches would be so much worse.

[PelinalWhitestrake]

pattonesque, on 27 August 2024 - 12:52 PM, said:

yeah it's this. As it is you can make a workable build out of basically every chassis in the game. stock mode would see anyone with a brain find the ten or fifteen non-terrible variants and use them exclusively

As i said, use Stock as of now is stupid

But if the timeline and models jumped to the ilClan era alongside all of the stuff in it, it would be balanced.
Because all of the Stocks we see now were outdated in favor of new ones, even the mauler is being built again under a new default as the awesome.

Even C3 would be nice if implemented here as a Command "Aura" for both sides, as MML tech Being based upon which ammo you are using in your mech, even if in tabletop the damn thing sucks or is hit or miss depending of which one you are using.

In any case, just give me the Grand Summoner, the AWS-11R and the Raven II, and Mostly the Devastator.