249 replies to this topic

[Zectorman]

PewPew, on 01 March 2012 - 04:40 PM, said:

This thread contains some of the most intelligent discussion on this forum. I might consider signing up with the Capellans...

Well there is a reason for that, When everyone is against us calling us "evil" and other such nonsense, we ask for a reason why. When they give their answer we actually debate them and dont resort to Slander and harsh language at the first chance. We point out the flaws in their arguement, make some points about their own past. The warriors of Liao, and you could say the people of the confederation as a whole, value knowledge. In a nation that only the wise and knowledgeable may rise, keeps the brutes out and only the warrior poets get in the battlefield.

Hell even the mercs that prove themselves loyal and able get good deals (McCarron's Armored Cavalry)

And all this can be yours! Just mind the Jade throne, our current leader is....a bit over zealous in finding traitors....but hey i hear her heir Sun-Tzu is a bright young man...

Edited by Zectorman, 02 March 2012 - 02:41 AM.

[Thorn Hallis]

alex kelll, on 02 March 2012 - 02:29 AM, said:

I don't like the Capellans because of the fiction and the fact that most of their leader are ether insane, idiots or tyrants. Also they tend to get their mech shot up pointlessly

Haha, says a Davion-follower.

The Fed Suns had their fair share of insane, idiotic and tyranical leaders too.

[Gunmage]

Exilyth, on 06 February 2012 - 11:48 AM, said:

Romano Liao might be a bit ... tyrannic and generally homicidal ... in her way of ruling the Confederation, but she has taken great efforts in strengthening our nation.

fixed

Zectorman, on 02 March 2012 - 02:39 AM, said:

Hell even the mercs that prove themselves loyal and able get good deals (McCarron's Armored Cavalry)

And what happens with mercs who, due to "overzealosity" of your government, can't do that? "I never heard of such cases?"

Edited by Gunmage, 02 March 2012 - 04:25 AM.

[IxxxI]

Gunmage, on 02 March 2012 - 04:11 AM, said:

And what happens with mercs who, due to "overzealosity" of your government, can't do that? "I never heard of such cases?"

Over...what? have you read that word from some FedCom newspaper? I can tell you why it's not discussed in Capellan society: we respect dead people and memorize worthy deeds only to honor their spirits.

Edited by IxxxI, 02 March 2012 - 04:42 AM.

[Ironhawk]

Adridos, on 02 March 2012 - 02:12 AM, said:

Finally, a worthy Davion. It will be an honor to fight you, Stone Profit.

Being a Merc loyal to paydirt, I may or may not fight against you in-game, but it is meanwhile always a pleasure to paint FD's great concept art with Capellan colors.

[Adridos]

Ironhawk, on 02 March 2012 - 05:32 AM, said:

Being a Merc loyal to paydirt, I may or may not fight against you in-game, but it is meanwhile always a pleasure to paint FD's great concept art with Capellan colors.

Mercs are pretty fine. Finding worthy opponents over the IS isn't all that hard, but then, we mostly fight Daviots, which are mostly...

[FireNova]

maxoconnor, on 01 March 2012 - 09:39 AM, said:

I hope there will be more Dark Age stories soon because they are some of the best....

Agreed. Let me say first off that, had I been introduced to the Great Houses in BattleTech first instead of the Clans back in 1998, I probably would have chosen Liao. Alas, Clan Smoke Jaguar is the Clan I read/learned about first and chose and despite Bulldog/Serpent, the Jaguars have indeed survived (Surrender Your Dreams). The way I look at it is that the Dark Age timeline is a true revival of underdog factions, new storylines developing, new characters, new personalities, new political boundaries being formed, a changing of the old guard to the new, etc. I would be even more excited about a post Dark Age storyline/timeline and the potential story arc/plot being forged from the fallout of the Dark Age period and beyond.

In a similar way that Liao loyalists are excited about a rising/growing Capellan Confederation, so too am I about the future of the Jaguars.

By the way, an interesting/speculative thought ive been having for quite some time: How awesome would it be if the surviving Smoke Jaguars (post Fortress Republic mind you) decided to ally with the Capellan Confederation in a true underdog faction alliance against the Davion Juggernaut? In some ways it can make sense, both the Jaguars and Capellans have been the factions to get the short end of the stick throughout most of the BattleTech Universe storylines. It would be like the Horde in Warcraft, a union of outcasts struggling to survive in a harsh universe and hated by many, more powerful factions that surround them (Davion,Steiner, Republic, Marik/Clan Sea Fox,etc- Alliance | Clan Smoke Jaguar , Capellan Confederation, Mercenaries,etc - Horde).

Again just my speculation/thoughts on that but every time I think about it.....oh god the fun and the possibilities that could be had with such a setup! Lol I so wish the Dark Age/Age of Destruction boardgame was still going strong, I would so pay for some Smoke Jaguar faction boardgame pieces if they were made for real and whatnot and participate in game events near my area if I still could! I sure as hell wouldn't mind teaming up with Capellans and roundhousing me some Davion/Republic forces in a post Dark Age setting!

One can dream......

[Daidachi]

Firenova - have a look at Megamek if you feel like playing some tabletop wargaming at some point - it's open source, has an overwhelming majority of mechs and other units (IE tanks, infantry) in it, uses the classic battletech TT rules, and doesn't take hours to set up.

Also you can play online against your mates. May not be Dark Ages, but it's fun (and because it's just java, not especially resource intensive).

[HIemfire]

FireNova, on 02 March 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

Agreed. Let me say first off that, had I been introduced to the Great Houses in BattleTech first instead of the Clans back in 1998, I probably would have chosen Liao. Alas, Clan Smoke Jaguar is the Clan I read/learned about first and chose and despite Bulldog/Serpent, the Jaguars have indeed survived (Surrender Your Dreams). The way I look at it is that the Dark Age timeline is a true revival of underdog factions, new storylines developing, new characters, new personalities, new political boundaries being formed, a changing of the old guard to the new, etc. I would be even more excited about a post Dark Age storyline/timeline and the potential story arc/plot being forged from the fallout of the Dark Age period and beyond.

In this section I see a possible reason that so many may not like the Dark Age era. Though your idea of having the Jaguars ally with the Confederation is thought provoking, I sincerly doubt the probability of such an occurance is very high (I estimate it falls right about the same area as a Snow Raven speaking in support of the Wolverine's ideology just after the nuking), yet we cannot be sure what will be.

Anyways, if you so choose to fight along side us, welcome.

[Kip Wilson]

The more I think about this topic, the more I come to the conclusion that it might be simply the writers natural biases. Most everything written about the CC was done by authors in my age category or higher (30+). We old fogies still remeber the great red threat that was Communism. Even today westerners still have a strong bias against anything that we view as communist.

To ask a western author to write something thats pro-CC could be almost be as difficult as asking a religious clergyman to write a pro-abortion essay. No matter how positive it tries to be, its still going to be filled with the authors real POV on the subject and still be somewhat of a backhanded compliment at best

Those of us that can see through the veil and unserstand that Capellans are just people too, seem to be a small minoritiy even among those that support the Confederation. But such is the world we Capellans live in - if we wanted life to be easy, we'd all move to the Magistracy of Canopus.

[FireNova]

Kip Wilson, on 04 March 2012 - 11:46 AM, said:

Those of us that can see through the veil and understand that Capellans are just people too......

I hear that. Oddly enough its almost the exact same thing with the Jaguars. Not all Jaguars are bad like they were "portrayed" as in the books. Now with the Smoke Jaguar survivors rebuilding and free to decide where to reestablish themselves post Fortress Republic/DarkAge and the Capellan Confederation rising from the ashes of the Fourth Succession War, I think the whole "Bad Guy Capellan", "Good Guy Davion" stereotype is coming "full circle" and eventually dissolving altogether to make way for a new era/storyline point of view in the modern era.

What the Fourth Succession War was to the 80s....the Dark Age - Post Dark Age timeline is to the 2000's: A new beginning for a new generation.

[FireNova]

HIemfire, on 03 March 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

In this section I see a possible reason that so many may not like the Dark Age era. Though your idea of having the Jaguars ally with the Confederation is thought provoking, I sincerly doubt the probability of such an occurance is very high......

On the issue of Dark Age: People hating Dark Ages because the underdog factions actually make an actual comeback? Personally I don't see why it is such a bad thing...and not simply because of the Smoke Jaguars surviving either. I am pretty sure that Capellan loyalists the world over are finally glad to see the CC rebuilding from the ashes of the Fourth Succession War, increased alertness to enemies around them, extreme uses of intellegence and most importantly, electronic warfare capabilities.....pretty much ALOT of good things going for the Capellans here. I remember facing a Capellan force at one of the Age of Destruction games I took part in before the game went kaput....and I gotta say, I was really impressed with the unique array of units/capabilities the Capellans brought to the table (LITERALLY). The look/design/camo colors of the Liao units alone made my Republic forces look like Chuck Norris' circus zoo. Things like LRM infantry, more unique mech/vehicle choices for Liao, LRM carriers, better VTOL/aero units, etc. And its not like I had ****** Republic units as well. Had quite a few good mechs/infantry choices and still House Liao could counter them well. If its that bad for Republic faction units to face Liao....I can only imagine what its like for Davion to face a revived and more prepared Liao.....*shudders*. Either way I think its just the other major House loyalists like Davion that are the majority raging about the Dark Age story simply because Davion has a crazy leader and the fact the CC has gotten back on its feet post Jihad timeline and is now gearing up to take back more former Liao worlds from Davion. Or Marik because the FWL has just gone downhill since the Jihad and is now split (until they eventually reform later on). Or Steiner because they have a "Wolf problem" *hint hint* (or Malvina Hazen if you want to throw in the Jade Falcons as well.....crazy Malvina ). Or Kurita because one of their warships went missing after they attempted to penetrate the Fortress Republic "Chuck Norris lore protection zone" and the fact the Rasalhague Dominion (Ghost Bears) want to eat their neighbors (Nova Cats). All in all Dark Age is a good storyline (for the underdogs that is ).

On the issue of the Jag/CapCon: You might be right that it could be unlikely, but considering that for pretty much 99.9% of BT lore, the CC has stood alone on the majority of conflicts it has been involved in (or forced into for that matter). Its just speculation on my part, but it truly would be awesome if the writers threw the Liao loyalists a bone for once and gave the CC a REAL ally in the form of the Smoke Jaguars (not just some periphery powers like the Magistracy of Canopus or Taurien Concordat or whatever).

I mean think about it, in some ways the Jaguars and Capellans share some similarities:

-Warrior Houses (Liao), Warrior society (Jaguars).
-Aggressive in nature.
-Use covert ops (Jaguars had it in the form of headhunters that went behind enemy lines to kill enemy commanders I believe).
-Tyrannical in nature (meaning both factions were not really considered the "democracy" type).
-Used their wits and planning sometimes.
-Interesting camo color options (because lets face it, Gray/Green camo colors make them look badass......like a boss).


So yeah I think theoretically it would make some degree of sense to see a Jaguar/Liao alliance in the post Dark Ages timeline. It would give the surviving Smoke Jaguars a place/planetary area(s) to settle in and fully establish themselves and it would give the Capellan Confederation a lethal ally to work with against their Davion enemies. Its a true win-win the way I see it!

[Adridos]

FireNova, on 04 March 2012 - 09:28 PM, said:

Either way I think its just the other major House loyalists like Davion that are the majority raging about the Dark Age story simply because Davion has a crazy leader and the fact the CC has gotten back on its feet post Jihad timeline and is now gearing up to take back more former Liao worlds from Davion.

This explains everything... well, one question I had for a long time.

Why do other people hate Dark Age, when it does not have any actual super-drawbacks.

I should start practicing calling Daviots crazy. Oh... the pleasure.

[Exilyth]

Adridos, on 05 March 2012 - 05:57 AM, said:

Why do other people hate Dark Age, when it does not have any actual super-drawbacks.

Yeah. How could anyone hate on giant dump trucks (Mining Mech MkII)?
Joke aside, must be the fancy tech wizkids introduced without coming up with logical explanations on how it works.
Also, their relation with the community was somewhat ... troubled.


Anyway, back to topic. It's still only 3049, dark age is far far away.

[Adridos]

Exilyth, on 05 March 2012 - 09:11 AM, said:

Yeah. How could anyone hate on giant dump trucks (Mining Mech MkII)?
Joke aside, must be the fancy tech wizkids introduced without coming up with logical explanations on how it works.
Also, their relation with the community was somewhat ... troubled.


Anyway, back to topic. It's still only 3049, dark age is far far away.

Yeah, protomechs are really gross, but the rest is fairly good. And Jihad deosn't have any, too.

[Stone Profit]

Adridos, on 05 March 2012 - 10:24 AM, said:

Yeah, protomechs are really gross, but the rest is fairly good. And Jihad deosn't have any, too.

awww protos are awesome!

[HIemfire]

Adridos, on 05 March 2012 - 10:24 AM, said:

Yeah, protomechs are really gross, but the rest is fairly good. And Jihad deosn't have any, too.

Industrial mech: http://www.sarna.net.../IndustrialMech

Protomech: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/ProtoMech

They are not the same thing.

[Adridos]

HIemfire, on 06 March 2012 - 12:08 AM, said:

Industrial mech: http://www.sarna.net.../IndustrialMech

Protomech: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/ProtoMech

They are not the same thing.

Yeah, I know. Just the industrials reminded me of them, so I mentioned that fault.

Edited by Adridos, 06 March 2012 - 06:01 AM.

[HIemfire]

Adridos, on 06 March 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

Yeah, I know. Just the industrials reminded me of them, so I mentioned that fault.

In that case I agree whole heartedly and personally believe those that make use of Protomechs should be bombarded to dust from orbit.

[Youngblood]

+100 for truth. 'Mechs were noooooooot Doug Chaffee's (R.I.P.) strong suit in art.

--Youngblood, still waiting for his Yao Lien (Doug Chaffee art) miniature.