408 replies to this topic

[SlasH58]

I don't think anyone would want PGI/IGP to get in a position that would compromise the game. IF, by some chance, the rights for the Unseen mechs could be obtained for a reasonable price, then I agree that it would be sweet to have 'em. However, the Reseen mechs, for the most part, are very cool in their own rights.

IF PGI/IGP decide to bring them in eventually, I'd be happy to see either version!

[Razor Kotovsky]

Redshift2k5, on 28 August 2012 - 06:27 AM, said:

Using so-called 'reseen' designs could still land them in lots of legal trouble, because the rights-holding companies can take them to court and make a judge decide- a judge who is not a gamer, game designer, or fan.

I think even a judge would see the difference between an apple and an orange.

These concepts are somewhat more complex than touchscreens.

[Lokust]

I can't see the risk of adding those mechs as being anywhere near worth what they would gain by adding them in a universe with dozens of other perfectly risk-free mech chassis to choose from.

[Alex Wolfe]

Bogsveigir, on 28 August 2012 - 05:33 AM, said:

I voted as preferring the Un-seen, but accepting the Re-seen. I do feel that it is a moot point, however. The only real difference is in appearance. Why is that moot? The redesigned mechs we've seen so far are simply brilliant! None look exactly like the old miniatures I spent so many hours painting while deployed around the Pacific Ocean. I feel that whatever this team would do with them would only be an improvement on either design.

Fully agreed.

With wonders the current team does with old mech designs, whatever they include will likely be amazing and a vast improvement. More mechs are always fun, but... for what it's worth, no skin off my back if they never make it here in my opinion. Besides, you can pilot many unseen in MekTek's MW4 (and LL I hear) and... once you're past the nostalgia/forbidden fruit factor... they're nothing to write home about, really.

There are many mechs in the Inner Sphere, and they never looked so good. Too busy admiring PGI's work to care.

Edited by Alex Wolfe, 28 August 2012 - 06:56 AM.

[AntiSqueaker]

Honestly, the amount of changes the regular art has been deviating from the old BT pictures makes the "Unseen art issue" kinda moot. Take the Cataphract for instance, that thing is ugly as heck. But the MWO redesign looks amazing. Same with the Stalker, Spider, and some of the other "ugly children" of BT.

I personally want the Unseen more for their loadouts (I would kill for a Shadow Hawk or Wolverine), and I trust the art guys to work their magic if they get an opportunity. I haven't seen a mech art for MWO that I haven't liked yet.

[Marauder3D]

Like folks have said: if you've read or played Battletech in the past 20 years, you know how important these mechs are to the lore. Heck, you would probably never see a battlefield without one of these mechs on them, ever, because they are so widely produced and deployed throughout the Inner Sphere.

Count me in with the "I don't really mind what they look like" crowd, just put them in the game.

FYI, if you head over to the Fan Art forum, Bishop Steiner did some really good redesigns there as well.

[Puschk1n]

Those companies are unable to get their head out of their behinds. They could have made millions by now if they just licenced those damn designs, but noooo ...
So, I don't see why they would change their mind now. If it was possible, of course, I would LOVE to have the unseen back. Reseen is still a big risk, so rather don't take that risk. Still prefer the original designs.

[Dezereus]

At this juncture I would say its highly unlikely that the unseen will be in game and to try to include them would be a risky legal enterprise. On the other hand re-seen will hopefully avoid that problem and allow us to enjoy some of the nicest designs out there. In this regard I prefer the re-seen, as I believe it to be both possible and far less likely to create problems for our beloved devs =D. Here's hoping for the Griffin or Shadow Hawk! Then again if it got the re-seen river flowing, I'd happily take a Locust =)

[Tardstrong]

As long as the mechs don't imbalance the game I don't care either way. Unseen, Reseen...as long as they are seen as smoking ruins after I scout them.
The mechs I've looked at are yummy and I don't see a reason that this will change in the immediate future.

[Steven Dixon]

I don't really like the reseen and like many old school mechwarrior fans I love the unseen, but I don't really think either version is going to be included in the game and I'm fine with that.

[CharlieV]

I think there is one point we all forgetting: those copyright difficulties are only in USA, everywhere outside are unseen perfectly legal.

So: devs, take your gear nad go for some vacation trip, net is worldwide and doesnt matter if your servers are in USA or Canada or some 3rd rate african republic then you can add all you want into game and we players only declare "im not in US teritorry when I play" after we log in (and its true man, we fight in Inner Sphere)...

This works fine when we want early acces to BF3, many players were suddenly from Korea, or their IP adresses at least...

[Caballo]

Trickster Fox, on 28 August 2012 - 05:45 AM, said:

Neither. The dev's have done stated way back before the beta even came out that they will not be added. Plus they are ugly as shart anyway.

Nobody stated nothing like that. Show me the post.


Also, there are about 1.000.000 about the same subject. Search.

[Steel Talon]

PGI already have warhammer redesign, it appears in old debut trailer

[Laserbrain]

WolfSpider, on 28 August 2012 - 06:15 AM, said:

There is just too much history tied to those named mechs to just dump them from play. I dont care what they look like I just want to play them. When they put them in the game I would buy a legendary membership, if not I doubt I will even spend the money to upgrade my computer.

And for my first forum post (fashionably late to the party), I will agree with WolfSpider and most of the others in this thread. I honestly don't care if they look nothing like any of the old designs(Unseen or Reseen), as long as the names & capabilities of the 'Mechs are the same or very similar.

[Evil Hamster]

Redshift2k5, on 28 August 2012 - 06:27 AM, said:

Using so-called 'reseen' designs could still land them in lots of legal trouble, because the rights-holding companies can take them to court and make a judge decide- a judge who is not a gamer, game designer, or fan. Even winning the case is a cost PGI probably can't afford (both in terms of money and bad press!)

That just happens to be the reason FASA dropped the mechs also. Harmony Gold (with a FULL, BORED legal department) sued, lost, sued again, lost, sued again, lost, FASA eventually decided to drop so as not to have to keep paying their lawyer. First time I ever learned that the US REALLY needs a loser pays legal system.

[Steel Talon]

Quote

I think there is one point we all forgetting: those copyright difficulties are only in USA, everywhere outside are unseen perfectly legal.

MWO will have separated servers in future, but that would lead to NA ppl swarming EU server

[Razor Kotovsky]

Lokust, on 28 August 2012 - 06:43 AM, said:

I can't see the risk of adding those mechs as being anywhere near worth what they would gain by adding them in a universe with dozens of other perfectly risk-free mech chassis to choose from.

I dare you to find a mech of the same tonnage with same loadout options as marauder or warhammer.

[Fischkopp]

would be fantastic to see the old ones...if it is not possible..hmmm ok...bring the reseen

[Redshift2k5]

Evil Hamster, on 28 August 2012 - 08:15 AM, said:

That just happens to be the reason FASA dropped the mechs also. Harmony Gold (with a FULL, BORED legal department) sued, lost, sued again, lost, sued again, lost, FASA eventually decided to drop so as not to have to keep paying their lawyer. First time I ever learned that the US REALLY needs a loser pays legal system.

Even winning a case still costs you time and money., two things PGI doesn't have to spare.

[KalebFenoir]

Odanan, on 28 August 2012 - 05:21 AM, said:

Many members here don't know what are the Unseen and the Reseen. Let's clear it out.

Unseen: are mech designs (drawings) from the very beginning of the Battletech, taken from anime (like Macross/Robotech) mechas. They were removed from the Battletech after several legal problems.

Reseen: are new drawings for those mechs, for using of Battletech. They don't have any legal issue but depart a little from the original designs.

Examples:

Unseen Marauder:

Reseen Marauder:

Old Battletech players love the Unseen. They played a lot with them, they have their miniatures... so it's natural they want the Unseen in MWO.

The problem is: PGI/IGP should not use the Unseen because of the concrete risk of a law suit that would jeopardize the entire MWO project (the using of the Unseen Warhammer was one of the reasons for MW5 being canceled).

So, what do you want? Are you OK with PGI to add the Reseen designs? Or you will accept nothing but the old & gold Unseen?

I'm an oldschool tabletop player, and I was lucky enough to have played using the Third Edition game set, which had all those lovely Unseens. I would personally love it if they brought the Unseen into this. Sure, they can't look EXACTLY like the ones in the old age... but I'm pretty sure they can make them close enough to aesthetically satisfy us old tabletoppers. XD The Warhammer they showed in that MW5 intro was JUST different enough from the old Fasa/Harmony Gold/whatever design to pass as a new machine, while maintaining something of the spirit of the old. They should bring THAT design in. (I'd be happy to pilot that).

If they do bring them in though, I hope the Marauder looks better than what the Reseen Marauder looks like. I'm just not happy with that design. :S Rifleman? Looks great. Warhammer? Awesome. Archer Reseen? Needs to look stumpier. Loved the old upper arm box missile launchers. Crusader? Why move the LRMs on the shoulders down to the wrists? Phoenix Hawk and its little kin? Pretty good new designs. The Griffin, Shadowhawk, and Wolverine Reseen look absolutely sweet. Even the Locust looks better!

I guess for me, the old stuff is awesome, the Reseen look good (except the Marauder) and I'd be happy to use either in a battle.

Edited by KalebFenoir, 28 August 2012 - 08:58 AM.