116 replies to this topic

[Khobai]

In table top machine guns do 2 damage while small lasers do 3 damage. So if you keep the 2:3 dps ratio between machine guns and small lasers then machine guns should do 0.67 dps, instead of the 0.4 dps they currently do. In other words, PGI needs to give them a 70% damage increase to make them as effective as they are in TT.

Additionally PGI needs to add a new ballistic weapon with weight in between a machine gun and an AC/2. Currently theres a huge weight gap in ballistic weapons. We need a ballistic weapon that weighs 3-4 tons so light mechs with ballistic slots have other options besides machine guns. One possibility is to add mech mortars, which do exist in 3049, and fall right in that gap for weight.

Edited by Khobai, 08 November 2012 - 05:55 AM.

[Stone Wall]

16 mguns on a Shadowcat in MW3

load it up with MASC and AMS...oh boy

[Warma]

Spartan076, on 03 October 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

How powerful are Machine Guns in the beta? I remember in Prior games that they absolutely mauled enemy mechs in CQC, do they still do lots of damage in MWO?

They are supposed to be very ineffective against battlemechs and used as an anti-infantry weapon.
However, due to fast rate of fire, they should be useful for scoring critical hits quickly, once armor has been ripped off by other weapons, just like LBX Autocannons.

[Monsoon]

Are MG's great? No.

Are they Fun? Absolutely!

I boat 4 of them on my Cicada, but my LL is probably the real threat.

Sadly, MG are supposed to be anti-infantry weapons. But I have to ask you what MG weighs a half-ton and is only good against flesh and bone?!? Seriously, the gun weighs as much at the 30mm Avenger cannon, and that baby is known as a 'Tank-killer'.

Edited by Monsoon, 08 November 2012 - 10:34 AM.

[Imagine Dragons]

Warma, on 08 November 2012 - 06:03 AM, said:

They are supposed to be very ineffective against battlemechs and used as an anti-infantry weapon.
However, due to fast rate of fire, they should be useful for scoring critical hits quickly, once armor has been ripped off by other weapons, just like LBX Autocannons.

You are aware about the critical HP system right?...

[QuantumButler]

They're less than worthless.

[Lavrenti]

QuantumButler, on 08 November 2012 - 09:20 AM, said:

They're less than worthless.

As soon as I can afford it, my triple MG Hunchback will rule the battlefield with a rod of iron. OF IRON.

[xanthial]

I run a K2 with 2MGs and 2 PPCS.

For me the MGs are useful for keeping on target while ppcs recharge. I blast target while waiting for ppcs to recharge.....use em like traces to keep me hitting target.


......probally purely psycological but if its stupid and it works, it aint stupid lol

[Virisken]

there was a thread in beta where some fellows looked how long i take to core an atlas with 3 mgs..if i remember right it was something about 4-5 minutes of continuously fire.

so there are not total useless (honestly they are) but you have to be patient

[Kaspirikay]

Buff machineguns!

[IntruderAlert]

You can cut down a mighty Oak tree with a herring bone if you are patient enough..
Unfortunately, we usually don't have that much time in game ( or out)...

MG's are fun in that they are great noise makers and attention getters if you are trying to distract the enemy from his original
target. They are also useful as a tracer (lag checking) to make sure your primary weapons will hit target when they are ready to fire. AC2's have recently taken the annoyance role away from machine guns...at least the AC2's actually do damage.

[Melcyna]

Virisken, on 14 November 2012 - 05:59 PM, said:

there was a thread in beta where some fellows looked how long i take to core an atlas with 3 mgs..if i remember right it was something about 4-5 minutes of continuously fire.

so there are not total useless (honestly they are) but you have to be patient

4-5 minutes of continuous fire on a target that presumably doesn't fire back and with a rear hit is the very definition of worthless weapon considering the amount of ammunition you have to carry for supplying 3 MG for 5 minutes of continuous salvo.

No that's less than worthless... you might as well repeatedly ram the target with your mech.

[Tarman]

Supercakers, on 26 October 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

MG's only do .4 dps compared to small lasers 1dps. It does seem super weak, since it would take 2.5 tons of space for 3 mg's and a ton of ammo to do 1.2dps, however it is entirely heatless dps and they have a 10% (I think?) crit chance, with each bullet getting a chance to crit at 10 bullets per second per mg. But for 2.5 tons you could just add a small laser and 2 more heat sinks and probably be better off.

Pretty much that. It looks like it could almost be technically useful, and then you're dirtside and realize that the tonnage you used for them could be used for anything else at all. That 2.5 tons could boost your engine rating, add heatsinks or AMS, upgrade an actual weapon you're packing, or max out your armour. The only issue with not taking MGs is that if you're OCD about filling ALL your weapon slots it will bug you to see 1/2 Ballistic on your mech chart. MAYBE you could use an MG as a tracer for a larger and slower weapon, but that's a LOT of tonnage when learning to aim better costs no space.

It makes me sad, they were fun weapons in other incarnations purely because of mass dakka. They'd better be ready for war by the time I get my Timber Wolf or I will be angry.

[Areksu]

machine guns are not good even against unarmored mechs.
i had only a 3xmachine gun and 2000 ammo left (other hand got destroyed) and the only remaining enemy was an one-legged, armorless atlas.

so.. i shot 2000 rounds at his bare back, which was flashing red to begin with.. guess what, i ran out of ammo.
3 machine guns, more than a minute of constant firing... then i just.. stahped, in shame, so the atlas could mash me.

GARBAGE.

make it a bit heavier, do 4 times the damage, and let it shoot missiles.. maybe then someone will want to use it.
because this is what the game should be about - lots of different mechs and weapons that people would want to use.
right now, machine guns are only good for scaring others with flashing lights and sound effects, just like flamers.

[Terror Teddy]

Supercakers, on 26 October 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

MG's only do .4 dps compared to small lasers 1dps. It does seem super weak, since it would take 2.5 tons of space for 3 mg's and a ton of ammo to do 1.2dps, however it is entirely heatless dps and they have a 10% (I think?) crit chance, with each bullet getting a chance to crit at 10 bullets per second per mg. But for 2.5 tons you could just add a small laser and 2 more heat sinks and probably be better off.

All weapons got a boost but here's the kicker. The small laser got +200% damage and the MG's got +100%.

Small Lasers benefit from double heatsinks and 4 small lasers do 4 DPS for 2 tonnage weight.
Small Lasers X4 gives 2,68 heat per second so they DO get hot
MG's cannot benefit from anything that removes heat - that means they dont regenerate "ammo"

4MG's emty 1 tonne in 50 seconds for 80 damage
4SL do the same damage in 20 seconds and build up 26,8 heat but reduce that with engine DHS to 6,8
50 seconds later the MG's are out of ammo. Now we need MORE ammo.

In order to do any VIABLE damage in the same time as 4X small laser you need 12MG's for 1 tonne of ammo to do the same damage in the same timeframe.

A Commando with 3 energy mounts and a SRM takes out that spider even if he has a large laser in the chest or pulse laser.

Edited by Terror Teddy, 08 March 2013 - 12:16 PM.

[LokVokun]

I assume we have come to the conclusion that we either...
A) 3x the amount of MGs we get per alot (Machine gun array?)
B ) Up their DMG by 70%+
C) Make MGs shoot API/Incendiary rounds

Ill be honest, my CDA with 4MGs and 6k rounds, with a large **** laser, is annoying...but nothing but a atlas *** scratcher.

Edited by LokVokun, 09 March 2013 - 10:25 PM.

[Red squirrel]

why485, on 03 October 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

They are utterly worthless with no redeeming values whatsoever.

[REDACTED]

Exactly this.
The increased damage against internals is merely a bad joke.
Because in the end you are completely helpless against armored targets.
And once a section is without armor you are better off destroying this section out with real weapons.

[Terror Teddy]

LokVokun, on 09 March 2013 - 10:25 PM, said:

I assume we have come to the conclusion that we either...
A) 3x the amount of MGs we get per alot (Machine gun array?)
B ) Up their DMG by 70%+
C) Make MGs shoot API/Incendiary rounds

Ill be honest, my CDA with 4MGs and 6k rounds, with a large **** laser, is annoying...but nothing but a atlas *** scratcher.

I made some thread about "Damage to Emty" and the MG's takes FOUR TIMES as long to emty 1 tonne of ammuniton as the SLOWEST weapon (AC5) to do 80 total damage as compared to the AC5's 150.

[Team Leader]

The first page of this reads like a roast on machine guns lol quality stuff

[Red squirrel]

IntruderAlert, on 14 November 2012 - 06:18 PM, said:

You can cut down a mighty Oak tree with a herring bone if you are patient enough.. Unfortunately, we usually don't have that much time in game ( or out)... MG's are fun in that they are great noise makers and attention getters if you are trying to distract the enemy from his original target. They are also useful as a tracer (lag checking) to make sure your primary weapons will hit target when they are ready to fire. AC2's have recently taken the annoyance role away from machine guns...at least the AC2's actually do damage.

I never get this argument. Maybe some newb/noob who has no clue about the game mechanics wil lget distracted.
Every other play just laughts at the MG Spider/Cicada and keeps focus firing the large targets.