61 replies to this topic

[MacabreDerek]

Gremlich Johns, on 07 April 2012 - 04:51 AM, said:

Not all of the Warrior Caste, let alone the Clan Elite, are of this strong, and frankly, psychopathically conceited opinion. Some, like the Blood Spirits, believe everybody has a purpose to their Clan, no matter how insignificant and so do not denegrate one's service - even the Solahma who came before them. Sure, the Mechwarrior is at the peak, but the whole of the CBS Warrior Caste have a profound respect for those they are bound by position to protect. That, plus everybody in the Clan Blood Spirit, according to canon, prepare themselves to the same level of preparedness as the Warriors are, insofar as they can, not being warriors themselves. Granted, the Cloud Cobra, Nova Cat, and maybe the Star Adder are close in idiom to what you suggest, but as a characterization of how a member of the Warrior Caste thinks, I think this is over the top.

I understand and appreciate that you "write" from an RP point of view. However, a little closer examination of the fiction vis-a-vis Clan life within the context of the canon is advised.

And @ Stormwolf, I agree with your sentiment to his post re: him being Solahma. The Clansmen are not Klingons and even they respected their Veterans. (BTW, I am a Veteran myself and I am respected by those who have followed me into service. Maybe it is because I was a Warrant.)

~Steps out of his RP-Minded talk~
Actually I write from the perspective of Clan Steel Viper, but thanks for noticing. The mindset is often looking at Solahma as trash because they had the chance to rise and couldnt, showing their inferiority among their sibko. I am also reminded of "Exodus Road" where smoke jaguar shown little to no respect for it's veteran troops.

More so I was commenting on the idea I've seen kicking around the forums, on how joining a clan should be earned (The idea having some merit I admit), but for us who are either casual clanners or flat out struggling will find it difficult to find clans that are not geared to the top 10% of players. This is just one of those situations where I am wondering how much of the elitist mentality that is inherant in Clan culture that will leak over into RL expectations.

In that regard, I wanted to bring up 'What it means to be a Clan Warrior'.

[Daneiel]

Great post Stormwolf - its a good way to educate the new blood in clan life.

[MacabreDerek]

Jaroth Winson, on 07 April 2012 - 04:52 AM, said:

Your line of thinking sickens & shames me. All Clan warriors begin honorably. It is their actions that add more honor or strip honor away. No two warriors are alike & thus some are made for the front line while some are made for garrison duty. A true warrior understands the need for both offense & defense. If everyone was on offense they would conquer many worlds but would not be able to hold them. If everyone was on defense they would secure the worlds they had but would never venture forth to expand the Clan's domain

You shame yourself by showing you lack the understanding of this concept when the surats of the Inner Sphere, most notably the Draconis Combine have embraced this for as long as they have been in existence. They walk the tight rope everyday of their lives but they believe in,



For a Clansman, then the Clan is all. Do the duty you were assigned & do it to the best of your ability. No one is saying you cannot have goals/dreams/aspirations but you cannot place them before the Clan. Have you learned nothing from our history? Have the egos of Star Colonel Adler Malthus of Clan Jade Falcon or Galaxy Commander Dietr Osis of Clan Smoke Jaguar not taught you anything? Quineg? Have you not heard of the exploits of Star Captain Angela Bekker of Clan Ghost Bear? She was placed on garrison duty with the task of forming an entirely new Trinary. Did she scowl or pout or whine or complain? Neg! She did her duty & when challenged by Clan Wolf forces she fought & emerged victorious & secured the planet she was on. That added more honor to her name. (Read Roar of Honor if you get a chance)

Let us look at some facts about some "solahma" warriors. These are people who are not really important to the Clans but I thought it would put things into perspective:



Do you think the ilKhan at 57 was beyond his prime, when he led our ancestors to reclaim the Pentagon Worlds, surat? Elizabeth Hazen at 80 should simply have waited for death to claim her from her misery even as she led her troops into battle, surat? Franklin Osis at 43 should have hoped for a quick death even though his actions earned him recognition in the eyes of the ilKhan, surat? When Andery Kerensky at 66, shed his blood on Eden fighting alongside Clan Wolf warriors was he living a broken & miserable existence, surat?

I say you are an impostor. I say if you have Mechwarrior 4: Mercenaries, you can select a time & place to meet me in a Circle of Equals. I will scatter your DNA to the winds surat!

((Thanks for posting alot of specitic info IC for me to research further, will go a long way to helping my understanding. Guess my own posting IC kinda bit me as it's going a little ways off from expressing the original concern, but that's fine. It's a strong response, if not a little personal. Still, impressive post. Still, let's see if I can play devils advocate here.))

Yet you will praddle on and on about Khans as though they are the standard. They are not, they are the exempt, those who have risen far beyond their station, filling their clans with a wisdom and pride that comes with their own unique experiences. It proves nothing. Let us speak for the majority, and tell me what their fates are. Second line troops in second-line mechs. The real tools, Omnimechs, and the real opportunities, among the front lines of the invasion of the Inner Sphere, are taken.

Or is this the ranting coming from Glory is fresh from the front, and with no real experience of which he speaks?

And if you are so set on this compulsive Circle of Equals, then I am prepared to do so, in battlemechs. Your claim will be refuted, but I will not let your broken remains pass from this world. I would not waste such spirit, meerly humble it, by giving him time to let every bone in his body set to heal. Every bone.

((Would actually love to play MW4:Mercs. Havent actually had the chance to play it online, so it should be fun. ~Prepares to have his *** whooped~))

[Strumtruppen]

lol this so reminds me of Dune(the book) hail all this is one of those scum merc's calling and saying that when the clans enter i will be looking forward to joining you or fighting you what every comes first.

[Jaroth Corbett]

MacabreDerek, on 07 April 2012 - 05:41 AM, said:

((Thanks for posting alot of specitic info IC for me to research further, will go a long way to helping my understanding. Guess my own posting IC kinda bit me as it's going a little ways off from expressing the original concern, but that's fine. It's a strong response, if not a little personal. Still, impressive post. Still, let's see if I can play devils advocate here.))

Yet you will praddle on and on about Khans as though they are the standard. They are not, they are the exempt, those who have risen far beyond their station, filling their clans with a wisdom and pride that comes with their own unique experiences. It proves nothing. Let us speak for the majority, and tell me what their fates are. Second line troops in second-line mechs. The real tools, Omnimechs, and the real opportunities, among the front lines of the invasion of the Inner Sphere, are taken.

Or is this the ranting coming from Glory is fresh from the front, and with no real experience of which he speaks?

And if you are so set on this compulsive Circle of Equals, then I am prepared to do so, in battlemechs. Your claim will be refuted, but I will not let your broken remains pass from this world. I would not waste such spirit, meerly humble it, by giving him time to let every bone in his body set to heal. Every bone.

((Would actually love to play MW4:Mercs. Havent actually had the chance to play it online, so it should be fun. ~Prepares to have his *** whooped~))

You are missing the point. A clan warrior is not made a Khan when he emerges from the iron womb. He has to prove himself. How do you think you get to become a Khan? You would have had to rise through the ranks. I do not recall ever hearing of a warrior who was between 16-20 being Khan. You have to live long enough to become a Khan which is my point. This takes time & years even if you are ristar.

(MW4:Mercs is a free download. When you have it installed let me know.)

[Thorn Hallis]

Jaroth Winson, on 07 April 2012 - 07:26 AM, said:

I do not recall ever hearing of a warrior who was between 16-20 being Khan.

Hey, why not! I think the rank "sibKhan" is missing in Battletech.

[Felix Dracc]

An interesting read, I would say some thing but it's all really been said already.

[Jack Gallows]

Jaroth Winson, on 07 April 2012 - 07:26 AM, said:

I do not recall ever hearing of a warrior who was between 16-20 being Khan

Phelan came damn close (I can't remember what age he was when he was elevated,) but he's kind of a special case.

Also, good write up, and that one link has a TON of info, it's great!

[JeromeWinson]

Jack Gallows, on 07 April 2012 - 04:11 PM, said:

Phelan came damn close (I can't remember what age he was when he was elevated,) but he's kind of a special case.

You’re quite right. According to the Warden Clans field manual Phelan was elected to khan at age 21, but then it does say Phelan was "the youngest ever warrior to earn a Bloodname and also the youngest Khan".

[MacabreDerek]

Jaroth Winson, on 07 April 2012 - 07:26 AM, said:

(MW4:Mercs is a free download. When you have it installed let me know.)

(Hey Jaroth, thanks for the convo and a different way of looking at the in-character applications. Will be out of town[though following forums], but when I get back I would gladly play some MW4 to let you butcher me in a CoE. Been trying to get in some practice games, but been having difficulties either connecting, or getting into a game without being booted two seconds in. Still, would love to play some MW4:Mercs to get back into the cockpit of a mech. Will probably bring a stock Hunchback IIC in the CoE as it's one of the better second-line mechs I was talking about and seems to be one of the more common ones. You ofcourse arnt restricted in any way, I just would like to play . Tried to send you a message, but the forum said you couldnt recieve any, if ya want send me a message to not plug more irrelivant chatter to the topic, as I'd hate to derail it further. Thanks again for the responces.)

[Der Kommissar]

It's about being bred in a method thrice as expensive as normal, trained in a method twice as intensive as normal, put in a mech four times as costly as normal...

...and still dying when that Hollander puts a gauss slug through the cockpit of your Timber Wolf Prime.

[Thorn Hallis]

Der Kommissar, on 08 April 2012 - 08:02 AM, said:

It's about being bred in a method thrice as expensive as normal, trained in a method twice as intensive as normal, put in a mech four times as costly as normal...

...and still dying when that Hollander puts a gauss slug through the cockpit of your Timber Wolf Prime.

So...basicly you're saying Clanners are the DeLorean among mechwarriors?

[Morashtak]

Very much appreciate the post tho' most people who play on the Clan side won't read it or even abide by it, I fear. Many more people play than read the forums. Oh, well. that's life on the internet.

Would like the Trueborn's take on yielding.

Ex.
I am the last one standing in my Dragon on my side. I see all the clan pilots back off except for a small Mech ("Unknown" shows on my radar as it has throughout the match). Sensing an opportunity I engage the one Mech and through sheer luck come out on the winning side... but just barely. No armor to speak of and maybe a round or two left, if that.

The remaining enemy Mechs are in good shape or better. They know that even one hit from any of their weapons will finish me off. What do they do?

Per lore I would be allowed to surrender and taken as captive. Maybe even asked to join, etc.

In game tho', if there is a yield feature available (Later™, of course) will a clansman see it as a way to honor the skills of their foe? Or do they finish him off? Or something else?

btw - finding good info on the warhawk site, thanks for the link.

[Jaroth Corbett]

There is another option: hegira. If we feel your actions warrant it, you can be allowed to leave the field of battle without any loss of honor to yourself & you will not be taken as a bondsman.

[Gremlich Johns]

Jaroth Winson, on 08 April 2012 - 09:47 AM, said:

There is another option: hegira. If we feel your actions warrant it, you can be allowed to leave the field of battle without any loss of honor to yourself & you will not be taken as a bondsman.

yep, what he said. I offered to my IS opponents once during a planetary assault in NBT-HC. They were shocked, but accepted. AS CBS, we prefer bondsref and thought they should know that.

Edited by Gremlich Johns, 08 April 2012 - 11:24 AM.

[fearfactory]

This is the thread:

http://bg.battletech...pic,2244.0.html

AND dear lord don't get this Burrock to discuss any of this again. I'm not going to do it. Read my posts there and think what you want but I think I defended myself pretty dang good.

[Thorn Hallis]

fearfactory, on 09 April 2012 - 04:06 PM, said:

This is the thread:

http://bg.battletech...pic,2244.0.html

AND dear lord don't get this Burrock to discuss any of this again. I'm not going to do it. Read my posts there and think what you want but I think I defended myself pretty dang good.

Ehmm....re-read the first post of this topic.

[Stormwolf]

fearfactory, on 09 April 2012 - 04:06 PM, said:

This is the thread:

http://bg.battletech...pic,2244.0.html

AND dear lord don't get this Burrock to discuss any of this again. I'm not going to do it. Read my posts there and think what you want but I think I defended myself pretty dang good.

Thorn Hallis, on 09 April 2012 - 11:16 PM, said:

Ehmm....re-read the first post of this topic.

I started this thread with the assumption that there would be people reading who do not know anything of the Clans outside of mechs.
Hence why I did not copy and paste the original.

[MacabreDerek]

Stormwolf, on 09 April 2012 - 11:31 PM, said:

I started this thread with the assumption that there would be people reading who do not know anything of the Clans outside of mechs.
Hence why I did not copy and paste the original.

And I am glad there are players such as yourself who go out of their way to give a spring-board for newer players to jump from. Many thanks.

[Stormwolf]

MacabreDerek, on 10 April 2012 - 02:03 AM, said:

And I am glad there are players such as yourself who go out of their way to give a spring-board for newer players to jump from. Many thanks.

Thanks