14 replies to this topic

[Aegis Kleais]

If a cache of LRM ammo goes off and there's only 40 missiles left, the damage it does should be less than if it went off with 240 missiles in. Also, if someone chooses to house more ammo, the damage should scale up accordingly.

[wwiiogre]

Aegis, ammo does the amount of damage equal to what is left, it always has in TT. Which is why I always split my ammo up into smaller amounts and place them in the arms. So if it blows only small amounts blow and they take the arm off first then the torso and almost never kill my mech. I doubt tho the new mechlab will support this. But it works in level 3 TT as a house rule we never allowed ammo to be more than one spot removed from the weapon it served. So arm weapon, ammo in same arm or nearest torso, torso weapon, ammo in arm or same torso or center torso. Etc. But it made sense to us, not everyone believes it should be so.

Chris

[Halfinax]

I'm with you on this Aegis if only because that is how it is established in the TT rules. Which are damage = rounds left x damage per round.

[HIemfire]

TT Ammo explosion summary of the ammunition types that we will probably be starting with:

1 ton of machine gun ammunition (200 bursts): 400 damage
1 ton of LRM ammunition (120 missiles): 120 damage
1 ton of SRM 6 ammunition (90 total missiles, don't ask me why): 180 damage
1 ton of SRM 2 or 4 ammunition (100 missiles) : 200 damage
1 ton of AC/2 ammunition (45 bursts/shots): 90 damage
1 ton of AC/5, AC/10, AC/20 ammunition (bursts/shots varies): 100 damage
Gauss Rifle (weapon itself, only results from a hit to the weapon itself): 20 Damage

All damage from ammuntion explosions is Internal (ignores armor) and transfers to the next section's internal structure (arms and legs to side torsos, side torsos to center torso) if a location is destroyed by the ammunition explosion, unless C.A.S.E. is present then just the section the ammunition explosion happened in is affected (C.A.S.E. can only be mounted in torso sections, an explosion that happens in an arm will thus stop only after destroying the arm and associated side torso if C.A.S.E. is present in that side torso section or all the damage is accounted for).

Edited by HIemfire, 05 April 2012 - 02:57 PM.

[HIemfire]

OhGilPin, on 05 April 2012 - 11:55 AM, said:

Some people would be carrying a shed load of LRM missiles it'd take the whole 'mech down... I've been hearing allot about ammo explosions and so forth does anyone know how often or likely this is going to happen in a average game?

120 damage on a TAC (through armor critical which is a table top rule) is nothing to laugh at. Especially being as 100 ton mechs, the largest mechs we have available at this time, have a combined internal structure for their entire torso (both sides and center) of 73 points (52 for one side torso and center combined). Well within what one ammunition crit can eliminate.

[Aegis Kleais]

Um..... do we know that PGI is going to do a 1:1 TT conversion over to MWO in regards to ammo explosion intensity?

[Halfinax]

@Aegis, No, because they haven't weighed in on the subject at all, but I would hope so considering that it is one of those areas that it wouldn't diminish from the joy of a Real Time Game vs a TT experience.

[Lycan]

As was stated, ammo in TT only cooked off with the destructive force of what was left x Damage of whatever weapon used that ammo type.

I don't really see any reason to change it, especially if they plan on introducing/allowing CASE.

[Siilk]

HIemfire, on 05 April 2012 - 02:54 PM, said:

1 ton of machine gun ammunition (200 bursts): 400 damage
1 ton of AC/5, AC/10, AC/20 ammunition (bursts/shots varies): 100 damage

This feels wrong. I think in MWO explosion of 1 ton of MG ammo should do only a fraction of damage of 1 ton of large-bore AC ammo, regardless of what TT rules state.

[AlanEsh]

Siilk, on 06 April 2012 - 01:18 AM, said:

This feels wrong. I think in MWO explosion of 1 ton of MG ammo should do only a fraction of damage of 1 ton of large-bore AC ammo, regardless of what TT rules state.

Agreed. I don't really understand the TT rules in this case -- I mean machine guns don't even have a warhead, so they're calculating the damage from exploding propellant?

On top of that, why would a high velocity AC2 round "explode" in the ammo bay for 2 damage? This round is likely doing a lot more damage just from kinetic impact than it is from any sort of explosion.

LRMs... well those seem to be a pretty good mix of explosive propellant and explosive warheads. But, the warheads are less likely to pop than the propellant, especially if you consider "arming" rules for LRMs.

I see a lot of room to fudge TT rules ammo explosions, and I hope the devs choose to do so.

[Gunmage]

Angelicon, on 06 April 2012 - 06:26 AM, said:

LRMs... well those seem to be a pretty good mix of explosive propellant and explosive warheads. But, the warheads are less likely to pop than the propellant, especially if you consider "arming" rules for LRMs.

Well, if all the propellant in 100 missiles blows up, it's a good bet we'll have warheads exploding as a secondary explosion. Machine guns, though, are a whole different story: in CBT they are not only useless - they are plain dangerous. If devs fix the 400 damage issue, that would only be good.

As a side note, i'd like to see ammunition dumping implemented.

[AlanEsh]

Gunmage, on 06 April 2012 - 06:54 AM, said:

As a side note, i'd like to see ammunition dumping implemented.

AGREED.

Edited by Angelicon, 06 April 2012 - 07:21 AM.

[Lycan]

Gunmage, on 06 April 2012 - 06:54 AM, said:

As a side note, i'd like to see ammunition dumping implemented.

Thirded . . .

[canned wolf]

On the note of dumping ammo, I would love to see internal fires, and fire extinguishing systems. I would also like to see different graphics for each type of ammo explosion and the possibillity of nearby units taking random hits from the cook off.

Edited by canned wolf, 09 April 2012 - 02:30 PM.

[wwiiogre]

In TT rules when you move to level three ammo explosions become very very rare. In the level one and two rules if you go internal and then roll a crit and hit an ammo area it automatically exploded. In level three you get the crit and then must roll on the crit table instead of the internal locations. With ammo explosion only happening on a 1 in 36 plus the original odds rolled to hit plus the roll of needing an 8 or higher on a 2d6 roll so you are talking huge odds to cause an ammo explosion in level three rules which is what we switched to. Because Mechs like the Hawks, Dervish etc were being blown up in the first few turns of a game almost always making them dangerous to pilot and worthless as opfor. So we switched to the level 3 rules making it much harder to cause an ammo explosion. But when they happened it was glorious.

If the Dev's stick to TT for ammo explosions I hope they use the level three rules instead of the standard rules otherwise all of the ammo toting mechs are in for some nasty game ending explosions especially at company level games with 12 v 12 and the ability to concentrate fire onto a single mech from more than four mechs at a time. Ever seen what happens to a medium or light mech when 4 or more LRM Boat armed mechs concentrate fire on to it. Its a one round kill and with so many LRM missiles hitting its a crit fest.

chris