176 replies to this topic

[Krivvan]

Tempered, on 01 November 2012 - 04:36 PM, said:

I can't see the screenshots well, but I believe one important data point is missing. Length of time of the match. The pure pug vs premade matches generally last all of 3 or 4 minutes, with some going as short as two minutes. Pug vs Pug generally lasts longer.

I have a couple of unposted videos. One is a pugstomp lasting 6 minutes. One is an entirely pug game lasting 2 minutes. But yes, I didn't record the times of all the games.

[Ljeto]

First Knight, on 01 November 2012 - 04:34 AM, said:

Taking it off-topic, but am I the only one that noticed it was Founders vs. Non-paying? So that means it was a mix of 7 customized and 1 trial vs. 5 trial and 3 customized with bad results. All did damage so they all tried (how well they tried can not be determined.)

Agree . Most people cant differ premades from founders ... we just see lot of heavies and LRM boats on other side vs majority of rentals. Really who should cares if they are premades or not, just don't like matchmaking now. Most games when i look around and see most my m8s are rentals than there is dam good chance other side is just heavies with good LRM support.

On other hand how does IGP like this, in month or tw0 premades/heavies will have ton of Cbills( they have no need to buys credits) and maybe many of new guys will quit (they will not buy credits) b'cos of this matchmaking. Nobody is having gun on newbies saying u must play this, some will just say ill go look for something more enjoyable.
Newbies at first should fight mostly vs other newbies to get to know game than buy mech and hopefully join some clan and so on ... welcome to the game ...

So if no one is buying Credits for real money what will happen to this game.

Edited by Ljeto, 01 November 2012 - 05:26 PM.

[Krivvan]

Would anyone be interested if I were to do this from the point of view of a premade?

[anonymous175]

Rathe, on 01 November 2012 - 05:11 PM, said:

if you ever run into a cReddit Merc Corp group, we try to announce our premade-ness beforehand. It's only fair.

This is true. Then they shoot cats at you. I was sad it wasn't bacon.

[AceTimberwolf]

Here are my day 2 Stats.

The only thing thats fustrating from that is that out of 4 deaths only 1 is legitimate which was a headshot from Shyrobi. The other three are the 3v6 Crash a Frozen City Crash after Killing MrTerrible and a Premade that took the loss to kill me on a crash in Caustic. so a 107 KD is not so bad for day 2. But people are right PGI shouldn't be keeping stats if Crashes count against you when you have no control over the servers or the client. Especially if they want this game to be competitive the only reason to have stats is if they are accurate which at this point they don't really matter as long as you are having fun. I sent in my Backup logs and crashdump to see if they see something i don't. We should get a stats Wipe when they roll in the new match making system.

[Instinct]

First Knight, on 31 October 2012 - 08:14 PM, said:

With the negative feedback pre-mades have been getting, I am shocked that any actually told you they were a pre-made team.

Truth be told you can not rely on the other team to tell you they are a pre-made or what you may think is a pre-made team. The only people that know they are a premade group is PGI, and they are not telling us anything.

Thats all thats to be said about this thread. yap. My experience since the open beta was exactly the opposite of whats been posted. Before anyone starts telling me that I simply suck, why was my performance good in closed beta? And why am I still having great damage output with trial mechs, often opposed to the rest of my team (and the enemy team almost always has a high damage count)? This and more factors simply can't be explained that simply. Oh yea, and when a premade was on my team, you'd know by how easy they coordinate without using chat (AT ALL). If u play along and don't ask if they are a premade though, (and show a halfways decent performance) u'd get invited to one pretty often though. My experience.

And when I think about it, team chatting is almost nonexistent since open beta which leads me to believe that
bad team = newbies,
good team = teamspeak = premade.
Only in a few cases:
good team = all follow each other randomly.

Edited by Instinct, 02 November 2012 - 06:18 AM.

[Cybermech]

to me the main problem is how quick the trial mechs want to die so that they can run another game.
hope the fix for that will reduce the amount of suicidal players.

+1 really nice post krivvan

[AceTimberwolf]

Cybermech, on 03 November 2012 - 09:47 PM, said:

to me the main problem is how quick the trial mechs want to die so that they can run another game.
hope the fix for that will reduce the amount of suicidal players.

+1 really nice post krivvan

I read that in ur voice LOL

[Justin Xang Allard]

Krivvan, on 31 October 2012 - 08:17 PM, said:

Part of the issue though is that some people are saying that close to every game they play has a premade group advertising a clan/corp or something. I just wanted to show that this isn't usually the case.

I recently joined a premade group, not because i seemed to be running up to them alot, but because it seemed like every game i dropped into had 1 disconect, 1 drop but not fight, 1 person who charged strait into the opposing group, and 1-2 people who hit about 10 percent of the time.

With all of that i still had a 50% win ratio and 3 to 1 kill ratio.
If your not in a pre made, come up with a plan. tell the people what to do. then do it.
this will help you alot. well except for the disconects and chargers anyway.

[Justin Xang Allard]

Cragger, on 01 November 2012 - 05:10 PM, said:

Once you start accepting monetary gain for goods and services on an open market you are no longer in a beta. This is a released good and service to an open market, it is no longer a beta. They may label it a beta in hopes of misleading the naive but it is not a 'beta' project anymore.

Even Wargaming.net which is PGIs current closest competitor did not allow the sell of virtual currency (gold) for monetary currency during their open beta. If you are willing to believe and excuse MWO as being a 'beta' then you might as well label all MMOs as betas since they are never at a fixed 'final' state because MWO is no different. PGI is being paid money for their good that is now released onto the market, thus it is a released good no matter how you try to slice it.

You mean like when you buy some land and pay for a house to be built? then must wait for 2-6 months for your purchased good to be compleated?
I think your logic is somewhat flawed.
Here are a few definitions of beta that i believe apply.
http://www.urbandict...e.php?term=beta
http://www.webopedia.../beta_test.html
http://dictionary.re...rowse/beta+test

the enviroment for this game includes the option to purchase funds, this will keep farmers from doing it like they do in most other games.
i rember the suffering that diablo 3 went through when they released the "market" then found there were all those bugs......
lost items..... lost money...... how many times did they take it down and fix it? 3 i think.
loading into games with bots running around..... Rember how the forums were full of flaming posts?
i would rather test it first....

Edited by Justin Xang Allard, 03 November 2012 - 10:55 PM.

[Odins Fist]

AceTimberwolf, on 02 November 2012 - 03:44 AM, said:

Here are my day 2 Stats.

The only thing thats fustrating from that is that out of 4 deaths only 1 is legitimate which was a headshot from Shyrobi.

.
Cough Cough.... Forest Colony..... COUGH...

[SuomiWarder]

Well, as a leader in a merc unit I started open beta running solo PUG and using only trial mechs even though I have four founders mechs to get a feel for what newbies would be facing. I don't have screen shots but after a few days I had a win loss of around 12/36 and 8 kills to 24 deaths. Ran mostly the Awesome and tried to use all LRMS before closing with lasers.

Figured my stast were toast after the experiment but what the heck, those numbers don't mean anything to real life.

Started running mostly in groups of 4 to 6 with the occasional full 8. Started using my founder's mechs and upgrading. Now I'm 62 wins with 41 losses and 71 kills to 63 deaths.

Am I awesome? Nope. But running with a group let me catch up on a deficit and move into positive stat territory. Using better mech buildouts and especially endosteel made the rest of the difference.

Are all PUG losses the result of being rolled by Premades? Nope. But most Premade group wins are made by rolling over a PUG group. My favorite groups I ran up against pugging or in a duo was the one with a mix of LRM and SRM boats with like two hunchies with guns. Man they trashed the PUG group I was with so fast it wasn't funny. And the other group that had us PUGs dead to one last mech that was powered down and hiding while the premade was in the base capping. That premade stopped their cap just seconds from a win and searched out and killed that last PUG. I was dead and looking through the guy's powered down canopy. I couldn't even console the pilot and invite them to our comms or group as that eneded the game and the chat window. Did that pilot decide to stay and shrug it off? Who knows. But there are some ocean going canines that have lost my respect.

Edited by SuomiWarder, 03 November 2012 - 11:31 PM.

[Krivvan]

I don't think anyone is claiming that premades don't get most of their wins off of PUGs, it's absolutely true, the point was that PUGs don't get most of their losses from full premades. The reason this is actually important is that it means all those 8-0 stomps aren't a result of only premade groups, they can and will happen with almost the same frequency come the tuesday patch. Obviously this isn't ideal. I don't think all who run with premade groups want to just pugstomp, but anyone who thinks it's ideal for matchmaking to pit full team premades against pugs does think so.

[the huanglong]

Here is my insight.
It's probably already been said and nobody cares because I am a serial PUG player with a barely green ratio, but I have lost a lot of matches to premades without being a terribad player.

First of all, farmers, suicides, crashers and anti socials. Most PUGs I drop with are understrength from the beginning. Folks will DC before the countdown, Raven 2Xs will run off to suicide, Awesome 8Ts will alpha into the air and then decide they need to read the instructions after a disconnect. Assuming after that my team still has enough people for a potentially fair fight, a PUG has around 10 seconds to come up with a plan to beat 8 guys in constant communication. If I am in a flexible mech I will ask if there are any specialists or anyone who would rather do it a certain way, or just volunteer a plan if I myself am specialized. More often than not I am met with silence or abuse, followed shortly by a 0/8 loss.

After that, the most common reason for a premade to beat me and whoever I dropped with is LRM or streak boating, even if I can avoid the death rain a lot of my team mates don't. By that stage I can't come back from it.

After that it is joke matches. 8 Jenners or 8 Atlases. What can you do? Sometimes it's 8 rocks to your 2 papers.

[Asseri]

What is this? Stats page in profile? I dont have one! What gives?

[AceTimberwolf]

Asseri, on 04 November 2012 - 12:41 AM, said:

What is this? Stats page in profile? I dont have one! What gives?

Hit profile and at the top middle is the stats page

[Justin Xang Allard]

Asseri, on 04 November 2012 - 12:41 AM, said:

What is this? Stats page in profile? I dont have one! What gives?

its fixed now you can look.....