144 replies to this topic

[Dragunz Pryde]

Is it me, or are people forgetting how the Clan's work here?? In the lore they almost NEVER attacked with a larger force then the defenders had. Their honor is everything. I'm sure PGI will make it something like 8 vs. 12. That would be a pretty standard match i would assume. And yes the clan mechs will be more expensive, both to acquire and to maintain. That only makes sense. You don't go 1 vs. 1 on a clan mech ton for ton anyways.

[Stone Wall]

Clan mechs will rule this game. This will have to be accepted.

[Z0MBIE Y0SHI]

I say have clans fight outnumbered at the start, then make changes from there.

Also, this is a ways into the future, no point in screaming already about a topic that's over a decade old.

[Roadbuster]

Taken from a wiki:

Quote

From a game balance standpoint, the Clan organizational structure allows BattleTech players to quickly assemble a balanced game of two Inner Sphere Lances (8 Mechs) versus a Star of Clan forces (5 mechs). Superior Clan technology makes up for the difference in numbers, assuming similar weight classes of typical Mechs.

This sounds fine to me.
After all we won't see battles with mixed forces anytime soon. It'll either be IS vs IS, IS vs Clan or Clan vs Clan.
IS just has to make up for the lack of technology with more mechs. Same as in the books where they just overwhelmed Clan forces by outnumbering them and clan honor/pride preventing the Clans from using an equal number of mechs.

Edited by Roadbuster, 08 November 2012 - 05:50 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Urza Mechwalker, on 08 November 2012 - 02:06 AM, said:

As I said.. just make clans unable to premade! And that is not far fetching .. it simulates LORe where clan warriors were expected to fight without ANY help

Actually, this makes sense. The Clans "Did not play well with others". That is a known fact. The Clans fought like Lone Wolves, looking for personal glory over team success. It DOES fit the Canon quite well.

[Stone Wall]

Is this game supposed to follow BT rules? Just curious as I haven't followed what the Devs have said. I haven't played a MW game online yet that follows every rule.

[Z0MBIE Y0SHI]

Joseph Mallan, on 08 November 2012 - 05:53 AM, said:

Actually, this makes sense. The Clans "Did not play well with others". That is a known fact. The Clans fought like Lone Wolves, looking for personal glory over team success. It DOES fit the Canon quite well.

I'm lost here. Were there several cases were a single pilot conquered a planet?

[Pangorin]

Joseph Mallan, on 08 November 2012 - 05:53 AM, said:

Actually, this makes sense. The Clans "Did not play well with others". That is a known fact. The Clans fought like Lone Wolves, looking for personal glory over team success. It DOES fit the Canon quite well.

I fully agree with the canon side of the medal, but what is with the player side? Will the community be happy with this? You decide to play Clan and you can not play with your friends? Hmmm, I guess a lot of people will have a problem with this!

[Penance]

Nauht, on 08 November 2012 - 01:12 AM, said:

Considering that clans are scheduled after CW is released it's pretty useless to speculate how PGI will attempt to equalise them.

I agree, with the game currently as is right now, clan mechs would be severely OP. But let's see how they handle CW and if a BV or tonnage or ranking system comes in that would make clan mechs more equal to IS.

Expect clan mechs to do more damage, but overheat faster with more shutdowns if built incorrectly and using clan tech. There-in lies the balance.

Edited by Penance, 08 November 2012 - 05:57 AM.

[Terror Teddy]

Z0MBIE Y0SHI, on 08 November 2012 - 05:55 AM, said:

I'm lost here. Were there several cases were a single pilot conquered a planet?

I think he more means that they are more "honourable single combat" minded and would challenge another mechwarrior to battle and NOT call in 4 support LRM mechs to flatten the enemy into the ground.

You could say that a Clan team would be a team that does not use focused fire from multiple Clan mechs against one enemy.

[MustrumRidcully]

Penance, on 08 November 2012 - 05:57 AM, said:

Expect clan mechs to do more damage, but overheat faster with more shutdowns if built incorrectly and using clan tech. There-in lies the balance.

No. not really. if they overheat faster, the will not necessarily deliver more damage at all.
Also, rapidly overheating mechs aren't fun either.

Drawbacks and trade-offs must exist, but they must be balanced, and the trade-offs must still be enjoyable.

[Cleverbird]

Hi there, I'm completely unfamiliar with the Mechwarrior universe, what exactly are Clan mechs? I've heard this term come by from time to time, but always figured these were mechs that simply had a specific color scheme, indicating that they're in a clan.

[Stone Wall]

Cleverbird, on 08 November 2012 - 06:04 AM, said:

Hi there, I'm completely unfamiliar with the Mechwarrior universe, what exactly are Clan mechs? I've heard this term come by from time to time, but always figured these were mechs that simply had a specific color scheme, indicating that they're in a clan.

from what I gathered playing MechWarrior 3 and 4:

There are two factions: Inner Sphere and Clans. One of them was "trueborn."

The Clans always seemed to have better mechs and equipment in those games, while the Inner Sphere seemed to have just assembled piles of trash and salvaged Clan tech into mechs.

I think it is something like the British(Clans) vs Inner Sphere(American colonists).

Edited by Stone Wall, 08 November 2012 - 06:07 AM.

[Roadbuster]

Cleverbird, on 08 November 2012 - 06:04 AM, said:

Hi there, I'm completely unfamiliar with the Mechwarrior universe, what exactly are Clan mechs? I've heard this term come by from time to time, but always figured these were mechs that simply had a specific color scheme, indicating that they're in a clan.

Check here http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page
Contains most of the info you'll ever need about Battletech.

[Pangorin]

MustrumRidcully, on 08 November 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

No. not really. if they overheat faster, the will not necessarily deliver more damage at all.
Also, rapidly overheating mechs aren't fun either.

Drawbacks and trade-offs must exist, but they must be balanced, and the trade-offs must still be enjoyable.

You are right, Sir!(I assume you are a Sir, otherwise, sorry Ma'am! ) That is how it has to be done, but how will it work when a lot of players expect to get a "L33tRoXXor" Super ClanMech? This is the problem I expect with a balanced system.
It needs to balanced but the expectation is that a Clan Mech will always destroy an IS-Mech. How will PGI get this working???

[Stone Wall]

why would there need to be balance between the mech factions?

the only reason would be if PGI makes a IS vs Clan mode. other than that, just don't use the bad mechs. for example: who takes a forklift to a race with a Corvette?

[Xelrah]

Cleverbird, on 08 November 2012 - 06:04 AM, said:

Hi there, I'm completely unfamiliar with the Mechwarrior universe, what exactly are Clan mechs? I've heard this term come by from time to time, but always figured these were mechs that simply had a specific color scheme, indicating that they're in a clan.

Overview: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Clans
Weapons statistics: http://www.sarna.net...Equipment_Lists
List of Clan mechs: http://www.sarna.net...i/Clan_%27Mechs

And of course: http://www.sarna.net...f_%28Mad_Cat%29

[Pangorin]

Stone Wall, on 08 November 2012 - 06:09 AM, said:

why would there need to be balance between the mech factions?

the only reason would be if PGI makes a IS vs Clan mode. other than that, just don't use the bad mechs. for example: who takes a forklift to a race with a Corvette?

I think the most fun will/would be the fight between IS and Clan, don't you think? Wouldn't we lose a lot of the game if there would just be Clan vs. Clan and IS vs. IS?
And then, nobody shall use the IS mechs because they are bad? Okay, whom shall the Clan fight then? 8 Claner vs. 0 IS would not be fun!

[MustrumRidcully]

Pangorin, on 08 November 2012 - 06:07 AM, said:

You are right, Sir!(I assume you are a Sir, otherwise, sorry Ma'am! ) That is how it has to be done, but how will it work when a lot of players expect to get a "L33tRoXXor" Super ClanMech? This is the problem I expect with a balanced system.
It needs to balanced but the expectation is that a Clan Mech will always destroy an IS-Mech. How will PGI get this working???

I see 2 possibilities. Or maybe 3.

1) IS vs Clan Tech gets rebalanced. Clan ER lasers just have slightly different stats then IS ER Lasers. For example:
IS PPC: Deals 10 Damage, Heat 9, ROF 3 seconds; 7 Tons, 3 Crits
IS ER PPC: Deals 10 damage, Heat 10, ROF 4 seconds; 7 Tons, 3 Crits
Clan ER PPC: Deals 10 damage, Heat 10, ROF: 5 seconds; 6 Tons, 2 Crits

IS Single Heat Sinks: +1 Heat Capacity, 0.1 Dissipation/Sec; 1 Ton, 1 Crit
IS Double Heat Sinks: +1 Heat Capacity, 0.2 Dissipation/Sec; 1 Ton, 3 Crit
Clan Double Heat Sink: +0.5 Heat Capacity, 0.2 Dissipation/Sec; 1 Ton, 2 Crit

2) Clan Advantage is taken care of by the matchmaker- Something like Battletech's Battle Value system is adopted, or the general rule is - 2 IS Lances fight (2 x 4 Mechs) fight 1 Clan Star (5 Mechs)

3) PGI creates some horrible unbalanced mess that includes an (un)healthy dose of pay-to-win.

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 08 November 2012 - 06:15 AM.

[Viper69]

If they cant even impliment double heatsinks without nerfing them. What the f***k do you think that they will do to clan tech? Use your head.