50 replies to this topic

[Wolfgang Von Schmuck]

now admittedly i haven't played MW3, but one thing that always annoyed me in MW4 was that IS SRMS were dumb fire. now with missiles or lasers that's not a huge deal, because they're much faster 'projectiles' but it made regular SRMS more or less useless.

(and now for my creepy Question-Suggestion hybrid!) will SRMs be target-locking like LRMs, dumbfire (PLEASE GOD NO!) or the weird insta-lock of MW4 Streak SRMS? personally i'd leave Streak missiles as instant lock, but make regular SRMS lock just like regular LRMS.

[00dlez]

Please fix the poll so people can tell what the responses are.

SRMS should remain dumb fire, and streaks should need only a short moment to lock. I did not like the instant lock of MW4 (Well. acutally, I love it cause it's super effective but I do not like it as a mechanic.), but having a long lock time at that short of range doesn't appeal to me either. 2 or 3 second lock time max, if that.

[Shredhead]

SRM are dumbfire rockets, straight on to the target area. If you want to have lock-on missiles, you have to make do with IS Streak SRM-2, the bigger ones come later, or with the clans according to http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Streak_SRM

P.S.: Please make your poll and post readable.

Edited by Shredhead, 25 April 2012 - 01:05 PM.

[Kudzu]

Keep them dumbfire, at the ranges they're supposed to be used at it shouldn't be an issue.

[Felicitatem Parco]

... and dumbfire SRMs aren't targeted by AMS... I like that.

I noticed that, unlike in MW4 where SRMs are fired in ripples (a SRM6 pod fires 3 bursts of 2missiles each), the SRM pods in MW:O all fire at once. I like that, too. That's how it should be.

Now, that fact that they travel so slowly... from the trailers I watched it seems like SRMs in MW:O are so slow that they're only useful against either less-manuverable targets or targets that aren't paying attention to you. I saw one SRM6 burst hit a Jenner once, but only because the Jenner was otherwise occupied.

In MW4 I despised the Commando 2D because the pair of missile pods had to be used with target-in-crosshairs for a prolonged period of time to generate maximum damage; I loved hunting assaults in a Jenner-F because the 4 Medium Lasers were fire-and-forget awesomeness, I didn't miss the SRM pod that was removed, and the extra armor kept me alive. When it comes to MW:O, however, this will likely be reversed. The Commando 2D with it's SRM6 and SRM4 seems to be an excellent Atlas-hunter because you don't have to hold your aim to fire SRMs anymore, but you do have to hold your aim to generate max damage with the medium lasers.

What a shake up!

[Dihm]

ARG!!!! AGAIN!?

SRMS are not ROCKETS! They LOCK ON!

The whole point of the Streak system is, if you don't have a lock with all missiles, it prevents the mechwarrior from firing in order to conserve ammo. It doesn't suddenly add instant-lock!

If they are stupid dumb-fire rockets like MW4, I will never use them.

[Shredhead]

Dihm, on 26 April 2012 - 06:33 AM, said:

ARG!!!! AGAIN!?

SRMS are not ROCKETS! They LOCK ON!

The whole point of the Streak system is, if you don't have a lock with all missiles, it prevents the mechwarrior from firing in order to conserve ammo. It doesn't suddenly add instant-lock!

If they are stupid dumb-fire rockets like MW4, I will never use them.

I think you mix up ShortRangeMissiles, which are dumbfire, with Streak ShortRangeMissiles, which need a lock on to be fired and are guided.

[MaddMaxx]

Dihm, on 26 April 2012 - 06:33 AM, said:

ARG!!!! AGAIN!?

SRMS are not ROCKETS! They LOCK ON!

The whole point of the Streak system is, if you don't have a lock with all missiles, it prevents the mechwarrior from firing in order to conserve ammo. It doesn't suddenly add instant-lock!

If they are stupid dumb-fire rockets like MW4, I will never use them.

Question? Why would anyone need the Streak feature/function if the SRM's track to their targets? If the Lock as you say then they will hit when fired while locked.

[Dihm]

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

SRM said:

First introduced in 2370 by the Terran Hegemony, Short Range Missiles are direct-fire missiles that sacrifice range for hitting power. Adapted towards the profusion of electronic jamming on the battlefield and the effectiveness of current armor designs, these missiles are less sophisticated than Long Range Missiles and particularly effective against infantry and combat vehicles. Clan SRM launchers compare favorable to Inner Sphere designs by being more compact and lighter weight. SRMs are highly upgradable, able to fire a variety of warheads and benefit from devices such as Artemis IV FCS.

Artemis IV FCS said:

Introduced in 2598 by the Terran Hegemony^[1]. The Artemis IV Fire Control System is a guidance system that utilizes an infrared laser designator and tight-beam microwave transmitter which improves the accuracy of LRMs, SRMs, and MMLs by roughly thirty-five percent. The Artemis IV FCS must be mounted in the same location as the launcher it controls, taking up space and weight on a BattleMech like other components.^[2] In order to actually take the benefit of Artemis IV, the missiles fired must be Artemis compatible, which are more expensive than standard versions, and the firing unit must have line of sight to its target, indirectly fired LRM receives no increase in accuracy.

Though extremely useful for improving a missile launcher, there is one major obstacle to their use: If any standard missile launcher is equipped with an Artemis system, every launcher of that type must have its own Artemis IV attached.^[3] Therefore a 'Mech mounting an LRM-15 and an LRM-5 would need two Artemis IV systems. (As they use different guidance systems, Rocket Launchers, MRMs, Streak launchers, and NARC systems do not require Artemis IV and do not count towards this limit.) ATM launchers automatically have Artemis included.

If it didn't have a guidance system, it couldn't benefit from Artemis. Which it does. Just like the LRMs, which also benefit from Artemis. Notice that it calls out all the other types of missiles that use "different guidance systems"? SRMs would not be able to improve their accuracy by "35%" if it was all based on the pilot's ability to aim dumb-fire rockets.

Streak Missile Launcher said:

Originally developed in 2647, the Streak SRM Launcher is relatively similar to the standard SRM launcher but linked to a unique Targa-7 fire control system. This system is designed to guarantee a hit against any target onto which the pilot can get a lock, a special feature of this system preventing the weapon from firing at a target when there is no lock-on, saving ammunition by preventing shots that would miss anyway.

Streaks are, much like Artemis, a fire control system. Only, unlike Artemis, it can only be put on SRMs (SRM 2s to be specific) in our time period (though they are adapted to LRMs later on).

Edited by Dihm, 26 April 2012 - 08:57 AM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

"Originally developed in 2647, the Streak SRM Launcher is relatively similar to the standard SRM launcher but linked to a unique Targa-7 fire control system. This system is designed to guarantee a hit against any target onto which the pilot can get a lock, a special feature of this system preventing the weapon from firing at a target when there is no lock-on, saving ammunition by preventing shots that would miss anyway."

It seems like the prevention of firing without a lock is only one of the multiple features of Streak. I think that passage could be read like this:

"This system is designed to guarantee a hit against any target onto which the pilot can get a lock, one special feature of this system being the prevention of firing the weapon at a target when there is no lock-on, saving ammunition by preventing shots that would miss anyway."

[MaddMaxx]

So we should expect MWO's SRM's to lock onto targets the same as the LRM's then? While the Streak and Artemis systems enhance said missile systems accuracy, or assist with ammo conservation.

[Dihm]

Think of it like a safety, it prevents you from shooting yourself in the leg or other delicate bits. The reason you're more accurate with a Streak FCS is because your shot HAS to be accurate for them to even leave the launcher.

Edit:

MaddMaxx, on 26 April 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

So we should expect MWO's SRM's to lock onto targets the same as the LRM's then? While the Streak and Artemis systems enhance said missile systems accuracy, or assist with ammo conservation.

That would make sense, yes, since that's what they actually do.

Edited by Dihm, 26 April 2012 - 09:19 AM.

[Shredhead]

Dihm, on 26 April 2012 - 08:56 AM, said:

If it didn't have a guidance system, it couldn't benefit from Artemis. Which it does. Just like the LRMs, which also benefit from Artemis. Notice that it calls out all the other types of missiles that use "different guidance systems"? SRMs would not be able to improve their accuracy by "35%" if it was all based on the pilot's ability to aim dumb-fire rockets.

Sarna says:

Quote

The Artemis IV Fire Control System is a guidance system that utilizes an infrared laser designator and tight-beam microwave transmitter which improves the accuracy of LRMs, SRMs, and MMLs by roughly thirty-five percent. The Artemis IV FCS must be mounted in the same location as the launcher it controls, taking up space and weight on a BattleMech like other components.^[2] In order to actually take the benefit of Artemis IV, the missiles fired must be Artemis compatible, which are more expensive than standard versions, and the firing unit must have line of sight to its target, indirectly fired LRM receives no increase in accuracy.

That means standard SRM are unguided, while you need special ARTEMIS warheads with targetcomputers adjusted to the infrared frequency of the ARTEMIS IV guidance system.
ARTEMIS IV is just so bad it only increases the accuracy by 35%.

Further edit:
Out of rulebook 4th edition:

Quote

SRMs are direct-trajectory missiles with high-explosive or armor-piercing explosive warheads. They are accurate only at ranges of less than 300 meters but are more powerful than LRMs.

direct trajectory is clear as clear, isn't it? Now leave this poor desk of yours alone, those dents will never grow out...

Edited by Shredhead, 26 April 2012 - 10:06 AM.

[Dihm]

/facedesk

[Ramien]

There is a category for self-propelled warheads with a lack of guidance system - they are called rockets. There is a separate rocket launcher system in battletech.

[Dihm]

Quote

In a modern military, a missile is a self-propelled guided weapon system. Missiles have four system components: targeting and/or guidance, flight system, engine, and warhead.

Quote

Some military weapons use rockets to propel warheads to their targets. A rocket and its payload together are generally referred to as a missile when the weapon has a guidance system (not all missiles use rocket engines, some use other engines such as jets) or as a rocket if it is unguided.

[Aegis Kleais]

00dlez, on 25 April 2012 - 01:01 PM, said:

Please fix the poll so people can tell what the responses are.

SRMS should remain dumb fire, and streaks should need only a short moment to lock. I did not like the instant lock of MW4 (Well. acutally, I love it cause it's super effective but I do not like it as a mechanic.), but having a long lock time at that short of range doesn't appeal to me either. 2 or 3 second lock time max, if that.

The moment I saw yet ANOTHER meme, I just disregarded to thread/poll completely.

*Aegis' Usability Tip* - Don't require users to force an IQ drop in order to read and comprehend poll options!

[MaddMaxx]

Dihm, on 26 April 2012 - 10:19 AM, said:

Dihm, I forsee another /facedesk in your immediate future. lol

[Shredhead]

Quote

ballistic missile

noun Rocketry.
any missile that, after being launched and possibly guided during takeoff, travels unpowered in aballistic trajectory.

From http://dictionary.re...llistic+missile
It doesn't have to be guided after firing to be called a missile.

Edited by Shredhead, 26 April 2012 - 10:27 AM.

[MaddMaxx]

Aegis Kleais™, on 26 April 2012 - 10:21 AM, said:

*Maxx's Usability Tip* - Please turn off the GD Polling feature. (except for the Mods and Dev's) arrgghhhhh!

I like to get a Poll on as much as the next guy right? but...

Edited by MaddMaxx, 26 April 2012 - 10:25 AM.