3696 replies to this topic

[MWLL Rad Hanzo]

Community Warfare at its best .... one jus´ gots da luv´ it, muha.

But I am still against 3rd Person View for all the well-known reasons.

Commence battle please, I R entertained by it.

Edited by MWLL Rad Hanzo, 16 November 2012 - 02:00 PM.

[Gimpy Warpig]

Like a Sir, on 16 November 2012 - 01:40 PM, said:

Are you sure you don't work for PGI, with their recent decisions I wouldn't be surprised if the spaced the fact, that the forums show us when the account has been created lol

WOW, just F'in WOW. You and your little fanboys need to chill - Cnox is one of the few people here posting anything other than pathetic whiney crap. Just cuz you disagree with him, you want to beat him down now? Grow up little boy, and if you're not a little boy - start acting like it for gods sake.

[Bubba Wilkins]

Cnox, on 16 November 2012 - 01:48 PM, said:

So, considering I explained several ways that the implementation could be made to be 'fair', then we're in agreement. Finally, someone is reasonable.

To recap, here's how I would code it. While in 3rd person view:
1) No zooming.
2) Unable to rotate camera or freelook. You only see ahead of you in the direction your torso is pointed.
3) You can only see mechs that the 1st person view perspective would give you LOS on. So you could see around a corner, but until you walk up to and around it, POOF a mech could appear that you coudln't see (INCLUDING mechs that stand in your blind spot)

New ideas: (since we can have a reasonable conversation about it)
4) No crosshairs on display while in 3rd person view making it very difficult to aim. I think you should still be able to pull the trigger, but no crosshairs would make it nearly imipossible to do any type of accurate fighting.

They do this, and I can't imagine what the possible problem could be from the other side of the argument.

/sigh

1) Big deal, you could still see over the building or around corners.
2) You can still turn your torso, so it's basically "free-look" by default.
3) Yes, lets open that whole can of worms where you now have to add a huge chunk of new coding to make mechs visible/invisible.
4) Nothing wrong here except that it's more unnecessary coding.

Better to just say 1st person only and eliminate all that extra BS.

Gimpy Warpig, on 16 November 2012 - 01:51 PM, said:

No actually, YOUR IGNORANCE shows here - 1pv'ers will play in 1pv games. Did you not get that bit? Its only been said, I dunno, a hundred times now in this thread. The 1pv and 3pv views would be an option selected pre-drop and 1pv players would drop vs other 1pv players.

It's unnecessary duplication. Are you then going to say all Merc companies must declare upfront which way they go? How about battles for planets/territory? are you going to have 2 version of those as well to keep things fair?

The only resounding positive support to 3rd person is for deadman's cams, spectators, and battle ROM post game reviews. If your active and playing, its 1st person or not at all.

They are not going to draw and retain a huge massive population by implementing it and they will lose a good number of us who will leave.

[Gimpy Warpig]

Z0MBIE Y0SHI, on 16 November 2012 - 01:53 PM, said:

Please point to where this has been confirmed.

The only thing I see is speculations, what if's, and maybe's.

And do you really think splitting a small community is in the games best interest?

Thats what Russ said in his interview man. Give it a listen please. Although you do have a point about one thing - all of this is speculation, what ifs and maybes for sure.

[Z0MBIE Y0SHI]

Gimpy Warpig, on 16 November 2012 - 02:02 PM, said:

WOW, just F'in WOW. You and your little fanboys need to chill - Cnox is one of the few people here posting anything other than pathetic whiney crap. Just cuz you disagree with him, you want to beat him down now? Grow up little boy, and if you're not a little boy - start acting like it for gods sake.

IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.

^ Not constructive, and when you make posts like that, you paint a target on your head because people assume;
1. He's a troll
2. He's a 12 year old
3. He's a 12 year old troll

[maxdest]

I can understand that torso twist is something that takes a while to get used to, but as others have stated 3rd person gives inherent advantages and breaks immersion.

I would:
1) Add a proper interactive tutorial
2) Add tool tips on the load screens
3) Allow 3rd person for trial mechs only
4) Add a tool tip that clearly states that once graduated to a true mech 1st person only

This gives new players a good while to get used to the controls, but keeps the current sim feel that is a lot of MWO's appeal.

[Kavoh]

Cnox, on 16 November 2012 - 01:48 PM, said:

So, considering I explained several ways that the implementation could be made to be 'fair', then we're in agreement. Finally, someone is reasonable.

To recap, here's how I would code it. While in 3rd person view:
1) No zooming.
2) Unable to rotate camera or freelook. You only see ahead of you in the direction your torso is pointed.
3) You can only see mechs that the 1st person view perspective would give you LOS on. So you could see around a corner, but until you walk up to and around it, POOF a mech could appear that you coudln't see (INCLUDING mechs that stand in your blind spot)

New ideas: (since we can have a reasonable conversation about it)
4) No crosshairs on display while in 3rd person view making it very difficult to aim. I think you should still be able to pull the trigger, but no crosshairs would make it nearly imipossible to do any type of accurate fighting.

They do this, and I can't imagine what the possible problem could be from the other side of the argument.

1. You dont need a zoom to take advantage of the overall view 3rd person gives you.
2. You run off to a corner, plant your cockpit into the wall, switch to 3rd person, and you still see around the corner.
3. That would be a disaster to implement even if it would fix ONE of the problems.
4. This would solve poptarting (to an extent)

However, with this extreme of restrictions and requirements to implement, there is no point AT ALL in the first place to put it in. By the time people figure out wth is going on in 3rd person, they could have quite possibly achieved the pre-school feat of understanding what the triangles with the line attached on the HUD means.

Edited by Kavoh, 16 November 2012 - 02:12 PM.

[tenderloving]

AvatarofWhat, on 16 November 2012 - 01:17 PM, said:

@cnox

I love how someone who signed up today is trying to tell everyone who has been playing this game since closed beta, the majority of which are founders who spent up to 120 dollars founding this game what the game should be like. Have you even played the game yet? You signed up like 2 hours ago! Go play the game for a few days and then come back and tell me that you need 3rd person added in, then I might take you seriously. You are the sort of come and go player that PGI should not be listening to!

edit-Member Since Today, 02:11 PM
Online Last Active Today, 03:17 PM

Good detective work. Did this guy ever post proof or did he disappear?

[Gimpy Warpig]

Bubba Wilkins, on 16 November 2012 - 02:02 PM, said:

It's unnecessary duplication. Are you then going to say all Merc companies must declare upfront which way they go? How about battles for planets/territory? are you going to have 2 version of those as well to keep things fair?

Actually, THIS reason right here is the only one I havent been able to wrap my brain around on how they'd "make it right". The meta-game..... some teams would pop up that only wanted to play in 1pv or 3pv exclusively - how to drops between them get handled over a disputed planet? That would take some thought....I personally dont see a way around it right now, though I'm sure there'd be an easy enough solution....will give it thought.

[CG Chicken Kn]

No......just......say.......no to 3rd person.
There is no reason it is needed for gameplay.
We pilot mechs, not remotely drive them.

Not to mention the huge amount of extra work this would make for PGI, and the huge waste of man hours that would be needed to deal with balancing it, all for something an extremely small percentage of gamers want, and would never be used by the vast majority.

Thousands upon thousands of CZ games. Never once without "Force First Person" enabled.
Unless PGI wants to segregate the small minority from ever participating in competitive gameplay.
Although I seriously doubt anyone who wanted to play in third person would last more than 20 seconds against
the skilled units and players who will populate the competitive areas of the game.

[Gimpy Warpig]

Z0MBIE Y0SHI, on 16 November 2012 - 02:08 PM, said:

IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.

^ Not constructive, and when you make posts like that, you paint a target on your head because people assume;
1. He's a troll
2. He's a 12 year old
3. He's a 12 year old troll

I didn't see anyone bashing the trolls posting the hundred "NO 3PV!" pics in their posts.

[tenderloving]

Z0MBIE Y0SHI, on 16 November 2012 - 02:08 PM, said:

IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.
IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE PERSPECTIVE, DON'T USE IT.

^ Not constructive, and when you make posts like that, you paint a target on your head because people assume;
1. He's a troll
2. He's a 12 year old
3. He's a 12 year old troll

I assume he's a shill.

[Like a Sir]

Cnox, on 16 November 2012 - 01:23 PM, said:

Actually, I've been playing since day one of open beta, and I have already unlocked all my elite skills across the 3 variants of my mechs. So, it's safe to say I've put in quite a few hours.

But thanks for offering a shining example of what's wrong with this community: only those who have gotten into closed beta are entitled to a voice. Awesome attitude!

So there is this and then...

Gimpy Warpig, on 16 November 2012 - 02:02 PM, said:

WOW, just F'in WOW. You and your little fanboys need to chill - Cnox is one of the few people here posting anything other than pathetic whiney crap. Just cuz you disagree with him, you want to beat him down now? Grow up little boy, and if you're not a little boy - start acting like it for gods sake.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt one last time, maybe you don't know how this works.

Click on your name next to your post. Right under your name, it will say Member since 1 Nov 2012... That is when your account has been created, the same account you use to play the game. Now click on Cnoxes name... Member since... wait for it... drum roll... TODAY!!!...
Now look to my first quote. This means he is either 1. A lying POS who hasn't played the game yet. 2 Somebodys second account, they created to show that the silent majority cares (not yours I'm sure).

Now if you are in support of either one of those, I have nothing left to say to you. If you didn't know this trick I just showed you could be done, we are still good, and you are welcome.

[Durant Carlyle]

Wow. This poll has the most votes of anything I've seen since I've been in the Beta. And the response is a resounding "HELL NO!!!" to any kind of controllable third-person view.

Let me write your next announcement for you:

"Based on overwhelming player feedback, we have decided to cease development of any kind of third-person view. And as compensation for even thinking that such a dumb idea should ever be included in MW:O, we are going to release BattleMech #12 early."

[John Marik]

Absolutely not. This is a terrible idea and takes away the simulation part of the game. Plus the fact that players that use this will immediately gain a sight advantage on other players basically forcing everyone to play in third person. You will kill your playerbase if you do this.

[PapaKilo]

Durant Carlyle, on 16 November 2012 - 02:14 PM, said:

"Based on overwhelming player feedback, we have decided to cease development of any kind of third-person view. And as compensation for even thinking that such a dumb idea should ever be included in MW:O, we are going to release BattleMech #12 early."

+9000 to this!

[Fr33lanc3r]

The thing that they're trying to address, ie new players not being able to really know where there legs are, isn't going to be solved by putting in 3rd person.

Let's look at this another way, parents will follow a small child around during their first steps, are they doing this for posterity, or to help the child see their feet from a different perspective. I would assume posterity, but maybe the parents have a cybernetic helm attached to their wee tot. In other words, just like that small child, the only way someone is going to get used to where their legs and torso are at in first person it to work at it in first person.

[Thomas Covenant]

Ok, I've had some time to take in Piranha and the communitie's motives and concerns and sleep on it a bit. I'm feeling refreshed and all the better to make a well thought out response. Ok here it goes.

So, Piranha, MWO Community, let's note what we are collectively doing right, getting passionate ABOUT the game be about skill, and ABOUT the game getting a large community.

These are fine things to be passionate about. While I agree making a point by insulting your opposition is not productive, and I really suggest those that do contemplate the saying "that which you resist, persists", on the other hand getting emotional about something, about these things, isn't a bad idea, infact it's quite good.

We would not, could not be here without passion. "Passion is what makes it happen". We just need to agree on what's worth getting "emotional" about.

[John Marik]

Fr33lanc3r, on 16 November 2012 - 02:17 PM, said:

The thing that they're trying to address, ie new players not being able to really know where there legs are, isn't going to be solved by putting in 3rd person.

Let's look at this another way, parents will follow a small child around during their first steps, are they doing this for posterity, or to help the child see their feet from a different perspective. I would assume posterity, but maybe the parents have a cybernetic helm attached to their wee tot. In other words, just like that small child, the only way someone is going to get used to where their legs and torso are at in first person it to work at it in first person.

Agreed, if they just put in a proper tutorial mission/missions it would solve all their problems and not take away from the game.

[NocturnalBeast]

Looks like a majority of the PAYING customers say no.