2926 replies to this topic

[Alois Hammer]

WinningOne, on 01 February 2013 - 11:17 AM, said:

If you had listened to the interview you would know that PGI would allow you to only play against other players using the same camera view as you.

Maybe. That depends on whether "We will separate first person and third person view players" is taken as a rule, or a mere suggestion to be handwaved away like their previous claims about the game being "all about the in-the-cockpit first-person experience."

Y'all can't have it both ways- either what they say is law, or it's worthless and subject to constant revision. Not "What they say that I like is Holy Gospel and cannot be altered, but what they say that I don't agree withis just mumbling, to be ignored."

[Coolant]

Pando, on 10 January 2013 - 09:23 AM, said:

I like speculation. I'm well within my opinion to speculate. Waitin' for someone to comment on the rest of my statement aside from speculation.

As far as the "fact" comment goes. If you were to take the number of players in MMO's and shooters that offer some variation of 3rd person and pit them against games that have first person ONLY....first person numbers would be insignificant in direct comparison.

For speculation, take into consideration these few...

Some games that have a 3rd person perspective in some form or another.

World of Warcraft
World of Tanks
Battlefield 3
Rift
ArmA 2 & expansion packs & mods like DayZ
PlanetSide 1 & 2
This list could go on, and on, and on and on.

Now, someone else list some games that are 1st person exclusive. Then, let's speculate on player totals for each game. Combine them. Then compare.

I did just that...http://en.wikipedia....person_shooters

Quick scan of that list shows most are before 2009 lol

Umm, 3rd Person is immensely popular to say the least. But, hey, the minority of 1st person only purists are gonna try and drum up every excuse they can, even though the evidence (including the last mechwarrior title MW4: Mercs) is heavily favored in the 3rd person perspective

Edited by Coolant, 02 February 2013 - 09:32 AM.

[MWHawke]

Coolant, on 02 February 2013 - 09:29 AM, said:

I did just that...http://en.wikipedia....person_shooters

Quick scan of that list shows most are before 2009 lol

Umm, 3rd Person is immensely popular to say the least. But, hey, the minority of 1st person only purists are gonna try and drum up every excuse they can, even though the evidence (including the last mechwarrior title MW4: Mercs) is heavily favored in the 3rd person perspective

The evidence??? LOL! Look at the poll. Which planet are you from??!? You don't understand what a poll is?

[GruenGruen]

sirs, may the elder vorgive my bad english:)
i have a question to the mass disconnects per game.
ich hab read on several pages trough the web that are some key shortcuts to switch into 3 view .
And the high amount of crashes that may occur by doing it.
is there some conncetion btween ppl try to get into 3view and the discconcts during bg:)?
lg gruengruen

[Coolant]

MWHawke, on 02 February 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

The evidence??? LOL! Look at the poll. Which planet are you from??!? You don't understand what a poll is?

geez, really? Have you scanned the rest of the thread for reasons of a lopsized poll or you just looked at the poll numbers without taking the time to consider the arguments against and are short-sighted? You sound like just another purist that wants to keep the user-base small and niche, rigid, never willing to compromise on anything even though there is a vast potential player base in the 3rd Person Shooter genre? Oh wait, you wouldn't have to compromise on anything, because the way it's been described you would never have to play against a person using 3rd Person. And, you are unwilling to come to terms with the fact that other Mechwarrior titles had 3rd Person and were more popular than 1st Person only in said games, and that the votes against 3rd Person are a very small percentage of the # of registered users, of which, the vast majority haven't bothered to post or vote. Not to mention what the poll might look like on a popular 3rd Person Shooter site to gauge interest in playing MWO if it remained strictly 1st Person only without a 3rd Person Option...

You know, I'm really not that big of an advocate for 3rd Person. I would prefer that the option was in MWO, but I can play 1st person or 3rd person and did in Mercs. But, it's the irrational, illogical, outbursts of outrage, that keep me posting

Edited by Coolant, 02 February 2013 - 10:58 AM.

[WinningOne]

Coolant, on 02 February 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

You know, I'm really not that big of an advocate for 3rd Person. I would prefer that the option was in MWO, but I can play 1st person or 3rd person and did in Mercs. But, it's the irrational, illogical, outbursts of outrage, that keep me posting

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[Adrius ADI Manthays]

Sry but i don't really understand. Why few of Peoples want 3rd View and can't accept the Cockpit View. And End the conversation and concentrate for importants things in MWO! We have enough 3rd Shooters without of Cockpits. The Great of all MW Games are for me the Cockpit Atmosphere with her difficulty level! And now we have MWO with big potentiality for the Future. To have a Cool BattleTech with Simulation Part. Why is so Difficult to Understand after this BIG Discussion here and few of Answer. MWO are projected more as a BattleTech PC Simulation!

THE 3rd Arcade View is not a Part of MWO, and this Arcade Feature ruined the MWO Battle Atmosphere!

But okay let's do this and for Next please put the Gundam Wings of my Mech! and i forget a one all inclusive button feature for the smartphone to control the Mech of the Battlefield. Let's us ruined with Arcade Features the MWO and after few of Months. We bash MWO in the Trash can!

rgr&out

Edited by Adrak Manta, 02 February 2013 - 04:52 PM.

[Sedit]

Zerstorer Stallin, on 01 February 2013 - 05:42 PM, said:

The only way to vote here is with our money. 90% of the people in the forums say no. Let me be clear: the day 3rd person view becomes an option for MWO battles will be the last day I play.

I agree

[Rejarial Galatan]

WinningOne, on 02 February 2013 - 05:40 AM, said:

I had a few paragraphs written up but I just couldn't post them. Your comments are so ridiculous they don't deserve a serious reply. Litigation? Really? You'd look real clever in court complaining about how PGI made changes to a game in Beta testing meanwhile posting about how you yourself like to alter the gamefiles. You guys are completely crazy.

the court would laugh at you and PGI for claiming a Free To Play Title is still in beta at this stage when they are having customers pay micro transactions for various goods and services, as well as the fact that, this game will forever <unless PGI changes business models> be free to download and install. They are making revenue off of us, which makes the title Launched. Also, it is no joke that they could take fire from the courts for deceptive and or misleading advertising under the Truth In Advertising for declaring and maintaining declarations of the intent to have this a first person perspective game. A number of players <not a small number mind you> paid monies into PGI under the assumption based on THEIR declarations and advertisements that this would be a First Person Only game. Players who would have otherwise NOT paid monies into PGI for Founders packages for example <based on what players have already said should they add 3rd person views they would leave> would leave and demand refunds. This is no joke, this could go to court should they do that. The law is quite clear on how it treats deceptive and misleading advertisements. They clearly state that all necessary and relevant information regarding a product must be made available to consumers so that may make a fully informed decision. This was not made possible to us to make a FULLY INFORMED decision at the time of the founders sale or even through the completion of the sale. The door is there for litigation.

You can call my post what ever you want, you can shroud yourself in the delusion that I am wrong all you wish, but, the law is clear, and they risk someone walking through the door of litigation on the Truth in advertising Laws, laws that are universally upheld the globe over.

[WinningOne]

Rejarial Galatan, on 02 February 2013 - 05:42 PM, said:

the court would laugh at you and PGI for claiming a Free To Play Title is still in beta at this stage when they are having customers pay micro transactions for various goods and services, as well as the fact that, this game will forever <unless PGI changes business models> be free to download and install. They are making revenue off of us, which makes the title Launched. Also, it is no joke that they could take fire from the courts for deceptive and or misleading advertising under the Truth In Advertising for declaring and maintaining declarations of the intent to have this a first person perspective game. A number of players <not a small number mind you> paid monies into PGI under the assumption based on THEIR declarations and advertisements that this would be a First Person Only game. Players who would have otherwise NOT paid monies into PGI for Founders packages for example <based on what players have already said should they add 3rd person views they would leave> would leave and demand refunds. This is no joke, this could go to court should they do that. The law is quite clear on how it treats deceptive and misleading advertisements. They clearly state that all necessary and relevant information regarding a product must be made available to consumers so that may make a fully informed decision. This was not made possible to us to make a FULLY INFORMED decision at the time of the founders sale or even through the completion of the sale. The door is there for litigation.

You can call my post what ever you want, you can shroud yourself in the delusion that I am wrong all you wish, but, the law is clear, and they risk someone walking through the door of litigation on the Truth in advertising Laws, laws that are universally upheld the globe over.

Would you please link the quote where PGI said this would be a "first person only" game as you described? I'm completely willing to side with you if you can find an official statement from PGI that MWO would be "first person only". I would still think not adding 3PV is a bad idea, but if they've put their foot in their mouth that way, then I guess that's unfortunate. So, just get me any kind of official quote from PGI stating MWO would be "first person only".

[MWHawke]

Coolant, on 02 February 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

geez, really? Have you scanned the rest of the thread for reasons of a lopsized poll or you just looked at the poll numbers without taking the time to consider the arguments against and are short-sighted? You sound like just another purist that wants to keep the user-base small and niche, rigid, never willing to compromise on anything even though there is a vast potential player base in the 3rd Person Shooter genre? Oh wait, you wouldn't have to compromise on anything, because the way it's been described you would never have to play against a person using 3rd Person. And, you are unwilling to come to terms with the fact that other Mechwarrior titles had 3rd Person and were more popular than 1st Person only in said games, and that the votes against 3rd Person are a very small percentage of the # of registered users, of which, the vast majority haven't bothered to post or vote. Not to mention what the poll might look like on a popular 3rd Person Shooter site to gauge interest in playing MWO if it remained strictly 1st Person only without a 3rd Person Option...

You know, I'm really not that big of an advocate for 3rd Person. I would prefer that the option was in MWO, but I can play 1st person or 3rd person and did in Mercs. But, it's the irrational, illogical, outbursts of outrage, that keep me posting

There's no point scanning the thread. The poll speaks for itself. If there are so many people on the thread voting FOR 1st person, then why doesn't the poll show it? There were so many polls on this and all of them voted no. How hard is that to understand? If people posted on the thread, then you would expect them to vote for 3rd person right?

What is illogical is the fact that people still argue AGAINST a poll that so clearly speaks for itself. So, who is being illogical?

[Cannibal Cat]

LumberJack, on 16 November 2012 - 03:15 PM, said:

To hell with 3rd-person view. When do we get a rear view and rear-mounted guns?

^ what he said! ^

... and let's not forget downward view for death-from-above attacks!

[MWHawke]

And to judge a SPECIFIC game based on a GENERAL market study? Great way to make a point. In that case, then EVERY game should be the same. Logical isn't it? Since the market likes only ONE type of game, then it is PURELY ILLOGICAL to create other types of games.

Cannibal Cat, on 02 February 2013 - 06:42 PM, said:

^ what he said! ^

... and let's not forget downward view for death-from-above attacks!

I want weapons between my legs in that case!! xD

[Rejarial Galatan]

WinningOne, on 02 February 2013 - 06:33 PM, said:

Would you please link the quote where PGI said this would be a "first person only" game as you described? I'm completely willing to side with you if you can find an official statement from PGI that MWO would be "first person only". I would still think not adding 3PV is a bad idea, but if they've put their foot in their mouth that way, then I guess that's unfortunate. So, just get me any kind of official quote from PGI stating MWO would be "first person only".

firstly go to mwomercs.com/game scroll down, bottom paragraph, first sentence under How Does Game Play Work:
MechWarrior: Online is designed to put you, the player in A FIRST PERSON, tactical.... it goes on to describe other features. BUT, bold, italic and underlined is what matters for this.

Next is from Lead Designer Paul Inouye stating the fact 1st Person is a KEY DESIGN PILLAR and that 3rd person breaches that KEY DESIGN PILLAR ON MULTIPLE LEVELS. Now, just so you do not think I pulling this out of my backside:


Posted 17 July 2012 - 12:36 PM

POPULAR


MechWarrior Online is being designed to put you the player in the seat of the pilot. It is 100% first person view only. Being the pilot is one of our key design pillars and 3rd person breaks that pillar on multiple levels as seen in many of the other 3rd Person discussions.

We will investigate 3rd person in the far off distance for special game settings, but this is very far off in the distance.

While we appreciate those who enjoy 3rd person, MWO will be 1st person out of the gate and in the near future.

-Paul
Lead Designer


Also, just so you think I pulled THAT out of my backside, enjoy the link: http://mwomercs.com/...__fromsearch__1
So, this is blatant enough. THIS right here is what matters.
So, in summation:
100% First Person Only, Key Design Pillar is 100% First Person Only, Advertised as FIRST PERSON, special setting in the FAR DISTANT FUTURE <could be pointing at a training ground>. This is the door they made. They walk through it, THAT is when they can get slammed. But take very careful note of 100% First Person ONLY, and no other mention of 3rd person anywhere in the NON forum setting.

Edited by Rejarial Galatan, 02 February 2013 - 07:07 PM.

[WinningOne]

Rejarial Galatan, on 02 February 2013 - 07:04 PM, said:

firstly go to mwomercs.com/game scroll down, bottom paragraph, first sentence under How Does Game Play Work:
MechWarrior: Online is designed to put you, the player in A FIRST PERSON, tactical.... it goes on to describe other features. BUT, bold, italic and underlined is what matters for this.

Next is from Lead Designer Paul Inouye stating the fact 1st Person is a KEY DESIGN PILLAR and that 3rd person breaches that KEY DESIGN PILLAR ON MULTIPLE LEVELS. Now, just so you do not think I pulling this out of my backside:


Posted 17 July 2012 - 12:36 PM

POPULAR


MechWarrior Online is being designed to put you the player in the seat of the pilot. It is 100% first person view only. Being the pilot is one of our key design pillars and 3rd person breaks that pillar on multiple levels as seen in many of the other 3rd Person discussions.

We will investigate 3rd person in the far off distance for special game settings, but this is very far off in the distance.

While we appreciate those who enjoy 3rd person, MWO will be 1st person out of the gate and in the near future.

-Paul
Lead Designer


Also, just so you think I pulled THAT out of my backside, enjoy the link: http://mwomercs.com/...__fromsearch__1
So, this is blatant enough. THIS right here is what matters.
So, in summation:
100% First Person Only, Key Design Pillar is 100% First Person Only, Advertised as FIRST PERSON, special setting in the FAR DISTANT FUTURE <could be pointing at a training ground>. This is the door they made. They walk through it, THAT is when they can get slammed. But take very careful note of 100% First Person ONLY, and no other mention of 3rd person anywhere in the NON forum setting.

Um.....He says in the quote they would investigate it for the future. It's literally right there in your post. Do you see it? Right there. In your actual post. I'm not sure how you don't see it but it's right there. He openly warned you they would be taking a look at it. No....Seriously....It's right there. Who knows when they'll actually start doing it but the heads up, the information, the FYI, the warning, the prophesy, the advance notice is LITERALLY right there. You're just.....like.....I don't know how too.....it's actually in your................I just............wow.

[Dagaz]

WinningOne, on 02 February 2013 - 06:33 PM, said:

Would you please link the quote where PGI said this would be a "first person only" game as you described? I'm completely willing to side with you if you can find an official statement from PGI that MWO would be "first person only". I would still think not adding 3PV is a bad idea, but if they've put their foot in their mouth that way, then I guess that's unfortunate. So, just get me any kind of official quote from PGI stating MWO would be "first person only".

source: http://mwomercs.com/game

How does gameplay work?
MechWarrior Online puts MechWarriors into a first-person, team-based, tactical battlefield where the victors swim in the spoils of war and are rewarded with the almighty C-Bill (in-game currency).

edit: deleted color

While it may not say 1st person only it is advertised as a 1st person game with no mention at all anywhere of a 3PV.

Edited by Dagaz, 02 February 2013 - 09:39 PM.

[PlzDie]

WinningOne, on 02 February 2013 - 08:45 PM, said:

Um.....He says in the quote they would investigate it for the future. It's literally right there in your post. Do you see it? Right there. In your actual post. I'm not sure how you don't see it but it's right there. He openly warned you they would be taking a look at it. No....Seriously....It's right there. Who knows when they'll actually start doing it but the heads up, the information, the FYI, the warning, the prophesy, the advance notice is LITERALLY right there. You're just.....like.....I don't know how too.....it's actually in your................I just............wow.

And you are accusing me of trolling.

[WinningOne]

Dagaz, on 02 February 2013 - 09:38 PM, said:

source: http://mwomercs.com/game

How does gameplay work?
MechWarrior Online puts MechWarriors into a first-person, team-based, tactical battlefield where the victors swim in the spoils of war and are rewarded with the almighty C-Bill (in-game currency).

edit: deleted color

While it may not say 1st person only it is advertised as a 1st person game with no mention at all anywhere of a 3PV.

Hmm, you're right. There is definitely nothing in that statement about never adding 3PV to the game. Good catch. You know what else caught my eye. That comment about it being team based. Oh sure, at the beginning of the match it's team based but what about when I'm the last one alive. How is PGI keeping their promise about me being on a team if everyone is dead and I'm alone on the field? They never said I'd be alone.

Duppie1974, on 02 February 2013 - 10:10 PM, said:

And you are accusing me of trolling.

You must not see it either. Seriously, it's in there.

[MWHawke]

WinningOne, on 02 February 2013 - 10:45 PM, said:

Hmm, you're right. There is definitely nothing in that statement about never adding 3PV to the game. Good catch. You know what else caught my eye. That comment about it being team based. Oh sure, at the beginning of the match it's team based but what about when I'm the last one alive. How is PGI keeping their promise about me being on a team if everyone is dead and I'm alone on the field? They never said I'd be alone.

How could you??!? You need to be a team player and die like all the others!!!

*gives single-bullet pistol to pilot*

[MW Waldorf Statler]

StORmTrAin, on 01 February 2013 - 02:43 PM, said:

I didn't buy a first person shooter, I bought MWO. Perspective didn't ruin MW4, no new content ruined MW4, it stagnated, then it died.

Anyone who didn't read the forums before hand would have naturally assumed that it would have a 3PV option. Just like its brother MW4; which was huge. I was shocked when I read before game release that 3PV would not be played. Literally shocked.

There are many 3PV players who play for the love of the game, not the view, these are the true mechwarriors. I am one. 1PV isn't my favorite POV, but I don't allow it to ruin the game for me, because I love Mechwarrior. I love the way the mechs move, I love the way the weapons look when they fire and hit, I love the way the mechs look and I enjoy looking at them, all of them, I like to zoom in on my team mates cockpit and try to see if i can see them inside, I like to zoom in on their mech too where I can appreciate the detail and the hard work that went into the game design. There is so much that I enjoy about mechwarrior I cannot let POV ruin it for me. I AM a Mechwarrior.


You posess true wisdom!

unlike Pando or WinningOne with which a discussion is leading to safe sensible and sophisticated, I think they are a narcissistic little troll who has no social skills and wants to forcibly impose its idea UDN is not interested in the opinion of other people's . I hope that PGI is a reasonable way to introduce 3PV, eg a camera drone to straight people as they do not like find at MWO, because it's people like you that each use (not even abiding by) means to win and confirms their sick craving to see and leave any discussion to become a flamewar. What an individual they are, we see the fact that they vote their own posts ...



Yes StormyTrain because it 3PV is love, and all that was banned 3PV on many BF3 servers and MW4 (MBO League) use ignore you, of course, because it UDN in WOW now pandas are also all love this and want to have

I can not remember the closed beta where all dealt respectfully with Single core, it and all the flamewars not were, now is the forum troll territory ... No Premades, no ECM, weapon balance ... I do not want anyone on the battlefield that's better than me ... I want single player ..
on the battlefield, it does not look different, more and more people who disconnects when they risk losing, Botfarmer & AFKler.Der purest kindergarten that is the clientele that is attracted to 3VP, all the little Storm Trains and people want to play WoW with pandas

for a proper survey it would be best that each of the longer plays, log before after 50 game (mayflies should already be excluded) would vote for or against 3PV

translated from german

im Gegensatz zu Pando oder WinningOne, mit denen eine Diskussion sicher vernünftig und niveauvoll zu führen ist, halte ich sie für einen selbstverliebten kleinen Troll, der keinerlei soziale Fähigkeiten besitzt und gewaltsam seine Vorstellung durchsetzen will udn gar nicht an der Meinung anderer Leute interessiert ist.Ich hoffe,dass PGI einen vernünftigen weg findet ,die 3PV einzuführen, zb als Kameradrohne, damit gerade Leute wie sie nicht gefallen an MWO finden ,denn es sind Leute wie sie, die jedes (auch nicht regelkonformes) Mittel einsetzen ,um zu gewinnen und ihre kranke Geltungssucht bestätigt zu sehen und jede Diskussion zu einem Flamewar werden lassen. Was für ein Individuum sie sind, sieht man daran, dass sie ihre eigenen Beiträge voten...

Yes Stromtrain, weil es 3PV gibt ,lieben und nutzen es alle , das 3PV auf vielen BF3 und MW4 Servern ( MBO Liga) gebannt war ignorierst du natürlich,udn weil es in WOW jetzt Pandas gibt, lieben auch alle diese und wollen diese haben

Ich kann mich an die closed Beta erinnern,wo alle respektvoll miteinader umgegangen sind, udn es all die Flamewars nicht gab, jetzt ist das Forum ein Trollgebiet ...No Premades,No ECM ,Waffenbalance ...ich will niemanden auf dem Schlachtfeld, der besser ist als ich ...ich will Singleplayer ..
auf dem Schlachtfeld sieht es nicht anders aus, immer mehr Leute die disconnecten ,wenn sie zu verlieren drohen, Botfarmer & AFKler.
Der reinste Kindergarten , dass ist die Klientel ,welche mit 3VP angezogen wird, all die kleinen StormTrains und Leute die in WoW mit Pandas spielen wollen

für eine richtige Umfrage wäre es am besten ,dass jeder der länger spielt, vor dem einloggen nach dem 50 Spiel (Eintagsfliegen sollten schon ausgeklammert werden) für oder gegen 3PV voten müsste

Edited by CSJ Ranger, 03 February 2013 - 01:01 AM.