2926 replies to this topic

[Terran123rd]

Yet it is. End Of Story.

[Mr Blonde]

I have yet to see one positive post from an actual player who wants 3rd person view. Can anyone produce such a post? I've seen thousands against, and I raise my voice in agreement. I tried World of Tanks, and it took me about 5 minutes to realize it blows. I found that 3rd person view was a big factor in its suckiness. I suppose I'll deal with it the best I can, if it goes down like I and most other people suspect then there are other things to do with my time. I've seen this sort of propaganda before in other arenas, where we are told that the polls and public opinion say "X", and nobody can produce any evidence of it, when the people are saying "Y" and are ignored. It probably won't end well.

[GetinmyBellah]

Well, Mr. Blonde, it actually cuts deeper. I've heard a lot of closed beta testers, whom I was apart of tell me that they specifically said this game will be 1st person point of view ONLY. Now I guess they want to try and appeal to esports come CW is my only perception as to why they're really implementing 3rd person. Which sucks...

I'll be awaiting those statistics until Christmas if necessary, Garth

[Grimmnyr]

PGI, please settle the debate once and for all and just add a poll to the launcher, so that everyone who logs in has to answer Yes, or No to 3PV in MWO. Make is so you can only vote once per account / IP and display the results here on the forums and put links to the results on as many other social media sites as your heart's content.

[Moromillas]

CyBerkut, on 03 May 2013 - 02:08 PM, said:

Hmmm... How's that working out for you so far?

That's the funny thing about posting in a thread that you want to see die... it prompts people to respond to you, and the thread continues to live.

Of course, you could just quit reading it. At least then, it would be 'dead' to you. But no... you apparently wish to impose your will on the other thread participants. It doesn't appear that is going to work.

PGI could possibly do something meaningful to quell the concerns being voiced in here. Your posts, on the other hand, do not seem to have the necessary ingredients.

You're right of course. However, how is one supposed to not respond to this thread, I mean, look at it. It's gone from one absurdity to the next. First the general concern that 3PV will be exploitable, which is fair enough. Then it's straight on to doomsaying, and conspiracy theories where Piranha is involved in a forum cover-up. What? Now there's even players admitting that they just don't want certain types of players to be able to play the game. Yeah, I do think it's time the discussion ended. When you sail straight out of normal town, and into conspiracy land, the only place the discussion can go is to the loony bin.

[Mr Blonde]

I don't know anything about a coverup, but I do recall seeing a post where the devs said the game would never have 3rd person. I know circumstances change, but the vast majority of player opinion is against this being in there, so breaking your word to implement an unpopular change seems counterproductive. There's no question it will be exploitable and change the game. Their solution of splitting people by POV is absurd on its face, it's a self-inflicted wound. Maybe they have numbers and stats I don't have access to, a huge mass of pimple-faced 3rd person fanatics just itching to see it implemented, and angrily remaining in complete silence so we can't detect their legions. That is serious discipline, obviously we can't compete.

Ed Steele, on 03 May 2013 - 09:13 PM, said:

PGI, please settle the debate once and for all and just add a poll to the launcher, so that everyone who logs in has to answer Yes, or No to 3PV in MWO. Make is so you can only vote once per account / IP and display the results here on the forums and put links to the results on as many other social media sites as your heart's content.

Ed Steele, sad to say you'll never see that poll because the results won't be consistent with the pre-determined outcome. The discussion is truly over, as Moromillas indicates; the fact that they don't flatly deny it means that it will be in. They are just trying to figure out the best way to convince the community that a little jelly will make that **** sandwich taste good.

[Hotthedd]

Target Rich, on 15 April 2013 - 05:40 AM, said:

Wow....lets see some basic market demographics here...
This game requires CryEngine 3...and only play on Desktop and Laptop PC's that have serious graphic card capability....Market reduced to 30-40 percent of PC base.

Game has a huge learning curve...and fundamentally discourages new players because the concept of "earning" your basic units is the exact opposite of any other MMP game out there and the opposite of any previous MW game....Market reduced to 30 percent of remaining 30-40 percent of PC base.

Game has a first person shooter view requirement...just like other games...which most players absolutely HATE....that's why all successful FPS games have third person view...Market reduced to 30 percent of remaining 5-10 percent of PC market...

Current game is perfect for obsessive compulsive mecha fanatics...who buy all kinds of stupid equipment...are willing to pay litereally hundreds of dollars in extra equipment like game mouses..obsolete joysticks...etc....and engage in some fairly substantial coding to get said equipment...plus pay beacoup money...like a hundred bucks or so just to get that competitive edge in a beta.

Oh...btw...I have been playing MW since the pen and paper days of the 1970's I have beta tested MW3, MW4, MC1 and MC2 and Played Chromehounds (MW5) until they closed the server on us.

Not ONE SINGLE MECHA GAME HAS EVER HAD COCKPIT MODE EXCLUSIVELY...because it is a seriously stupid way to play.

I have no problem with a matching engine that enables the ultra obsessive mech simulation people to don their tin foil hats and take their hundreds and thousands dollars of add on computer equipment and thousands of dollars in high end multi screen graphic work stations ...and have their fun...BUT

I GET SERIOUSLY OFFENDED by these kind of fools waxing eloquent about the "purity" of their style of play...

This game is based on battletech....I've red the novels...played the pen and paper game....

If you're goal is to simulate the true battletech piloting experience...then the current cockpit view is the OPPOSITE of battletech. A pilot in a battletech mech puts on a neurohelmet...his nervious system is directly linked to the mech and its sensors...it in essense becomes his body.... That is a 360 degree view...and probably best simulated by a 3rd person viewpoint...

The current mickey mouse viewpoint that is restricted by a forward view out of a slow moving cockpit window...is more like a ww2 tank than battletech...or a fighter plane...although they have better vision capability than we see in MWO.

Have the decency to admit your arrogance...there are many styles of playing a fps....which this game is NOT supposed to simulate.... Instead...this is SUPPOSED to be both tactical and commander view...like MW4 there should be the capability for a unit team to be able to easily highlight capture points and give orders....of course this subsumes a turnkey voice communication with the game...which is why Microsoft ported the whole franchise over to the XBOX 360 in the first place...

So to quote Hamlet "There is more in heaven and earth, my dear Horatio, than is contained in your philosophy..."

So, I have to ask. You see yourself walking around IRL from a 3rd person view? Where exactly do you get your pharmaceuticals? Can I haz some?

[CyBerkut]

Ph30nix, on 03 May 2013 - 02:18 PM, said:

i realized the other day (might have been mentioned) one very very big balance issue with allowing 3rd person view

mechs with arms that move in any directly can actually aim farther then they are able to see either above (most common) or to the sides (commando good example)

if you let people use third person they will have a much less restricted view when it comes to attacking and aiming that players in first person view will not be able to touch.

That is an interesting observation.

[CyBerkut]

FupDup, on 03 May 2013 - 06:31 PM, said:

Quote

HarmAssassin, on 03 May 2013 - 09:36 PM, said:

3rd person view will kill this game. If it ever gets into regular game-play, I'm gone.

Then I'm sure you're going to love this quote from Ask The Devs #37:

Quote

Bryan Ekman, on 03 May 2013 - 05:53 PM, said:

Gremlich Johns: When the CW mode is implemented, will it be 1st Person View only?
A: We haven’t decided on the final format. Both 3^rd and 1^st person will be available options, however we have yet to confirm how one or the other will be selected for specific scenarios, like Merc Corp vs Merc Corp.

<Sigh> The only (ever so slightly) hopeful part of that was, "We haven’t decided on the final format."

However... it would seem the implications are:

- There will not be separate CW universes for 1PV and 3PV players.
- 3PV will be available in CW at least in some cases.

So, that still leaves the scenario... Planet X is being attacked by Team A that prefers 3PV, and defended by Team B that prefers 1PV.

If the Devs were to abide by their word [Yeah, I know...], (That 1PV players would never have to play against 3PV players), then Team A should have to suck it up and play in 1PV.

I'm not holding my breath waiting for that to happen...

[GetinmyBellah]

What also gets me is I have spent over $200 on MW:O and had I known they would negate their own words set in stone, apparently not, then I wouldn't have spent nearly as much money, not to mention time and energy invested in this game. If you believe that everything will be cool and your player base will still expand when you lie to them... well, just take a look around. There are plenty of promising titles that have "gone with the wind" because they listened a very small percentage of players on their forums and, or social media outlets.

Until I see said statistics I will not spend another dime on this game.

Quote

[color=#959595]Alrighty then, could you please, Garth, provide us with statistics of how many active players there are, and how many "contacted" you good folks concerning third person view. That's something I'd be interested in seeing, because I know the percentage of people that actually voice their opinions through your web site or social media is very small, when compared to that of the actual active player base. Steam provides these statistics and I dare PGI to do the same.[/color]

[Grimmnyr]

Mr Blonde, on 04 May 2013 - 04:14 AM, said:

I don't know anything about a coverup, but I do recall seeing a post where the devs said the game would never have 3rd person. I know circumstances change, but the vast majority of player opinion is against this being in there, so breaking your word to implement an unpopular change seems counterproductive. There's no question it will be exploitable and change the game. Their solution of splitting people by POV is absurd on its face, it's a self-inflicted wound. Maybe they have numbers and stats I don't have access to, a huge mass of pimple-faced 3rd person fanatics just itching to see it implemented, and angrily remaining in complete silence so we can't detect their legions. That is serious discipline, obviously we can't compete.




Ed Steele, sad to say you'll never see that poll because the results won't be consistent with the pre-determined outcome. The discussion is truly over, as Moromillas indicates; the fact that they don't flatly deny it means that it will be in. They are just trying to figure out the best way to convince the community that a little jelly will make that **** sandwich taste good.

If 3PV is implemented in a way that it is unavoidable, then PGI will fatally split the community as they have stated time and time again, that they do not want to. This game was advertised as a first-person game and should stay that way. 3PV will change MWO into a game that is not MWO. I have paid real money on MC, because I am a long-time Battletech and Mechwarrior fan and I like the "simulator" feel that first person gives you. I am tired of all the people who want this game to be something other than what it was marketed as, trying to change it into Hawken, or just another FPS with mech skins.

Edited by Ed Steele, 04 May 2013 - 04:06 PM.

[KableGuy]

I do believe this horse is not only dead but was long ago carted off to the glue factory and is being scarfed down by some fat kid 4 Year old that thinks his paste stick is a vanilla ice cream cone.

[M i s t y]

How about you fix all the bugs first , before you add this stupid crap . this game is a first person shooter not a 3rd person shooter
if you want 3rd person view get a console they have heaps of that stupid crap in there games . )

[Grimmnyr]

Loc Nar, on 03 May 2013 - 03:55 PM, said:

Since NGNG was kind enough to post Bryan's Twitter post to reddit, I figured the people on the MWO forum might also want to know what is going on in their game with hot topic issues like 3rd person view so am reposting it here in an attempt to keep you guys in the loop...

https://twitter.com/...344465329954816

Maybe PGI should hire you, since you are doing their PR for them.

HarmAssassin, on 03 May 2013 - 05:36 PM, said:

Here's the problem with allowing 3rd person view in testing grounds. The easiest way to get a hack working, is to take an existing feature that's simply not turned on in certain portions of the game, and turn it on always.

if 3rd person is in the testing grounds, it won't be long before the script-kiddies find a way to turn it on even when not in the testing ground.

3rd person view will kill this game. If it ever gets into regular game-play, I'm gone.

I can live with it as long as there are separate queues, but if I am forced to play against people with 3PV, I am gone and my money with me. And no, a "vote before each game" system is not a good compromise, all it would do is force people to play a mode that they do not want to if their side loses the vote.

[S1lent0ne]

Easy fix - put a poll in game. Make the results fully public. If the players really want it then it should be overwhelmingly obvious.

Somehow, though, I think that after 116 pages of NO we know the real answer. Listen to the players. Do not kowtow to esports. Outside of the Asian market it just isn't going to fly.

[Sam Slade]

S1lent0ne, on 07 May 2013 - 01:56 AM, said:

. Do not kowtow to esports. Outside of the Asian market it just isn't going to fly.

Actually, speaking as one who spends a good deal of time in the Asian market, 3PV will not be that popular. Outside of Pay 2 Win hard games are easily the most popular.

[Ph30nix]

this whole thing really sounds like some "genius" (note the sarscasm i really mean completely clueless ignorant and mentally deficient) Suit, Executive or general higher up at IGP got the idea that implementing 3PV would get them alot more money and PGI was told to make it happen no matter what and as is typical with ******** bosses anymore they wont listen to anything except their bad ideas because they think it will generate $$$$.

Then when it has the exact opposite effect they will blame and fire someone else but we will still be stuck with 3PV because their short attention span has already moved onto something else.

[MWHawke]

Rattlehead NZ, on 24 April 2013 - 09:50 AM, said:

I do love this game, but im having a hard time keeping all my friends playing as they are sick and tired of all the changes that weren't meant to happen and the increasing bugs.

Just add the Halo physics if they cannot control the legs separate from the torso. It turns where you look so their torso would turn but the legs would always line up. Or the best idea is to add a key that will center your legs with your torso!!!! ..... oh wait we already have that and still we need 3rd person?

That and two triangles RIGHT IN CENTER TOP of the freaking screen that shows torso-leg alignment. I wonder what type of people need a view from behind them to learn to walk. Guess their parents put 2 mirrors front and back so that they could see 3PV when they started to walk.

[Gremlich Johns]

The game should be played only with a joystick that has torso twist and the keyboard or gamepad like the Nostromo.

With a joystick, I don't have any problems walking, maneuvering or shooting any Mechwarrior based game. It's the inability to figure out how to do torso twist and turn left/right with the mouse that is confusing new players. It isn't that the game is so difficult that 3PV MUST be implemented, the game isn't intended to only be played with a mouse. Crysis with a Joystick, never. But MW:O isn't Crysis. Crysis, and countless other games like it, should only be played with a Mouse/KB. I know f-loads of guys who have no problem in 1PV with mouse/KB.

All the noobs need is practice in the training grounds before they play the game. That or just cave and use a joystick.

[Alekzander Smirnoff]

When I played MW:4, I setup my controls (mouse to work torso, wsad to work legs) to work the exact same way they do in MW:O now. First game I played, I was like, holy ****, this is the way I setup my mechs to play in MW:4. I felt right at home.

As to 3PV, I don't really see it as necessary or useful, whats the point in looking over cover if you can't do anything about the mechs on the other side if you only have line of sight locking/targeting in 1PV anyway. Locking in 3PV over a hill for example would be massively overpowered.