2926 replies to this topic

[Col Forbin]

I'm really disappointed that they are wasting time talking about this 3rd person crap, when they haven't gotten matchmaking fixed. or new maps. or new game mode. or custom paint jobs. le sigh

[Wizard Steve]

Seriously, how many games does it take to "get" how torso twist and throttle works?

We'll be having a training mode to teach new users which way around to sit on a toilet seat next.

[FLes]

I don't know how can they at PGI not be ashamed of even thinking of adding third person as a default view, insted of making a simple training map (not that I think any of that is necessary). After all that crap about design pillars.

[hurleybird]

• New players will benefit from seeing how torso twist and throttle work from the outside. This reduces new user friction and gets them into the game faster, with less frustration.

New players would benefit from a tutorial, as well as better feedback from the 1st person perspective. My suggestion is a dotted line on the ground that represents where your feet are pointing.

[FLes]

hurleybird, on 20 November 2012 - 01:46 PM, said:

(...).
New players would benefit from a tutorial, as well as better feedback from the 1st person perspective. My suggestion is a dotted line on the ground that represents where your feet are pointing.

That's an interesting idea, haven't heard that one before.

After so many suggestions from players on how to help those who find it mentally very challenging to figure out how torso and legs work, PGI still insists on the solution that more than 90% of people here are against. Beyond me.

Edited by FLes, 20 November 2012 - 01:52 PM.

[Wired]

Yea, that post from Brian is VERY Concerning at this point... They're actually having a sitdown meeting and discussing how to implement it into the game.

Even having it in there that way, splitting it up between people who have it and people who don't, is going to have a HUGE negative impact on the end goal of this product, the community warfare.

PGI needs to take a second look at their community warfare and give us a better idea of what it is going to be like, because so far the changes they are looking into such as phase 2 segregation of PUG and Premade as well as a further separation between allowed views, makes that final goal all that much harder to obtain.

[Krellek]

Diffedge, on 20 November 2012 - 08:21 AM, said:

So in other words, dont adopt the better system but lets teach them how to use the worse system.

I've been reading your posts and it took me a long time to figure out you were actually being serious. Since it seems you have NO idea what you're talking about I will explain things for you.

FIRST

PGI IS NOT working on 3rd person view. They stated they will be looking into various things and a take on a 3rd person view is one of those things.

SECOND

3rd person view, by nature in a FPS, gives distinct advantages. I won't go into them because they are all over these pages, but PGI already knows they exist which is why they said that they will be going with first person mode.

THIRD

You've stated 3rd person view is better and new players learning to fight in 1st person mode is the "worse" system. You haven't read a single Dev blog OR the MISSION STATEMENT of the company.

Go do 30 minutes of reading before typing a poor response to this.

So many fail people on the nets...

[Wired]

Krellek, on 20 November 2012 - 01:58 PM, said:

I've been reading your posts and it took me a long time to figure out you were actually being serious. Since it seems you have NO idea what you're talking about I will explain things for you.

FIRST

PGI IS NOT working on 3rd person view. They stated they will be looking into various things and a take on a 3rd person view is one of those things.

SECOND

3rd person view, by nature in a FPS, gives distinct advantages. I won't go into them because they are all over these pages, but PGI already knows they exist which is why they said that they will be going with first person mode.

THIRD

You've stated 3rd person view is better and new players learning to fight in 1st person mode is the "worse" system. You haven't read a single Dev blog OR the MISSION STATEMENT of the company.

Go do 30 minutes of reading before typing a poor response to this.

So many fail people on the nets...

To be honest, they're going back on the dev blog and mission statement of the company by considering 3rd person again this late in the development.

[AtomicFrawg]

This is the same road SWG went down. The producer not listening to its fan base.
1st combat upgrade then NGE. Followed shortly by the death of the servers. Then a total shutdown of SWG.

The update from Brian, that we all waited for, pretty much proves they do what they want. All the great Ideas in this thread went by the way side, which is very sad.

New player Training is what is needed, not the band aid of 3rd person view.

With the New patch falling flat and the updated info on 3rd person, I am almost wishing I never spent a dime on MC.

[VampiroITA]

Do you want 3rd person view?
Then why not make also no heat, no ammo and no friendly fire? Just brawl...
That is waht make MW4 NBT great.
... or not?

[skamage]

PGI figuratively gives the middle finger to their player base when overwhelming numbers said stop wasting your time on something we don't want. We are the loyal fan base PGI, if you continue not listening then this game will die.

[Esk]

If the aim of 3rd person is to help people who really shouldn't need help tbh is well emm... anyway... ..

Introducing 3rd person to the game itself, will unless it is basically over the shoulder and really close up and fix'd just like the in cabin one (making it mostly pointless lol), it will give a tactical advantage to some and force most others into using it, no fluffy thinking will save you from that..
Yes you can limit the impact but i really doubt it wont happen like that.

Better solutions have been listed many times over, but my fix would be
1st : To add short tutorial missions on all aspects of piloting mechs,
2nd : A lock torso option
3rd : Something on the HUD showing alignment options
This is a really simple skill to learn, or should be or at least was when i started gaming, maybe things have changed that much, dunno tbf..

Now I-war2 will give you a challenge on rotational controle in combat for those intrested.
http://en.wikipedia....:_Edge_of_Chaos


Edit:

AtomicFrawg, on 20 November 2012 - 02:04 PM, said:

This is the same road SWG went down. The producer not listening to its fan base.
1st combat upgrade then NGE. Followed shortly by the death of the servers. Then a total shutdown of SWG.

The update from Brian, that we all waited for, pretty much proves they do what they want. All the great Ideas in this thread went by the way side, which is very sad.

lol shortly? How many times did you get TP'd out of corellia while protesting before you got a weeks ban, followed shortly after when you went forum warrior on them having your accounts with a 1 week forum ban too lol...,
But yeah, that was the most epic way I've ever seen to kill a game

But aye, this is one of those kind of moments, I'm not sure it'll kill the game but it'll change it a lot and imo, pull in a lot less people then it will push off.

Edited by Esk, 21 November 2012 - 01:12 AM.

[ManDaisy]

Its disturbing that they insist on pushing this thru rather then work on anything important such a decent tutorial. 3rd person default is rather disturbing tho. 3rd persond default basically equals 3rd person becomming view the game will be built around. Good-bye realism, hello mech assault, hello mechwarrior 4.

Edited by ManDaisy, 20 November 2012 - 02:44 PM.

[Adrian Wolf]

Are you serious? What the "3p"? Noobs can't deal with controls? Then add "training mode", without C-bills and Exp, or allow 3p only on trial mechs. Or add it as module...
If not so - R.I.P., MWO...

[von Pilsner]

The Evolution of 3rd person









Polling

Edited by von Pilsner, 20 November 2012 - 02:50 PM.

[AtomicFrawg]

Esk, on 20 November 2012 - 02:29 PM, said:

If the aim of 3rd person is to help people who really shouldn't need help tbh is well emm... anyway... ..

Introducing 3rd person to the game itself, will unless it is basically over the shoulder and really close up and fix'd just like the in cabin one (making it mostly pointless lol), it will give a tactical advantage to some and force most others into using it, no fluffy thinking will save you from that..
Yes you can limit the impact but i really doubt it wont happen like that.

Better solutions have been listed many times over, but my fix would be
1st : To add short tutorial missions on all aspects of piloting mechs,
2nd : A lock torso option
3rd : Something on the HUD showing alignment options
This is a really simple skill to learn, or should be or at least was when i started gaming, maybe things have changed that much, dunno tbf..

Now I-war2 will give you a challenge on rotational controle in combat for those intrested.
http://en.wikipedia....:_Edge_of_Chaos


Edit:


lol shortly? How many times did you get TP'd out of corellia while protesting before you got a weeks ban, followed shortly ater you went forum warrior on them having your accounts with a 1 week forum bad too lol...,
But yeah, that was the most epic way I've ever seen to kill a game

But aye, this is one of those kind of moments, I'm not sure it'll kill the game but it'll change it a lot and imo, pull in a lot less people then it will push off.

Yep, And the thing that made SWG so great was the way you could build your class and crafting. You had to put on your thinking cap on most of the time. I guess that proved to much for mouth breathers. Sadly........
And I remember what their excuse was for the change. A panel of guild leaders at the SWG SOE convention said they wanted NGE..... Riiiigggghhhhttttt.
LOL In fact NGE was added so SOE's Presidents 7 years old daughter, and new players, could play the game easier.

Hint: It did not work out so well.

[Egomane]

FactorlanP, on 20 November 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

I don't know about you guys, but this post from Bryan does nothing to address most of the concerns..

I need to agree! Everything he wrote, we already speculated about. We even adressed the concerns he mentioned.
If they don't find a way to adress those concerns, and there is no way they could, 3rd person view will imbalance the game and its community.

So please PGI, stop putting ressources into it and get back to the problems at hand. Even thinking about it is a waste of time you could spend on something more productive.

Edited by Egomane, 20 November 2012 - 03:23 PM.

[RiffWrath]

Let MWO be what it is. Stop listening to those who want to make MWO into a game they are already playing.

MWO is a sim. If you must permit 3rd pv (for the finanincial support, for instance), then I suppose setting up seperate matches would be an acceptable solution. This might make the game more appealing for those desiring a more arcade-like experience.

Otherwise, things seem to be coming along well. I am excited about this game and the community forming up around it. I look forward to each new patch and future developements.

Stay true.

[Silverlance]

Loc Nar, on 16 November 2012 - 03:16 PM, said:

3rd Person view would be fine as an option in a shooting range/arena for learning to drive mechs and/or testing new loadouts and would actually be kinda swell. Here's a recap of my idea on a simple way to make it work for everyone:

New players can be allotted a set amount of default time on the shooting range/arena so they can come to terms with mech driving before they're getting shot at, and buying a new mech could come with a little range time too. Beyond those allotted amounts, shooting range/arena time could be purchased with MC, and range ammo can be sold too for that matter...

1) This allows new players to figure out how to drive and shoot, including utilizing 3rd person for their orientation process.
2) It provides a solid start of a training grounds scenario.
3) Provides enough funding to justify the server space, even if people camp there
4) Satisfies the need to ease new players, without dividing the existing ranks

However when drop time comes, the training wheels come off...

-Loc Nar

Now this. This I like. I like it a lot. Keep third person for training purposes only. Don't include it for actual drops. Mech to Mech combat isn't about perspectives and point of views. You're sitting in a cockpit pitting skill against skill. Giving 3rd person advantage destroys that.

[Squidhead Jax]

FactorlanP, on 20 November 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

And now we have a post from Bryan

• [color=#959595]3rd person would be default or there will be a prompt for new players to select their view point.[/color]

The source post has "could". I'm not sure if the big boys get to suppress edit notices, it was changed within the (pretty narrow) window, or this was actively edited. If the latter, it unnecessarily undermines our position, and you should feel bad.

Even with "could" that would basically throw 1st person under a bus as a so-called 'pillar' of gameplay. That they're even considering 3rd person is disappointing, but that they're considering making it the default mode makes me wonder what else they're 'considering' that they sold us Founders the opposite of.

Edited by Squidhead Jax, 20 November 2012 - 06:02 PM.