172 replies to this topic

[On1m]

I currently do about 60% premade drops. I like pugging though, it lets me see how good I really am or if it's just my team.

[Mr 144]

I hate polls like these because player habits change over time, so I'll ask this...

Closed Beta: 90% PuG rate (no TS...in game grouping only) ~2000 matches
Open Beta Up to Xmas 2012: 75% PuG rate (no TS..in game grouping only) ~1300 matches
Open Beta Xmas 2012-Current: 85% TS (with Voice) grouping ~700 matches

So...am I suppose to average my entire career to say that I PuG far more than group? Or should I represent my current behavior and say I almost always group? Where does the in-between Groups fall, that don't use 3rd party tools, but only borked in-game txt-based functions? All of these questions can skew the results any which way I choose, just by interpreting my own stats. I just can't give an accurate answer to these polls...it's to subjective.

Mr 144

Edited by Mr 144, 28 January 2013 - 09:08 PM.

[Jacmac]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 December 2012 - 09:19 AM, said:

SO WHICH IS IT?

Are Evil Pre-Mades REALLY ruining the game, or are you using Pre-Mades as an excuse for your own lack of skill or coordination?

You are tainting the poll with your obvious bias. There are no evil pre-mades. Nobody is using pre-mades as excuse for their lack of skill. Solo players are expressing frustration with being forced to fight against voice communicating teams of players. PGI knows there is a problem, I only hope they give the solo players a mode to play in so that this stupid 'debate' can end. No doubt most of the evil pre-mades hope and pray that PGI doesn't do anything to separate non-voice solo players from voice communicating teams so that they can continue to rack up easy XP, C-Bills, and stats.

[GalaxyBluestar]

my appearences in battle is random at best.

for the sake of my time balancing, i pug exclusively.

[Thirdstar]

Jacmac, on 28 January 2013 - 09:12 PM, said:

You are tainting the poll with your obvious bias. There are no evil pre-mades. Nobody is using pre-mades as excuse for their lack of skill. Solo players are expressing frustration with being forced to fight against voice communicating teams of players. PGI knows there is a problem, I only hope they give the solo players a mode to play in so that this stupid 'debate' can end. No doubt most of the evil pre-mades hope and pray that PGI doesn't do anything to separate non-voice solo players from voice communicating teams so that they can continue to rack up easy XP, C-Bills, and stats.

Didn't realize it was a necro. Wheeee.

So for late comers I got two quotes-

"I'd just like to point out if you drop in a match with only one premade group of four players, you have double the chance of being against the premade than with them, 4 slots open on premade side vs 8 on the other."

and

"I would like to throw in the argument that both groups of gamers have a different amount of playtime, that there are primetimes for PUG stomping by Premades and that there are different philosophys about fun.

I expect that Premades have a much higher average playtime. That means 1 Premade will play against several PUGs which multiplicates the effect. A match consists of 16 players, if 4mans play and give their side a significant edge that means the 25% of the playerbase is enough to alter the experience for the other 75% that is based on random luck matchmaking. Premades consist probably more min max Gamers than PUGs.

This will make up a rather frustrating gameplay experience for people that like to play multi role, multi range, exotic/experimental Mech setups, staged combat development and do not see any appeal in CQB or Long Range minmaxing. This gives a very tainted gameplay experience depending on random luck."

Edited by Thirdstar, 28 January 2013 - 09:27 PM.

[Kaspirikay]

Pug

[GalaxyBluestar]

not bothered about pugs vs premades arguments. it's actually trainess vs vets and matchmaker phase 3 will help.

also some quick commands will help. at the moment we have a fiddly waypoint marker how many people use the waypoint marker on their battle grid anyways?

[Eddrick]

PUG exclusivly for now. When I get a good computer. Then, I will try and join a squad.

GalaxyBluestar, on 28 January 2013 - 10:00 PM, said:

not bothered about pugs vs premades arguments. it's actually trainess vs vets and matchmaker phase 3 will help.

This is probably the more likly case.

[RedMercury]

The actual numbers matter less than the perception. If it ****** pubbies off enough, no amount of premade reasoning will convince them not to be frustrated and mad as hell.

There's another thread about how to avoid being pugstomped by not playing 7-11 PM EST. People are taking it into their own hands to split the community, because PGI refuses to solve the issue.

In closed beta and early open beta I played premade on the public TS server and with MUX. But now I am aware of this vast problem which is the cancer killing MWO, and I refuse to contribute to it.

Edited by RedMercury, 29 January 2013 - 12:36 AM.

[Ilwrath]

Bluescuba, on 02 December 2012 - 09:46 AM, said:

It will be glorious to drop without pugs...

No more akers, suiciders or botters

Maybe not zero trash talk, but considerably less

Playing with people who know the game and canon (on both sides)

Real teams to test our metal

Diverse mech builds were team mates play specific roles

A true game of tactics and skill

Full comms

And best of all no more qqing about stomping in the forums

Hello Bubba, the 8 man que is that way ----->

[Chrithu]

Nice idea. But the OP's assertion kinda misses one important point:

Out of 10 matches that are normal most will remember the one match where the premade came and rolled over them a lot more vivid and most people will perceive that disturbance to normality as VERY annoying. This is why the outcry is so loud while probably the number of occurances in relation to the number of matches played seems to be a very low and thus neglectible ratio.

So while I like the Idea of seeing what the numbers of PUGgers and Pre-Mades could be I doubt those numbers have any merit when comes to assessing how much of a problem the "PUGstomping" is. In any case those numbers should not be used to tell people that complain, that they shouldn't be complaining. That's just trolling.

Actually just to tell you before: It's quite likely that the poll results will not help the OPs case anyways. I'd expect the ratio between PUGs and Pre-Made players to be 3:1. Which means at any given time 3/4 of players would be Pugs and 1/4 would be in premade 4 man teams. This is exactly the ratio that's needed to make it quite likely that a lot of matches have 12 PUggers and 4 guys organized in a team, creating the situiation of a pre-made + 4 puggers against 8 puggers that usually is reffered to as a pugstomp.

Edited by Jason Parker, 29 January 2013 - 01:48 AM.

[Ilwrath]

Jason Parker, on 29 January 2013 - 01:42 AM, said:

This is exactly the ratio that's needed to make it quite likely that a lot of matches have 12 PUggers and 4 guys organized in a team, creating the situiation of a pre-made + 4 puggers against 8 puggers that usually is reffered to as a pugstomp.

I prefer to call that the "MWO experience".

At least I am not paying any more for that.

[PurpleNinja]

Since coordination is extremely rare on the battlefield, I bet we're most PUGs.

[Elessar]

Always PUG

[Mack1]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 December 2012 - 09:19 AM, said:

You see, if the vast majority of players are PUGs, then the vast majority of drops, YOU ARE ALSO FACING PUGS. In which case the evil Pre-Made boogeyman is a myth, and you are getting stomped primarily by other PUGs (Maybe by ones who have figured out the Command Map, text chat and teamwork stuff).

Flawed logic

One 4 man premade per game will stomp the other team which means there are 12 pug players in the game so for every pug stomp you need one 4 man premade but 12 puggers.

Sorry but the premade boogeyman is very real and is ruining this game.

[ConnorSinclair]

I tried to avoid playing with non-humans,

They're so bad that the random AI mech generator on a certain other mech game makes more sensible mechs than the randoms, they even fight better.

[Naja]

Only pug. Playing from Australia I find there's little use in attempting to play seriously with my 250 ping

[Faldrin]

Simple thing is look back at other MMO's not just mechwarrior/TT/BT games. The ones that make a place for pug players are going strong as a rule if the game is only half bad. But even good games that only catered to the hardcore fan base have all died except 1 or 2 that I know.

[Ilwrath]

Faldrin, on 29 January 2013 - 06:04 AM, said:

Simple thing is look back at other MMO's not just mechwarrior/TT/BT games. The ones that make a place for pug players are going strong as a rule if the game is only half bad. But even good games that only catered to the hardcore fan base have all died except 1 or 2 that I know.

Or just look at World of Tanks. I mostly wanted something like that when I got this game just minus the silly communist bias.
How is WoT doing compared to this game? Ah well we don't know because only WoT got a population counter.

[Bguk]

Mack1, on 29 January 2013 - 03:39 AM, said:

Sorry but the premade boogeyman is very real and is ruining this game.

Unknown as to how often this is the case. I really wish the devs would shoot out some numbers so we have something real to deal with.