253 replies to this topic

[Felix]

Egomane, on 05 December 2012 - 10:26 AM, said:

No, you are not allowed to do that.

Too bad, I didnt know how retarded the devs here were before I bought the founders package

[Bilbo]

Garth Erlam, on 05 December 2012 - 10:18 AM, said:

Or, and stay with me here, you put on four medium lasers and 2 LRM 15's with artemis.

Also there's a non tech item that completely negates laser damage - we call it a 'hill' and you can stand behind it and fire LRMs right over it

This brought me to tears Garth. Brilliant!!!

[Kilgore]

verybad, on 05 December 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

Then why aren't your ECM carrying mechs providing ECCM?

It may be harder to provide LRM boat support now with ECM in the game, but it's not like it's limited to one team.

You helping to illustrate the problem. It's an arms race to see who can bring the most ECM.

[Harrison Kelly]

Garth Erlam, on 05 December 2012 - 10:18 AM, said:

Or, and stay with me here, you put on four medium lasers and 2 LRM 15's with artemis.

Also there's a non tech item that completely negates laser damage - we call it a 'hill' and you can stand behind it and fire LRMs right over it

Jeez, Garth--and stay with me here--that's a very funny way to spell "2 SRM 6's with Artemis"

You can't fire over hills right now with LRMs in 8v8s due to 3+ ECM Mechs per team, but I guess you probably already knew that.

[Salient]

ECM doesnt need fixing, its PURfect. I think the effect should be map wide tho, buffs needed.

[Bishop Steiner]

Dukov Nook, on 05 December 2012 - 09:58 AM, said:

the founders cat has only 2 missile hard points...

No one fears 2 medium lasers, which is about all the room you have left once you put 2 LRM 20's with artemis on a cat.

But sure. I guess we should introduce other tech that negates weapons. Let's put in laser jamming. I'm sure that would go over just as well.

wow. Now that just sounded petulant. The whole point of ECM is to screw up computer, communications and such. Since neither ballistics nor lasers use them, they are not affected. On the other hand, since both are LOS ONLY, you a) need more than your scout looking at an opponent to hit them. Have to expose yourself to enemy fire to shoot them, they already have their counters in play.

You are starting to sound like you belong to a group that bought whole hog into the LRM/Streak mentaliity, and now resent having to adapt to more balanced tactics. Haven't played against you since the patch to the best of my knowledge, but for a group that prides itself on "it's real world military experience", you sound like a group that fell into the gamers min/max mindset. With all that military background, I would think tactics to be a forte.

[Fate 6]

Garth Erlam, on 05 December 2012 - 10:18 AM, said:

Or, and stay with me here, you put on four medium lasers and 2 LRM 15's with artemis.

Also there's a non tech item that completely negates laser damage - we call it a 'hill' and you can stand behind it and fire LRMs right over it

Ignorant comments like that are the reason this game is still in a state of such imbalance.
Even with 4 lasers, you aren't ever going to be using your missiles unless, by some miracle, a light mech on your team can hold TAG on the enemy for the full duration of the lock and the missile arc. Good luck with that. And even if this miracle occurs, there are still the basic LRM avoidance maneuvers, aka your 'hill'. It just has to be a bigger hill.

Also, ECM doesn't need LoS, so by hiding behind a 'hill' the Raven is now unable to be hit and still making all targeted missiles on your team dead weight.

[Felix]

Harrison Kelly, on 05 December 2012 - 10:32 AM, said:

Jeez, Garth--and stay with me here--that's a very funny way to spell "2 SRM 6's with Artemis"

You can't fire over hills right now with LRMs in 8v8s due to 3+ ECM Mechs per team, but I guess you probably already knew that.

Probably not.

He demonstrated an ignorance of his own game mechanics and not really giving a ***** about his players or game

[Bishop Steiner]

Felix, on 05 December 2012 - 10:22 AM, said:

I always love it when Devs dont give a **** about their game

Question, I dont want to bother reading through the rules, am I allowed to sell my founders account to a rube new player to recoup my losses on this game?

Or, if I was gonna spend money on something, stay with me here (to quote Garth), maybe that's your own problem for not taking time to understand what you were buying into?

[Fate 6]

verybad, on 05 December 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

Then why aren't your ECM carrying mechs providing ECCM?

It may be harder to provide LRM boat support now with ECM in the game, but it's not like it's limited to one team.

All this means now is that LRMs aren't the easiest weapon in the game to use to rack up lots of kills.I've stayed away from LRMs and Gauss because they've both been OP in this game.

You can still use LRMs, just takes some more coordination to get indirect fire out of them.

Hold me while I dry my tears.

The A1 has been running amok over all the other mechs in this game. To bad.

If you have been avoiding using LRMs then you don't know that they aren't easy-mode press the button to win weapons. You needed coordination even before ECM was introduced. It was hard enough to get a lock and hold it. And that's still assuming the person you are targeting isn't just going to walk behind a building or large hill.

Felix, on 05 December 2012 - 10:36 AM, said:

Probably not.

He demonstrated an ignorance of his own game mechanics and not really giving a ***** about his players or game

^
Didn't the developers not even realize how bad AC shake was until they saw a video on Youtube?

[Salient]

Dukov Nook, on 05 December 2012 - 08:01 AM, said:

As the raven ankle bites the poor cat, negating 90% of his damage capabilities, essentially taking him out of the fight without any use of skill since an ECM raven can approach, in plain site, a LRM cat without worry (pssh, that cat has 2 medium lasers. THE HORROR)... and then simply circle him to keep his ability to lock 100% negated.

Awww poor OP... his clan no protect him from scary raven.... no ez mode for him.. he go cry cry on forumz.

[Felix]

Bishop Steiner, on 05 December 2012 - 10:37 AM, said:

Or, if I was gonna spend money on something, stay with me here (to quote Garth), maybe that's your own problem for not taking time to understand what you were buying into?

When I bought into the game (I had beta access before I became a founder) things were on the up and up, the changes being made benefited the game.

No idea when they unleashed the half brain dead chimps in their office though, but I seriously regret supporting them now.

[Jman5]

Felix, on 05 December 2012 - 10:28 AM, said:

Too bad, I didnt know how retarded the devs here were before I bought the founders package

11/10 So brave!

[Harrison Kelly]

Bishop Steiner, on 05 December 2012 - 10:34 AM, said:

wow. Now that just sounded petulant. The whole point of ECM is to screw up computer, communications and such. Since neither ballistics nor lasers use them, they are not affected. On the other hand, since both are LOS ONLY, you a) need more than your scout looking at an opponent to hit them. Have to expose yourself to enemy fire to shoot them, they already have their counters in play.

You are starting to sound like you belong to a group that bought whole hog into the LRM/Streak mentaliity, and now resent having to adapt to more balanced tactics. Haven't played against you since the patch to the best of my knowledge, but for a group that prides itself on "it's real world military experience", you sound like a group that fell into the gamers min/max mindset. With all that military background, I would think tactics to be a forte.

No, I think he resents having a 1.5 ton piece of equipment invalidate two entire weapons platforms (LRMs and Streaks) and dictate the entire flow of the game.

All the people who whined about Streaks/LRMs needing no skill are suddenly okay with those weapons being almost entirely negated by adding a single component in their MechLab and clicking Save. It's not okay to have no-skill homing missiles, but darnit, my AOE anti-missile stealth field that requires nothing other than having it equipped requires TONS of skill. That's a staggering double standard from the same people who were bloviating about missiles prior to the patch, and it all comes down to one asinine argument:

"You should play how I think you should play and all other approaches should be invalidated."

I don't think there was anyone who ever advocated that matches should be nothing but missile boats blasting each other, but that missiles should and could be viable in some form on a team composition. Meanwhile, the other side was hellbent on removing missiles or marginalizing them into some kind of "support" role that "shouldn't be a primary weapon" while ignoring the numerous canon Mechs that all use missiles as their primary weapon.

Congratulations, you got your wish. PGI gave you what you wanted. Welcome to ECMwarrior Online

[Jetfire]

Felix, on 05 December 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

When I bought into the game (I had beta access before I became a founder) things were on the up and up, the changes being made benefited the game.

No idea when they unleashed the half brain dead chimps in their office though, but I seriously regret supporting them now.

So you bought the closed beta version of the game, not the vision for the future? Because ECM and its essential implementation makes logical sense given what it is. E-warfare is a part of the game by design. Balances are shifting and team role warfare is the eventual goal. Don't want to run ECM... try ballistics, lasers and SRM's. Want to run LRM's or streaks, you'll need assistance and you probably still won't want to boat anymore. Boating lock on weapons now has a serious downside, that is balance.

[Johnathan McKenna]

Garth Erlam, on 05 December 2012 - 10:18 AM, said:

there's a non tech item that completely negates laser damage - we call it a 'hill' and you can stand behind it and fire LRMs right over it

And that is going in my sig!

[Kerzin]

Or just switch up the way LRM’s work by removing the min rang requirement and allowing them to be direct fired, this would require some adjustments to their damage output but I think it’s a workable solution.

[TruePoindexter]

Not to sway the topic one way ot the other but I wanted to point out that TAG is being buffed and will let you achieve locks on targets that are cloaked in ECM. Sources:
http://mwomercs.com/...29#entry1546429
http://mwomercs.com/...dian-ecm-suite/

Edited by TruePoindexter, 05 December 2012 - 10:46 AM.

[verybad]

Kilgore, on 05 December 2012 - 10:30 AM, said:

You helping to illustrate the problem. It's an arms race to see who can bring the most ECM.

Not really, there's no problem related to ECM for the weapons I use the most (UAC-5s and Large Lasers).

I just think it's funny that this weapon that has a huge advantage (indirect fire) can't always be used for that without coordination with other players now and people that have been racking up lots of points with LRM boats or SSRM2 Cats in the past are now crying about this.

For a direct fire speciallist like myself, these are the good days. I have a TAG on ALL my builds (and have since TAG was available) because I enjoy supporting my team, though I'll have to see how many people are boating LRMs this weekend.

Seems like Jenners should now be specializing in killing Ravens however. Kill the Ravens that are doing aggressive ECM coverage, then TAG the Atlases that are providing defensive ECM support..The Jenner can provide these services with a smile.
It's a better one on one fighter than the Raven (so scout killing) and it's fast enough to provide good tag support in order to take out Atlas ECM support. Sure it's a new level of tactics involved, So what, the challenge is exhiliarating.

[dal10]

solution, take it away from D-DC atlas, give to AH centurion, the UAC-5 dragon, and the 8R awesome. more mechs have it, and they are the worst builds for those mechs, giving you some actual reason to use them.