172 replies to this topic

[aniviron]

Aethon, on 06 December 2012 - 10:24 PM, said:

Well, my point about the Awesome is a combination of fake/broken/crappy DHS, a large head hitbox, and a positively MASSIVE center torso hitbox; still, reducing its head hitbox would help it out a great deal.

You forgot the gigantic side torsos and weapon mounts that are so low and wide you scrape the ground on most turns, meaning you can't fire over cover.

[Aethon]

aniviron, on 04 April 2013 - 07:54 PM, said:

You forgot the gigantic side torsos and weapon mounts that are so low and wide you scrape the ground on most turns, meaning you can't fire over cover.

Oh, believe me, I never forgot about that; it is simply irrelevant when the CT hitbox is so massive. It takes a pretty poor marksman to miss that hitbox more than once in a fight, and when the CT is gone, the other parts are irrelevant.

The solution is rather simple: measure the hitbox surface area, and increase the max hitpoints of armor that can be mounted there, proportionally, based on the amount of frontal surface area. I hesitate to suggest this, as I am a hardcore canon Battletech fan, but PGI has already removed one of the keystones of the Battletech formula (weapon scatter/convergence), and made it worse with doubled armor...so the formula needs to be re-balanced somehow.

This would somewhat balance the wide mechs like the Awesome with the narrow mechs like the Stalker...at least, in terms of durability. Another case would be the Jenner and the Raven.

Edited by Aethon, 05 April 2013 - 02:11 AM.

[F lan Ker]

S!

I read thru this QQ fest. One guy wants to be able to "boom headshot" every Atlas while zipping by and any other Mech so he would look so darned pro and the game would cater just for him. Sorry boy, the game is not for your type only. Sure the headshot is the best as you damage the Mech least thus more salvage. But that is not the point of this game, to headshot all and every Mech there is. Some Mechs have bigger headboxes, some smaller. L2P and aim for other vulnerable parts. They all go down and if unsure, go to training grounds and test yourself. This is not CS or CoD of BF3 or whatever.

End of venting. I drive Atlas now and then, been head shot and damaged. Last time yesterday a PPC Stalked got in a shot that made the hitbox turn yellow. So if the guy with a less pinpoint weapon like PPC can hit the headbox of an Atlas and a guy supposedly with lasers can not then nothing to say. Atlas should be feared and not that easy to kill, but ONLY if deployed right. It is not an invincible Mech of Destruction. It needs support from other Mechs to bring it's arsenal of weaponry to range.

Whatever. Some want this to turn to a FOTM filled EZ mode FPS title. Please QQ enough and it will. After that you can swag your ePeens and circle touch each other when all the rest of the players have left. BT is more than just statistics padding and ePeening.

Have a nice weekend.

[Fishbulb333]

Tbh I didn't read much of this post beyond the topic...but here's my 2 cents - Trouble hitting an atlas in the head? Try a larger projectile! Double ac20 does the job juuuuust fine.

[Joseph Mallan]

Duncan Fisher, on 06 December 2012 - 09:15 PM, said:

It's in no way invulnerable, just shoot CT like usual. The Atlas is so big and slow as is, if headshots were as simple as pinging one of those giant eyes it'd be a death trap.

From Experience on the range. Head shots are quite a bit more easy. I know this isn't RL, but some head hit boxes are silly small and others are silly easy.

As a Atlas pilot I appreciate the small hit box, as a hunter, Could the hit box be opened up to be say... both eyes? A rectangular box?

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 05 April 2013 - 03:18 AM.

[SgtMagor]

[OpCentar]

Joseph Mallan, on 05 April 2013 - 03:18 AM, said:

....
As a Atlas pilot I appreciate the small hit box, as a hunter, Could the hit box be opened up to be say... both eyes? A rectangular box?

I don't pilot assaults but comparing the rest of them there's no reason not to make both eyes on the Atlas head count as a cockpit hitbox.

But they should be two separate hitboxes boxes, one for each "eye", if that's technically possible.

[Joseph Mallan]

For the D-DC maybe, IF using a dual CP.

[Terradoss]

Tarman, on 06 December 2012 - 11:34 PM, said:

This. Atlas headshot is a really really hard shot to pull off that yet is not impossible. To pull off this shot is a sweet thing that shouldn't happen every 5 games or even every 15 games unless you're on some kind of specific safari to pull off this shot.

As far as changing anything gamewise, having all hitboxes have equal chance to hit, you may as well make the models all the same for the effect on gameplay that would have. Even the lights have such different physical cockpit placements that this would greatly affect how they operated. The last thing Raven needs is a bigger cockpit, and for stuff to be as small as the Raven cockpit across the board doesn't really work either.

The problem with this particular issue is not how difficult it is to cockpit an atlas, but rather the relative level of ease through which you can disable/kill it everywhere else.

Unless you are on a crusade to cook the eyeball of every atlas you come across specifically, there's currently never any reason to even try. Your damage in almost every conceivable circumstance will be better spent on some other part of the mech.

personally I think this stems from the attempt to distinguish a cockpit shot as such a damaging event. Hitting the cockpit is designed to be very painful. As a tradeoff, it's a difficult shot to make as it has a massively reduced surface area than other parts of the mech. Fine in theory, the problem is that given the lack of uniformity in cockpit hit boxes, you have some mechs where its way too easy to achieve, some where its much too difficult and a couple where its pretty close to on the money.

I understand wanting to vary cockpit sizes to reinforce the construction of a mech as it appears in lore.....but i think this is one of those circumstances where a certain amount of normalisation is probably healthy for game balance, unfortunately at the cost of lore/realism.

[jay35]

SpiralRazor, on 06 December 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

Is this EVER going to be fixed? Atlas heads, for all intents and purposes, are completely invulnerable.


When was the last time you got a head kill shot on an atlas?


I had another post proving it, via shooting a shut down one in both eyes with large lasers...and still getting damage registered on CT.




Fix pls. Hard to kill should not = invulnerable.

I've gotten a headshot on an Atlas in combat. It's possible. It's certainly not impossible as you imply.

That said, it helps with survivability when you're in one of the slowest maneuvering mechs in the game. I think it's good that they have a tough-to-hit head hitbox. It's appropriate so it can be survivable enough to brawl. Also, since it's fairly tall, its head area is often exposed above cover, and it gets a good amount of incoming missile fire as well. If the head hitbox was larger, it would get headshot left and right by LRMs and other indirect-fire weapons.

Edited by jay35, 05 April 2013 - 05:02 AM.

[oldradagast]

Why would we want to make the easiest to hit mech in the game (that already has the largest target on it AND tied for the slowest base movement speed) easier to kill? I don't get it... And I'm pretty sure I did headshot one once - he turned towards me while I was uphill of him and my AC/20 round hit the left eye, and he died... .sure, he was beat up already, but still...

[ROFLwaffle49]

I put 3 ppcs into one 2 days ago, and was in one when the same happend to me. They are not invincible.

[Vrekgar]

SpiralRazor, on 06 December 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

Is this EVER going to be fixed? Atlas heads, for all intents and purposes, are completely invulnerable.


When was the last time you got a head kill shot on an atlas?


I had another post proving it, via shooting a shut down one in both eyes with large lasers...and still getting damage registered on CT.




Fix pls. Hard to kill should not = invulnerable.

IT was fixed. In beta there was a rash of people hitting the head because it was so large. It was changed to be only the window pane on the left eye. Now its incredibly hard to hit compared to anyone else. IT could use to be a bit bigger, but overall its not terrible.

I think we need to reduce the hitbox for some mechs in fact.

[pencilboom]

Kaijin, on 07 December 2012 - 03:05 PM, said:

Or how about this stunning idea...Randomize all hits to the heads of all mechs, with only 10% actually hitting it. If heads were as easy to take out in canon as they are on some mechs in MWO, they'd all be in the CT instead.

Head-shotting some mechs in MWO is the true EZ mode, so let's get rid of it in favor of a higher number of aimed shots.

No. Too much RNG. And I hate RNG. 2 ac/20 shots to one lucky person gets that 10% and a fresh mech would die instantly even though he got hit on the arms. No thanks

[Inyc]

I head shot overheating Atlas in my cent. Since I'm usually fairly close, if they overheat I'll tag them in the right eye with 2 LL and 2 ML and kill them.

[Panzerman03]

I'm actually pretty good at getting Atlas headshots. Dual AC/20 to the left eye will drop them and leave them raging in chat.

I'll also admit that I practice my headshots on unsuspecting teammates when we're standing around a cap point as the game is winding down. It really helps

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

aim for the left eye.

[Kyle Reece]

SpiralRazor, on 06 December 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

When was the last time you got a head kill shot on an atlas?

Last night on Alpine, disco'd Atlas that was running round in circles.

[Squidy]

I'm an Atlas player and I take significant head damage every so often. Dual AC20s and ppcs to the face hurts quite a bit and I usually die from the resulting damage. I should note that I max out the head armor at all times.

So maybe it is lag, maybe you aim for the wrong side of the head? Maybe aim for the legs instead? most of us put ammo in and strip armor from there for more weapons...

[Rakashan]

SpiralRazor, on 06 December 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

When was the last time you got a head kill shot on an atlas?

Last Sunday. Two in one match, in fact. Haven't had the time to play much since.