269 replies to this topic

[Mancu]

Rhyshaelkan, on 13 December 2012 - 10:51 AM, said:

Exactly right. ECM is bringing the tactical element back to the game. Instead of lock-on spam. Perhaps take weapons you have to aim. Perhaps put your head on a swivel, like fighter pilots had to since WWI. Stop relying on technology to answer all your problems. Become a better player.


Nerf this, Buff this. BAH. Play the game. I would encourage PGI to have a spam filter for topics like this.

So you consider the current Ninja Cap Rushes and 300m Blob Fights tactical? Those aren't tactical in any way shape or form. What you really mean is you prefer to run at the enemy and pew pew pew until one side or the other is dead. Which is fine, but please don't try to play it off as tactical or skillz gaming - its not.

[80Bit]

ECM needs to stay on and active so the community has enough time to work out the metagame around it. Turning it off would make needed balancing take longer.

I don't think ECM is as game breaking as some people, but I do feel it needs tweaking. That's why they still have the "Beta" word all over the place. We are testing and giving feed back.

[Pygar]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 13 December 2012 - 10:58 AM, said:

I'd be happy for now if they just made ECM not prevent missile locks /targetting outside the 180m bubble.

The way it's supposed to be in TT.

Yup, Heard that one before- and like I've said about a hundred times in ECM threads: When LRMs require LOS (or some kind of spotter), you know, THE WAY IT"S "SUPPOSED TO BE" IN TT.... then I'l start listening.

Edited by Pygar, 13 December 2012 - 11:04 AM.

[TruePoindexter]

I definitely agree that it should be limited to one premade per side - sync drops are pretty overwhelming for pug teams.

I also agree that some kind of weight/class limiter needs to be added for 8 mans - the Atlas train is just stupid.

Now... ECM? That's a harder one to finger. I've been watching carefully to see if I can tell if there was a shift in my overall win/loss rate since its introduction. I haven't seen a change at all and I PUG a lot. Does this mean it's OP or not? Well really it's just my own experience but I'm leaning towards no it isn't OP. It's definitely a game changer and it forces people to pay attention to what they're doing which I like. I've also started to get more people in PUG games actually communicate things like enemy positions/makeup. I was even so proud of a pug game last night where we deftly handled a base rush that just a few weeks ago would have crushed the normal PUG and that was with no ECM on our side.

I do think that more needs to be done to educate players as a whole. Just getting a new player into MWO is a daunting task and the fact that our best response is to tell them to go watch what's now almost a half hour of tutorial videos is not a good answer.

Edited by TruePoindexter, 13 December 2012 - 11:51 AM.

[3rdworld]

Pygar, on 13 December 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

Yup, Heard that before-and like I've said about a hundred times in ECM threads: When LRMs require LOS, you know, THE WAY IT"S SUPPOSED TO BE IN TT.... then I'l start listening.

indirect firing of lrms was in TT....

[Kousagi]

Pygar, on 13 December 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

Yup, Heard that one before- and like I've said about a hundred times in ECM threads: When LRMs require LOS (or some kind of spotter), you know, THE WAY IT"S "SUPPOSED TO BE" IN TT.... then I'l start listening.

And remember, the Spotter can not make a attack that turn to act as a spotter for the LRM's.

[Pygar]

3rdworld, on 13 December 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

indirect firing of lrms was in TT....

If you had a spotter, and with a penalty to-hit. (and as Kousagi mentions above, spotters had to waste their whole turn on spotting)

Otherwise....no LOS, no LRMs.

(Have we destroyed the "But that's not how it worked in TT" argument yet? Because TT didn't have perfect balance either, and expecting mechanics in an action shooter video game to match how it worked in a turn based game played with dice is like expecting that driving a race car is just like riding a 10 speed bike.)

Edited by Pygar, 13 December 2012 - 11:17 AM.

[MrPenguin]

Man, if people spent more time playing the game then complaining about ECM. They would have already learned how to hard counter it already.

[Ransack]

Yes, I think ECM should be turned off until it is not so game changing

No, I do not think that there should be a weight balancer for 8 mans. They should instead fix the netcode and put collisions back in so that I can tackle those pesky lights.

No, I don't think that the queue should be limited to one 4 man per side.
Yeah, it sucks being on the 4man 4PuG side against a synched 8, but ***** happens. When it happens, suck it up and move on to the next drop is my philosophy.

[Ryebear]

Actually Im going to have to cry that your statistics are what invalidates this poll. I dont think you are in a position to be the voice for the everyman and there are quire a few presumptions in your statement.

[TruePoindexter]

Ransack, on 13 December 2012 - 11:11 AM, said:

No, I do not think that there should be a weight balancer for 8 mans. They should instead fix the netcode and put collisions back in so that I can tackle those pesky lights.

No, I don't think that the queue should be limited to one 4 man per side.
Yeah, it sucks being on the 4man 4PuG side against a synched 8, but ***** happens. When it happens, suck it up and move on to the next drop is my philosophy.

The dev working on networking is not the dev who is working on match making. These two are not related. Also you apparently support wildly imbalanced games so what's wrong with ECM?

MrPenguin, on 13 December 2012 - 11:08 AM, said:

Man, if people spent more time playing the game then complaining about ECM. They would have already learned how to hard counter it already.

Thermals and paying attention to horizons work wonders.

[AlanEsh]

No need to remove ECM, just remove Stacking.

[TruePoindexter]

Angelicon, on 13 December 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

No need to remove ECM, just remove Stacking.

I kinda agree with this. Makes ECCM worth a little more than ECM and helps out teams with only one ECM.

[Harrison Kelly]

Okay, so I've said my piece on multiple occasions about how broken ECM is, and in threads the OP has probably seen, so I won't rehash all of that here.

I voted no on removing ECM, yes on the other 2. The combination of no weight limits and 8-mans is making the game really silly right now. Back before the stupidity that was Phase 1, my premade rarely told people "No, please play a different role." It was usually roll with what you like. Now, to stay competitive in 8-man drops, we're being forced to include the same stupid Mechs as everyone else: D-DC Atlases and ECM Ravens/Commandos. Not usually stacking them, but we have to include certain variants, and I think that's
dumb.

I think they should just nerf ECM significantly, no need to remove it. I definitely feel like playing less since the patch because the gameplay in 8v8s has gotten very stale and the gameplay in PUG matches is completely uncoordinated rolling of the dice. The game isn't that fun right now.

The A1's build options went from basically 3 (LRMs, SRMs, or Streaks) to 1 (SRMs!). There's 2 Raven variants that are completely outclassed right now. Two Atlas variants are completely outclassed. Medium Mechs of any sort that aren't Cicadas are a rarity in 8-man drops. LRMs might be carried on one Mech per drop. ECM clearly has done wonders for our build diversity.

Here's what I think should happen to fix ECM:
*Disrupt Mode:
**Enemy weapons locks takes 25% longer at all ranges
**Enemy target info gathering takes 25% longer at all ranges
**LRMs gain no bonuses from Artemis when fired on a target inside an ECM Disrupt field
**Enemy Mechs within 180 meters cannot gain target info/lock on to your Mech and lose radr if they are Disrupted
*Counter Mode:
**Counters one enemy in disrupt mode
*TAGing/NARCing a target inside an ECM bubble allows targeting of the target, even if you're inside the bubble.

ECM is now STILL amazing, but no longer stupidly broken AOE cloaking field/jamming field.

Edited by Harrison Kelly, 13 December 2012 - 11:26 AM.

[ReD3y3]

Alot of people like myself enjoy what ECM has brought to MWO.

Strategy plays a part in the game now. Not just who has the biggest guns or fastest mechs.

[Scryed]

Ecm jamming should only affect mechs under its 180-200m range, and just take 50 percent longer to get a lock at longer distances, anything else makes it too effective for 1.5 tons

[nom de guerre]

Personally I disagree, even running a non ECM equipped mech I've found ECM to be a minor annoyance at best, it does not auto win matches for ppl.

[Grraarrgghh]

Less than 30% of players want ECM debuffed, yet it's all we hear about.

Loud minority indeed.

[Scryed]

Grraarrgghh, on 13 December 2012 - 11:28 AM, said:

Less than 30% of players want ECM debuffed, yet it's all we hear about.

Loud minority indeed.

You mean 30 percent of people that voted, otherwise what you are telling me is that there are only 215 people on this forum

[Ricama]

I honestly and fine with 8-mans as they are, now all the people who said they can own a team of Atlases with their Jenner get a chance to prove it. Videos please.