269 replies to this topic

[Taryys]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 13 December 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

26 to 8 no. ppl would much rather have their op gear than not. big surprise there

Perhaps, people would rather give PGI the chance to gather data and usage information so that they can have a better idea on where to go.

[Bishop Steiner]

Bluten, on 13 December 2012 - 08:23 AM, said:

Streaks WERE overpowered, but they didn't need a butchery to bring them down a notch. Worse yet is that if you aren't being jammed, they're STILL overpowered. Instead of balancing the weapon itself and making the ECM not be such a single solitary huge factor, they made it OP, so now it revolves around ECM or no ECM. The ECM should do less to Streaks while they should have been nerfed on their own in some other way. So now it's either OP or unable to shoot at all. Neither should be the case... ECM should be a smaller piece of a bigger picture, not the entire picture like they made it.

Perhaps you're right about LRMs, but they too didn't need nor should have gotten a butchery in order to nerf them. Piranha is starting to turn into Blizzard, where they release crap that is either extremely OP or wreck things entirely instead of just tweaking a few numbers to bring them down some. The solution to an OP weapon isn't to gut it entirely, it's to... make it "not op" anymore...



Sounds like I'm not the only one that didn't want 300m brawler online

Kind afunny how often I have vehemently disagreed with you on other stuff, but can't help but agree here.

Also, I know this is a hot button issue, and gonna get some pretty impassioned responses from all side. That is good. The DEVS can mine as much info off the forums at times, as from our in game play.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Taryys, on 13 December 2012 - 08:27 AM, said:

Perhaps, people would rather give PGI the chance to gather data and usage information so that they can have a better idea on where to go.

yet with double heat sinks they just told us how it was and never cared about our input.
funny how that works huh?

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 13 December 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

26 to 8 no. ppl would much rather have their op gear than not. big surprise there

Well, if you're a brawler, the effect that this broken ECM has on the game is like a gift from god. It's heaven now. They're loving it. Because they can just run to 300m and pewpew all day long in a nice open area without any consequences at all. Before hand, you actually had a reason to mount some 450+ range guns. You don't need to bother with that anymore. You also don't need to play smart at the start of games anymore. You literally just stompystomp in a straight line to the enemy team or base and slug it out. That's what they like to do, and that's what the ECM has turned the game into. They don't care about roles, weapons, or devices that were rendered useless in the process. But trust me, they'll come around eventually after it gets stale enough and they wonder where the excitement in this game went. Before the ECM, matches had danger and excitement, no more. Just march to 300m in a straight line. Pewpew. That's the game now.

Edited by Bluten, 13 December 2012 - 08:32 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 13 December 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

26 to 8 no. ppl would much rather have their op gear than not. big surprise there

Actually, I think it is more that most people don't even bother to read the TL;DR section where it states pretty simply to suspend it FOR NOW, and in house test it some more. The implication being that AFTER, they re-release it, and hopefully, people don't overreact like this time.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Bluten, on 13 December 2012 - 08:31 AM, said:

Well, if you're a brawler, the effect that this broken ECM has on the game is like a gift from god. It's heaven now. They're loving it. Because they can just run to 300m and pewpew all day long in a nice open area without any consequences at all. Before hand, you actually had a reason to mount some 450+ range guns. You don't need to bother with that anymore. You also don't need to play smart at the start of games anymore. You literally just stompystomp in a straight line to the enemy team or base and slug it out. That's what they like to do, and that's what the ECM allows. They don't care about roles, weapons, or devices that were rendered useless in the process. But trust me, they'll come around eventually after it gets stale enough and they wonder where the excitement in this game went. Before the ECM, matches had danger and excitement, no more. Just march to 300m in a straight line. Pewpew. That's the game now.

Yes and EVERYONE mounts them from what Im seeing, but given how "diverse" that makes the game I dont see it changing soon

[Bishop Steiner]

Bluten, on 13 December 2012 - 08:31 AM, said:

Well, if you're a brawler, the effect that this broken ECM has on the game is like a gift from god. It's heaven now. They're loving it. Because they can just run to 300m and pewpew all day long in a nice open area without any consequences at all. Before hand, you actually had a reason to mount some 450+ range guns. You don't need to bother with that anymore. You also don't need to play smart at the start of games anymore. You literally just stompystomp in a straight line to the enemy team or base and slug it out. That's what they like to do, and that's what the ECM has turned the game into. They don't care about roles, weapons, or devices that were rendered useless in the process. But trust me, they'll come around eventually after it gets stale enough and they wonder where the excitement in this game went. Before the ECM, matches had danger and excitement, no more. Just march to 300m in a straight line. Pewpew. That's the game now.

Sadly, the more i deal with the gaming community, the less it seems to matter about stale or not. Seems like most are simply obsessed with padding their precious "Stats" any way possible, because apparently the fun is in the "bragging rights" (no matter how padded by PUG stomps, pre-death discos and such) than in actually having to over come a challenge.

I personally have been one of the more vocals supporters of ECM, because I find I can use all my builds, brawlers, sniper or support well, I just had to come up with new tactics, and better coordination. (something hard for PUGs to do with the lack of in game VOIP, sadly).

But I am also willing to concede something I like on occasion when I see the writing on the wall, for the "greater good" so to speak. But tis also a reason I tried to address 3 of the major issues, on this poll not just 1.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 13 December 2012 - 08:32 AM, said:

Yes and EVERYONE mounts them from what Im seeing, but given how "diverse" that makes the game I dont see it changing soon

There isn't even a reason to use a 2X or 4X Raven anymore. That's balanced and diverse though, right?!

Edited by Bluten, 13 December 2012 - 08:43 AM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Bluten, on 13 December 2012 - 08:39 AM, said:

There isn't even a reason to use a 2X or 4X anymore. That's balanced and diverse though, right?!

according to the devs, op=diverse so yeah

[Heeden]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 13 December 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

26 to 8 no. ppl would much rather have their op gear than not. big surprise there

I voted against disabling ECMs and I'm working on Centurion mastery.

[stjobe]

Bluten, on 13 December 2012 - 08:31 AM, said:

Before hand, you actually had a reason to mount some 450+ range guns. You don't need to bother with that anymore.

Funny, I see Gauss snipers in just about every game I play. And I usually spend the first few minutes of a game sniping away with UAC or LL.

And, incredibly enough, I still see LRMs and Streaks being used in just about every match; I even get killed by them from time to time.

In short, you're exaggerating greatly. Again.

[Broceratops]

Bluten, on 13 December 2012 - 08:31 AM, said:

Well, if you're a brawler, the effect that this broken ECM has on the game is like a gift from god. It's heaven now. They're loving it. Because they can just run to 300m and pewpew all day long in a nice open area without any consequences at all. Before hand, you actually had a reason to mount some 450+ range guns. You don't need to bother with that anymore. You also don't need to play smart at the start of games anymore. You literally just stompystomp in a straight line to the enemy team or base and slug it out. That's what they like to do, and that's what the ECM has turned the game into. They don't care about roles, weapons, or devices that were rendered useless in the process. But trust me, they'll come around eventually after it gets stale enough and they wonder where the excitement in this game went. Before the ECM, matches had danger and excitement, no more. Just march to 300m in a straight line. Pewpew. That's the game now.

I could easily say that before ECM all games were dumbed down into a mexican standoff. I can't try any sneaky maneuvers because your HUD will highlight my *** from 800 meters away even if I'm just ducking between 2 hills for 3 seconds. You didn't need to bother with scouting, because even if you do a terrible job of it your HUD will show you where they are.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 13 December 2012 - 08:43 AM, said:

according to the devs, op=diverse so yeah

Meanwhile, at the barracks...
AS7-K Pilot: I sacrificed some of my weapons for a second AMS so I can shoot down twice as many missiles. Stay near me guys, and you'll be ok!
AS7-D-DC Pilot: I sacrificed none of my weapons for an ECM which stops missile locks entirely. It doesn't even need ammo.
AS7-D Pilot: Ya, I'm going with D-DC on this one. Sorry K. Who the hell needs an AMS anymore, anyway?
AS7-K Pilot:
AS7-D-DC Pilot: ECM FTW!
AS7-RS Pilot: St.fu.

Broceratops, on 13 December 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

I could easily say that before ECM all games were dumbed down into a mexican standoff. I can't try any sneaky maneuvers because your HUD will highlight my *** from 800 meters away even if I'm just ducking between 2 hills for 3 seconds. You didn't need to bother with scouting, because even if you do a terrible job of it your HUD will show you where they are.

ECM didn't need to be OP to change this. Even if it was 500m vs BAP, your problem would basically be solved. I also don't get what you mean by "dumbed" down. Standoffs where you properly positioned yourself and actually used terrain and looked for nice flanking windows was the best part of this game. Now it's dumbed down. Everyone just brawls at 300m in a big cluster blob without any regard to anything.

Edited by Bluten, 13 December 2012 - 08:51 AM.

[Asakara]

I say no to suspending ECM. I am happy with how it functions.

I do think they should maybe add in a tonnage limit for 8 mans..

Say 500, 550, or 600 tons cap per side, requiring all 8 players be in a mech. With 500 you could get 4 atlases and 4 commandos at the extreme end.

[Jacmac]

Bishop Steiner, on 13 December 2012 - 07:56 AM, said:

- Whether ECM is broken or not will not matter, if players keep leaving at the rate they are: Please offline ECM on the upcoming patch until you can find a manner that IS "Acceptable" to the masses. And kindly add a Weight Balancer to 8 man ques/ Limit 4 man ques to one "Pre-Made" group per side.

No need to Offline ECM. ECM is practically off-lined by the puggers. I've been in plenty of pug matches where there is only one or two ECMs on either or both sides. I've seen some where there are none on either side.

Nobody playing 8-mans should be crying over ECM, if they are, they shouldn't be playing 8-mans.

Have to assume a weight balance mechanism will be coming soon. I would say the pug matches need another option: solo player only pug matches where none of the players is a premade of any size.

[Particule]

Keep ECM in the game.

I want the complexity in the game. If I wanted whack-a-mole, I'd go back to Planetside 2 (beta tester from beginning).

I'd like to see more versions of ECM in the game though. I think this may be in planning, but if not, here are my ideas:

• A version that "disrupts" only for the equipped mech (no counter mode). Cost: 1.5 tons and 2 slots
  
• A version that disrupts for the team and counters enemy ECM. Cost: 3 tons and 3 slots.

ECM has high value so there should be a higher cost than what is currently in game. Version 1 can still allow Ravens to be a stealthy scout. Version 2 allows an Atlas to protect the team but at a decent trade-off in weapon loadout. Currently, the trade-off for an Atlas is trivial.

Let price ration demand.

[Jacmac]

Asakara, on 13 December 2012 - 08:53 AM, said:

Say 500, 550, or 600 tons cap per side, requiring all 8 players be in a mech. With 500 you could get 4 atlases and 4 commandos at the extreme end.

I would say more like 250-350 tons per side. Maybe we need multiple weight limit options available? 500-600 is way too heavy in my opinion.

[Woska]

While I like the introduction of ECM in principle, I think the details of the inplementation are what is actually broken.

I'd like to see a wider availability so you don't have to use three speed demons, or an moving mountain. Why can't I stick ECM in my hunchie?

Also, I think tag and Narc should negate the effect of ECM for the purposes of LRM lock. So you have the ability to counter the ECM if you cooperate, without simply needing more ECM. Maybe even include Beagle Active Probe in that, at least partially. Also, I think the LRMs should have not trouble locking on if the firing mech has line of sight.

[Bishop Steiner]

Jacmac, on 13 December 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

I would say more like 250-350 tons per side. Maybe we need multiple weight limit options available? 500-600 is way too heavy in my opinion.

I like the thought of "multi- weight class" options, like a 250-300 ton drop, a 450-500 ton drop, etc. I also don't mind some randmoization to it, like matching groups that are say within 15% of each others drop tonnage.

Or of course tiers, like the ones mentioned, where if you drop with a group weighing 270 tons, you fall into the 250-300 bracket, etc.

[Kell Commander]

The ECM isn't actually doing what the ECM is supposed to do at atll. It is providing bonuses that the Cappellan's stealth armor gives. It's not supposed to effect weapons locks at all.