90 replies to this topic

[ICEFANG13]

Does it matter what our opinions are? A majority dislikes something about ECM, and it already obvious. What Paul said was pretty much, "who cares?"

[JP Josh]

seeing im stuck at job core and cant play this game im jelous of you all and want to **** slap thoughs of you complaining. ecm will be adjusted later on and counters to it will become avalible for christ sake people dont plead for ballance till all paths are avalible.

now any news about the ppc emp effect coming?

[Corvus Antaka]

ICEFANG13, on 14 December 2012 - 10:05 PM, said:

Does it matter what our opinions are? A majority dislikes something about ECM, and it already obvious. What Paul said was pretty much, "who cares?"

That's because Paul understands this game. He knows what he is doing. You guys obviously are way behind the curve on how huge MWO is going to be and how the greatness in this game is shining forth more and more each day.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out. So many are piling in to play this new MWO that is working as intended, and all anyone ever does is rave about how much faith we all have in legendary developer PGI and their amazing track record and the hugely exciting prospects for the future, we don't need people who can't appreciate brilliance sticking around.

Given the track record of the past 5 months, how can you not have blind faith in the brilliant future of this game?

[Carrioncrows]

The biggest problem I have with ECM is it reduces the effectiveness of ALL other variants for that mech.

Like you think to yourself what mech variant am I going to upgrade to?

The one with ECM, it's a no brainier.

[Flapdrol]

Isn't there a stickied ecm feedback thread?

[CoreHunter]

this ecm was developed by Blakest. Nothing more to say.

[Black Ivan]

Stingz, on 14 December 2012 - 05:52 PM, said:

Remove the Null-Signature radar-invisibility, then we can start talking about ECM balance.

Radar detection reduction is much too heavy currently, especially since BAP won't reduce the effects.

Excatly this. The ECM does in no way actually work as it was supposed to be under the BT rules. A Mech carrying an ECM was never invisible or untargetable.

Edited by Black Ivan, 15 December 2012 - 04:09 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

StalaggtIKE, on 14 December 2012 - 01:19 PM, said:

From article:



Source: http://m.pcgamer.com...st-mode-release

Do you agree with the direction of ECM? Simple poll: yes or no.

ECM is working properly... IF we we using Angel ECM instead of Guardian. OR if the DEVs don't intend on having 2 systems this is a good blend of the two.

[Hellboy561]

Waladil, on 14 December 2012 - 03:35 PM, said:

I'm more interested in that part of Paul's quote:
"and likely there will be a couple more involving modules and weapon effects."

That statement might mean A LOT. For example, we're hearing that PPCs might get an EMP effect. So what if shooting an ECM 'Mech with a PPC turns off it's ECM for about 10 seconds? That'd be a pretty powerful counter to ECM, especially on the big Atlas D-DCs. So Paul did not emphasize that all of ECM's play and counter-play are finished, just that they've got that aspect the way they want.

yeah this is all well and good, but if the system was FULLY implemented then people wouldn't be able to complain about it. Why have PPCs not had this EMP effect? as soon as it happens just wait for the threads of "PPCs are OP since patch!"

Its the same problem as what happened with the Gauss Rifle. When they introduced the 90% chance of exploding the Gausscats all of a sudden started hiding on the hill instead of running around and shooting you point blank. Why? because the system was finished.

If PGI just finished their **** before throwing it into the mix-up this game would run alot smoother

[Cyrionthewise]

I am not sure why so many people voted no. Ecm is working the way is it meant to. Not all Mechs can equip it. That is the way it is. I run all the ecm Mechs.

[stjobe]

StalaggtIKE, on 14 December 2012 - 06:59 PM, said:

Woah, woah, woah, buddy. You are looking way too far into this. This thread has nothing to do with someone liking or disliking ECM. It is simply asking if you agree with Paul, whom clearly states that he feels there is nothing wrong with ECM. No where does he states that it should be tweaked or there are plans to tweak it. Despite all of the ECM feedback and suggestions, he clearly feels that it is perfect in its current form. So, why create another thread with more suggestions? This is an extreme poll to accompany an extreme view point shared by the lead designer.

The poll is simple; is ECM perfect the way it is? I hope that PGI will see that most do not feel that ECM is not perfect and realize they should be more flexible.

You and your poll are both highly biased. You don't seem to read at all, or you just ignore what Paul is saying, and your poll puts words in Paul's mouth he never said. He even said there "likely [..] will be a couple more [counter-ECM items] involving modules and weapon effects."

So I won't use the poll, but I will state that I do agree with Paul; ECM is working well. It will be interesting to see what other counter-ECM items they come up with in the future.

Edited by stjobe, 15 December 2012 - 04:33 AM.

[CoreHunter]

what counter ecm items are in battletech?

[StalaggtIKE]

stjobe, on 15 December 2012 - 04:33 AM, said:

He even said there "likely [..] will be a couple more [counter-ECM items] involving modules and weapon effects."

Key word likely. Likely, perhaps, maybe, hopefully, do not hold much weight. Perhaps in time a new OP tech will come around to trounce ECM...., yay. That's great you take comfort in shallow statement. Your naivety will keep you happier throughout life.

Quote

ECM is working well.

LOL. I can agree with this. ECM is working really, really well. I've decided to adapt and been having a lot of success with my RVN-3L. Or maybe I just all of sudden l2p. Streaking everyone else while having immunity to streaks is so strategic. Cheers!

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 15 December 2012 - 06:29 AM.

[Mordin Ashe]

So I am trolled by Paul Inouye. I feel special now!
Seriously, ECM did break so many things it makes me cry. Perfect? Not. Makes players play smarter? How, Paul, how? You don't get it, it only makes them take more ECMs.
Also, statement that TAG is counter to ECM is, with all respect, ********. TAG doesn't work in practise, you must point at the enemy and with lag shield protecting ECM mechs, it is useless. It is situational partial counter to ECM, not a counter. I am sorry Paul doesn't see the difference.

[Peiper]

This quote from Paul is very discouraging. This is how I translate it:

"The effect [of ECM] is working as intended and forces players to play a lot smarter," he said. "Specialized Mechs still have their place on the battlefield but they are going to need the assistance of their teammates to succeed. If you plan on taking specialized Mech into a match, plan wisely and have alternate weapon systems that will help you with mid to long-range combat. People are thinking we need to severely 'nerf' the ECM. This is not the case at all. There is already 1 counter-ECM item in the game (TAG), and likely there will be a couple more involving modules and weapon effects." -Paul Inouye

"ECM works exactly the way we intended it to work, and forces players to play the way we think they should be playing. Specialized mechs are crippled if they don't have ECM equipped partners following them around so they can attempt to do their job.(1) If you plan on taking a specialized mech into a match, you should load it out with medium to long range weaponry. (2) People are thinking we need to severely 'nerf' the ECM. (3) Screw them. They should drop a valuable laser slot and take TAG. (4) Either that, or shut up and wait for modules and PPC-emp effects. (5)"

1. So, you need at least 4 ECM SPECIALIZED mechs in your force in order for the rest to function as intended. If they have more ECM than you, it may not matter, though, because ECM stacks.

2. WHAT?? Apparently specialized mechs don't carry long range weapons. Because Gauss/PPC platforms, LRM/indirect fire support, and mid-ranged skirmishers (laserboats/AC boats) are not specialized mechs. ALL mechs are specialized! That's part of the fun of the game - to go to your mechlab and specialize a mech so you can have fun playing the kind of mech you enjoy! Currently, ECM is forcing players to "specialize" in certain mechs, because others are frakkin' useless.

3. Really??? Has he read the posts at all? We've suggested dozens of possible fixes to ECM that aren't 'severe' nerfs. They (devs) had tunnel visions when they created/implimented ECM, and apparently, they still do. Christ, they could AT LEAST make it so ECM doesn't stack. Is that a severe nerf???

4. Even when they increase the range of TAG, puggers are screwed. How do they know, if they take an LRM boat, that a TAGger will be there on their team to support them before they drop? Also, TAGgers better have ECM! And yes, LRM boats will be able to take their own TAG, unless they don't have energy hardpoints. Either way, targets just need to use the terrain to hide against LRM's. Tactics existed previous to ECM implimentation that minimized indirect fire risk. Now....

5. So.... does this mean they're going to 'fix' ECM by creating new gear/effects? Are they working on bandaids without actually solving the problems? (see: streaks, impossible-to-hit-boxes, BAP, NARC, WTF???)

I really don't like naming people in threads, but will someone find Paul and have him read the suggestion threads? What he said in the PC gamer interview is really INSULTING to us. He's disregarded the MAJORITY of the community, and ESPECIALLY those who have offered measured, logical solutions to make ECM balanced. And if it isn't that all powerful, than let ALL mechs have it, as any mech could in tabletop.

This thread offers ONE version of a solution, and many people have added other great alternative solutions where they disagree. However, if you look at the numbers, and it's got a lot of voters, the MAJORITY agree with the suggestion OR suggest a different change. The suggestion (as is) also has 50% vote for yes, and 50% saying something else, which is Piranha's stated benchmark for what they call balanced. If I recall, they said if 50% think it's OP, and 50% do not, then it's balanced. THIS pole shows that the majority of people think ECM needs to be changed, and suggests a fix that fits exactly within their benchmark for what is balanced. And you know what? The suggestion doesn't 'severely nerf' ECM. It BALANCES it.

http://mwomercs.com/...les-considered/

And you know what?? I don't know that I totally agree with my own post anymore. HOWEVER, it appears that there is enough support for the idea that it should be at least CONSIDERED. And don't tell us how you appreciated your passionate and dedicated Beta testers. LISTEN to us, and don't discount our ideas. There are GREAT ideas in this thread, and most are seemingly very simple fixes. COME ON!!!!

[CoreHunter]

how long does it take to get a lock on a TAGed mech in an ECM area and how long will the missiles be in flight? is the target still TAGed? no. ok usless counter.

[Khobai]

I just want to see two changes to ECM

1) nerf its stealth from 200m to 500m. its not supposed to be a super stealth system.
2) change ecm so instead of preventing streaks from firing it just turns them into dumbfire srm2s.

[VampireMoose]

Cyrionthewise, on 15 December 2012 - 04:30 AM, said:

I am not sure why so many people voted no. Ecm is working the way is it meant to. Not all Mechs can equip it. That is the way it is. I run all the ecm Mechs.

Thats nice for you, some of us had spent our time grinding before this buying mechs that can't and as such are now penalised.
Yeah thats fair.

I now have a pure missle mech cat that I can't actually use pugging due to ECM.

I won't change to another weight class as that is a waste of the past month unlocking the upgrades.

It is rediculous to have a "You need this mech to be on a even playing field"
I have to relie on people in a pug to have ECM so its fair..?

Thats just insane...

[ICEFANG13]

A lot of pro-ECM say that. ECM is great, and its working just right. I love it on all my ECM mechs and I'm great with them.

[Chrithu]

No it isn't perfect. The stacking effects needs to go, then it is. Enforcing an arms race of what team has more ECM equipped mechs just doesn't look smart. One ECM in counter mode should be enough to make the ECM shield of the group of three Streak + ECM Commandos go away and allow your LRMs to support you.

Together with increased TAG range, PPC EMP Effects and whatever the modules can do, this should bring the ECM to bing good.