105 replies to this topic

[Biruke]

the 7.5 mln C-Bill compensation for over 25 matches players is good. I will finally buy a couple of other atlases to get the elite features for the useful D-DC.

[Thirdstar]

Disclaimer: I voted to bring back R&R (with tweaks) in the poll on the main page.

R&R should have functioned as a money sink. What it did function as was a fun sink. And the issue was never the R&R itself but the strange and often arbitrary values attached to it. Without the welfare rearm and repair, certain configs would pauper players even if they played well. Heck without welfare R&R most people would be in the red already.

The primary positive effect for the removal of R&R is that players can now play whatever config they want. However, this is does introduce a lot of potential negative effects outlined previously in this thread. We'll just have to wait and see what the total effect is.

[Wired]

Thirdstar, on 17 December 2012 - 10:53 PM, said:

Disclaimer: I voted to bring back R&R (with tweaks) in the poll on the main page.

R&R should have functioned as a money sink. What it did function as was a fun sink. And the issue was never the R&R itself but the strange and often arbitrary values attached to it. Without the welfare rearm and repair, certain configs would pauper players even if they played well. Heck without welfare R&R most people would be in the red already.

The primary positive effect for the removal of R&R is that players can now play whatever config they want. However, this is does introduce a lot of potential negative effects outlined previously in this thread. We'll just have to wait and see what the total effect is.

I could never get my repair bills high enough to cancel out any winnings. My cataphract 4x was only what...40,000 on the rearm?

[Adeptus Odren]

Wired, on 17 December 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

I could never get my repair bills high enough to cancel out any winnings. My cataphract 4x was only what...40,000 on the rearm?

Let's put it this way.This is just the developers living up to their word.

If I remember correctly, PGI/IGP did state months ago during closed beta that they did not want the economy to keep players from playing their favorite mechs. It's the main reason why I bought the legendary pack, and 2 elite packs for my younger brothers as presents.

I did not want another World of Tanks game where the only tank I wanted to drive was my T95 and T30 but could not afford to drive them continuously without losing money. Without that promise, I probably would not have splurged so much on this game.

I'm happy as six year old on Christmas day, now that R&R is going away. Even if it's just temporary.

Edited by Adeptus Odren, 17 December 2012 - 11:06 PM.

[JudgeDeathCZ]

XL engines on enemy mechs...Me like it .

[Wired]

Adeptus Odren, on 17 December 2012 - 11:05 PM, said:

Let's put it this way.This is just the developers living up to their word.

If I remember correctly, PGI/IGP did state months ago during closed beta that they did not want the economy to keep players from playing their favorite mechs. It's the main reason why I bought the legendary pack, and 2 elite packs for my younger brothers as presents.

I did not want another World of Tanks game where the only tank I wanted to drive was my T95 and T30 but could not afford to drive them continuously without losing money. Without that promise, I probably would not have splurged so much on this game.

I'm happy as six year old on Christmas day, now that R&R is going away. Even if it's just temporary.

Nothing is stopping you from playing your favorite mech now. Nothing ever was.

[Adeptus Odren]

Wired, on 17 December 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

Nothing is stopping you from playing your favorite mech now. Nothing ever was.

C-bills were the reason why I couldn't pilot my pimped out Atlases as often as I wanted to. I don't have all day to play. So when I do have time to play, I want to pilot all three of my Atlases as much as possible.

Edited by Adeptus Odren, 17 December 2012 - 11:19 PM.

[Rifter]

Wired, on 17 December 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

Nothing is stopping you from playing your favorite mech now. Nothing ever was.

Cbills, Run a LRM or SRM boat with artemis and you could easaly be facing 120k+ in ammo alone plus mech repair costs. I've seen 200k+ repair bills for my AWS-8R before, thats why i never took it out all the time but saved it for special occasions.

So i guess i shoud be happy i can pilot it all the time now.

[DirePhoenix]

JohnnyC, on 17 December 2012 - 10:47 PM, said:

Is it that way for you? When you get your favorite mech and outfit it how you like, do you stop playing?

Some people play MMOs for collections, getting all of the shinies. Some people play MMOs for achievements and bragging rights. Some people play MMOs to explore their virtual world. Some people play MMOs for progression and advancing their character. There are many types of things that motivate players in multiplayer games. I am usually an "explorer", but there's not much exploration in this game, so in MWO I suppose my main motivation is progression.

I am currently NOT playing my CPLT-C1 that I want to play in because I've already reached 8/8 in the Basic Efficiencies and instead piloting other CPLTs in order to be able to improve my skill progression in my CPLT-C1 that I want to play in. That is when I am playing, which isn't as often as I used to play because it isn't very motivating to have to pilot other 'mechs you don't like as much in order to progress the one you do want.

But what will happen when I eventually cap out my progression? I'm hoping that either there will be some other system that I will be able to progress through, either more skills or maybe some sort of Community Warfare system (which is seeming less and less likely), or maybe another 'Mech that I really want (MAD-3R). And if there's not, I don't see myself playing much longer if at all.

For collectors, it will probably be the same. When they get all the 'mechs and weapons they want, unless they keep pumping out 'mechs or other things to collect at a rapid rate, they will probably stop playing when there's nothing new to collect.

Socializers will be highly motivated by community play, either through guilds/merc corps, or faction play offered with Community Warfare. Unfortunately as we've pointed out, removing RnR removes the economy, with no economy there is not much point for Community Warfare, and with no CW, you can probably count the socializers out.

Achievements are on the table to be implemented but quite a ways off past when the game is supposed to be ready for "official launch" (probably March, which isn't that far off), will there be enough achievers left by then to be able to appreciate them? Possibly, as the leaderboards and after action reports offer some sort of achievement, albeit fleeting.

So then that leaves this game to the "Killers", which this game is naturally leaned toward anyway as a PvP-focused game, but without the other types of players you're going to be left with the same crowd that only plays Unreal Tournament and Quake, people that simply play games to beat other players. And those games are great for what they do, but they lack any sort of depth.

As a long-time Battletech fan, I especially don't want to see a MechWarrior game that suffers from a lack of depth, especially when it has the potential to be so much more. I want something for every type of player here. Something that will keep people interested in continuously playing. I don't want an "end game" because I don't want the game to end. I want a universe to be immersed in, with a reason to be here and things I want to do no matter what is motivating me at a particular time.

[Vassago Rain]

I predict we'll see more 8 manz, since it won't be an instant loss to bring an expensive mech to them, and a lot of new players in centurions and awesomes.

[Thirdstar]

Wired, on 17 December 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

Nothing is stopping you from playing your favorite mech now. Nothing ever was.

Let me distill the argument down to a central paradigm that all games should attempt to follow.

If a game forces me to do something un-fun to reach a point where I can do fun things, the game is doing it wrong.

[Vassago Rain]

I saw today an 8 man that had at least 6 mechs in XL engines. The only people who weren't obvious users were a cent and a dragon.

It's a great tool for what it is, which is opening up a lot of funky builds, but when you start relying on this one tool to win, you'll end up beaten very, very often - especially if you don't conceal that you have it.

[peve]

Wired, on 17 December 2012 - 07:37 PM, said:

Just make sure you get an assist on each enemy mech before you go.

Indeed. I predict there will be farmers, who ride a light mech and shoot once at every enemy. This is quite doable with lagshield + ecm. Only after that will they start to play the game.

[Teralitha]

Ritter Cuda, on 17 December 2012 - 07:23 PM, said:

This is not about what’s good or bad just what I bet the changes to the game will be. Your welcome to ad your own.

• Complaints on the forum from new players going past their 25^th game “where my c-bills?
  
• More expensive builds endo, ff, xl engines DH
  
• Aggressive or reckless game play IE player not caring if they blow their mech just running into the fight no thought of team play or tactics
  
• Last but not least the forum exploding with post “ you broke the game… stomp stomp”

1. Why would they do that...
2.More expensive builds mean higher salvage rewards from winning
3.Dont they do that now? Only premade teams use tactics dont ya know.... regular pugs never use tactics.
4.I can maybe see posts complaining about conquest mode being crap.... or the usual CTD, netcode etc complaints per usual.

I cant see anyone complaining about the economy though... all those changes are good for the game. Anyone who does is a complete *****.

[Pygar]

Ritter Cuda, on 17 December 2012 - 07:23 PM, said:

This is not about what’s good or bad just what I bet the changes to the game will be. Your welcome to ad your own.

• Complaints on the forum from new players going past their 25^th game “where my c-bills?
  
• More expensive builds endo, ff, xl engines DH
  
• Aggressive or reckless game play IE player not caring if they blow their mech just running into the fight no thought of team play or tactics
  
• Last but not least the forum exploding with post “ you broke the game… stomp stomp”

1. Yes, probably.
2. Yes, but in addition to expensive fittings, it will lead to bigger mechs in matches in general. They just need something down the road that limits Atlas spam and it'l be ok.
3. Yes and No... it will encourage some players to rush in like a hero, and then people on teams will get free kills off of them, so it'l balance out.
4. Yes, of course. People need to just bear in mind that it's a work in progress- they need to be able to tell their side of the story too, but it's early and the content is shallow. (shallow to the point where almost anything they throw in the game is an instant balance issue, because there's only so much else to choose from so far)
--------------
5. Conquest mode is going to be fun, and many people are going to play the heck out of it just for the sake of not having to play assault mode over the next couple days. Somewhere after the first 24 hours will be the point at which complaints surface on the forums about it being too similar to assault mode, or that it's dominated by faster mechs, or something.
6. Lots of Stalkers on the battlefields, first because they are new, and second because they are a good mech. They probably won't replace the Atlas, but Awesomes will become more scarce. (Even despite the PPC buff, the Stalker can probably fit PPCs on some if not all of its variants)
7. Moar paintjobs- Which is sweet, I had a couple I couldn't paint and now I'l be able to- when playing TT games painting the minis was always half the fun of the game for me.

[DogmeatX]

So much doom and gloom and not even tried it yet. At least see how it goes first.

Odd thing which stood out to me about assists netting more than kills -> does the killing blow person also get the assist for that victim? If not then it would be more profitable just to run around and damage mechs, not actually land the killing blow...

[nemesis271989]

With new economic system it will lead to heavy hacking, I'm not happy with afkers but new changes just making me think that
This is a beginning of hax....

NO RNR ? WHAT? facepalm guys,(developers) you are following HAWKeN same as hawken wants to add some features that MWO has.

[Sifright]

DirePhoenix, on 17 December 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

Because if all you want is your one 'mech and you get it, as well as all the weapons you want for it, what then? Why would you keep playing? It no longer takes anything to upkeep it, there is no reason to keep improving*. You'll never lose it, never need to upgrade it, and no need to even maintain it. Mission Accomplished! Your game is done. You stop playing. And if you're not playing, you're certainly not paying. And if people aren't paying this game stops existing.
*snip*

So you think no one plays this game because it's fun.

No one plays this game for the sense of accomplishment when they beat the enemies?

Basically you find the game play so hollow the only thing you enjoy is getting a mindless bump in c-bills after every mission.

Well i'm sorry you aren't enjoying the game..


The door is that way -->

[Ryolacap]

The problem with R&R as of now, is players have discoved doing less reaps the most reward. When they design the mechanics better, to reward active players and the sacrifices they make, then I am sure R&R will return

Edited by Ryolacap, 18 December 2012 - 01:33 AM.

[Galenit]

They want to make their money with mc-sell and premium.
Premium: cbills bonus is irrelevant after patch, XP left
Hero-Mechs: cbills bonus irrelevant after patch, hardpoints left

Whats left untouched:
XP-conversation
Colours and Camos
Mechbays

The only thing people need are mechbays.

Cbills needed for r&r are removed. Tried artemis on my xl-catapult, it was expensive, without it i make good money, (the xl dont costs so much then ff, both together is to much), with it it was even. Ill go back to artemis after patch.
Build ff in my first mech, didnt know about the forum, then read about it, removed it and make good money with it to buy the other to 2 ravens and 3 catapults. My raven got ecm with last patch, with next patch it will get ff again for the 0,7tons to spare on a fridge with lots of energydrinks in it and a greater ashtray. Maybe some fancy neontubes under its back or goldenlegs or other pimpstuff.

Hope they will bring r&r back in future.
Its for balancing builds, fun and diversity and it will make them money.

Edited by Galenit, 18 December 2012 - 01:50 AM.