169 replies to this topic

[Kobold]

KuruptU4Fun, on 24 December 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

Wait, odds are the people who are still capping never read the patch notes to see that isn't worth their while now to cap. What makes you think they're going to stumble in here and see your thread?

What makes you think that the people who play the game to win give a crap how many cbills they get, or how much XP they get?

You and I are playing two different games, friend. I'm playing MechWarrior, you're playing "C-bill Accumulator: Online".

[Farix]

Darwins Dog, on 24 December 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

I stand corrected there. An individual can get more XP for capturing the base. More total experience, however, is given out for fighting.

Not unless you are the team's ACE—at which point, you are robbing your fellow teammates of XP.

[KuruptU4Fun]

Kobold, on 24 December 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

What makes you think that the people who play the game to win give a crap how many cbills they get, or how much XP they get?

You and I are playing two different games, friend. I'm playing MechWarrior, you're playing "C-bill Accumulator: Online".

I, (like you) play with a team, we are aware of the changes and have changed our tactics accordingly. We field balanced teams that are good at adapting to situations and therefore increasing our chances to win. The people who didn't read patch notes or don't step foot in to these forums are the ones most likely to believe that capping is equivalent to a maximum c-bill win.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Kobold, on 24 December 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

What makes you think that the people who play the game to win give a crap how many cbills they get, or how much XP they get?

You and I are playing two different games, friend. I'm playing MechWarrior, you're playing "C-bill Accumulator: Online".

Rushing to Cap a base and end the match in two minutes isn't mechwarrior. It's TeamFortress in mechs, but sadly, Teamfortress Classic is a better game. It knew what it was trying to do and did it well. That game had better engaging action than MWO will ever achieve if they don't put on their big boy pants.

If your enjoyment is standing in a glowing square, ending the match where the highest damage done was 30-50, do us a favour, play something else, because that isn't a SIM and it isn't MechWarrior. It isn't Battletech and isn't a good game to play.

Rush caps waste EVERYONES time. The load time, the effort in getting teams together, everything.

We've already been told that stats can be hacked, so when you display your lovely numbers, they mean nothing. Those wins and kill mean nothing.

It's incredibly sad that people have to BEG to actually fight the other team.

Conquest mode has done a good job in REPLACING Assault as a mode where you are forced to engage.

Assault is a joke.

Devs, strip capping of all rewards and never let people gain XP/C-Bills by doing it.

A scouts role isn't to abandon his team to go stand in a glowing square.

Edited by PANZERBUNNY, 24 December 2012 - 11:57 AM.

[LauLiao]

"The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting"

Sun Tzu

[PANZERBUNNY]

LauLiao, on 24 December 2012 - 12:03 PM, said:

"The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting"

Sun Tzu

You obviously aren't familiar with Battletech. That knowledge seems to have been lost in the lore.

Mechjocks aren't exactly philosophers.

Edited by PANZERBUNNY, 24 December 2012 - 12:08 PM.

[JimSuperBleeder]

If you win by capping, then the other team failed to stop it. If someone starts capping my base I'll go back and take care of the problem.

[Qrion]

For me, rush caps just happen, usually in River City. I'll run over to the upper city... no one there. Cruise down to the docks... no one there. Guess I'll park on the base then. If there was just a single commando willing to stop and run back, it would be no more cap.

Absolutely, it's not as fun, but I'll take the win.

[Farix]

Qrion, on 24 December 2012 - 12:12 PM, said:

For me, rush caps just happen, usually in River City. I'll run over to the upper city... no one there. Cruise down to the docks... no one there. Guess I'll park on the base then. If there was just a single commando willing to stop and run back, it would be no more cap.

Absolutely, it's not as fun, but I'll take the win.

From my experience, this is the main reason behind most of the "quick" captures. The two teams take entirely different paths and completely miss each other. By the time either teams realizes what has happened, there is no reason to turn around and head back.

Edited by Farix, 24 December 2012 - 12:29 PM.

[Bloody10th]

"I play games about killing one another because I don't like to fight, keekee."

I think anyone who prioritizes capping first in Assault at this point is nothing more than a troll. It's pretty much obvious. All of their responses are pretty much troll replies. Edit: These are not "I looked for the enemy on the way to his base and couldn't find him, so I capped." These are people taking fast mechs with the full intention of taking the discrete routes to caps and capping at such a speed that you have no chance to defend unless your lights trickle back 1 by 1 to die.

I'm the #1 guy obsessed with winning at all costs, but not in an incomplete game where the wins DO NOT MATTER AT ALL. Frankly, I want to build up enough money and xp to unlock/buy stuff as soon as it drops.

"C-Bill Accumulator: Online" would be a valid argument--except for the fact that making money and xp has 100x the tangible benefits of speed capping. Any tool can easily make 100k+ in a match that they actively participate in, and no matter how fast you speed cap you aren't going to get 4+ matches in by the time one brawl is over. The devs have even stated that at this point capping is only a method for breaking stalemates and other undesirable scenarios. They even set up the reward system for Assault to deviate the game away from capfests. If there were still R&R--even with the current reward system--I'd still say that capping is a legit way to be playing, just to avoid repair costs. But it literally doesn't have a leg to stand on. Edit: You can QQ that it's the objective of the game mode--but last I looked there's an extra objective added to the list--*OR* destroy all enemy mechs.

"Defend your base"--How about you sit back and turtle instead of telling me to? That's the most lopsided and ignorant response possible. Like I said--trolls gonna troll. Defending would be a valid argument *IF THERE WAS A PURPOSE FOR CAPPING TO BEGIN WITH*. FFS. I think you cappers need to go play some "Coward: Not a Warrior: Online". Sounds to me like it's your type of playstyle.

Edited by Bloody10th, 24 December 2012 - 12:41 PM.

[Corvus Antaka]

Unfortunately capping is often still the best tactical option for a win. too bad PGI made cap income so low we did some base rushes for 25,000 cbills, perhaps 50K baseline would be better - the issue is often the team will get killed off but a cap can still get you a win. the new system here is not feeling correctly balanced.

[M4NTiC0R3X]

Here's the deal: On each map theres three ways for the enemy to get to your base. You should be defending//assaulting atleast two out of the three key points on the map between both lances. If everybody strays far off or all together in one direction you're asking for it. I hate it when everybody runs off in one direction because generally I have no choice to but to follow the group, 'cos if you go off on your own well, you might get dogpiled. Personally I like to flag an enemy base because that means either scouts are coming for me (I can usually handle that) or they all turn their slow tushies around while my team spanks them red (point being the enemy team splits up, becomes occupied). It's a double edge 'cos you've seperated yourself from your team, it can be risky if you meet the wrong 'mechs. When your base lights up really fast, glee with joy, you're going to kill a light 'mech or two. If you meet the entire enemy team, you're (team is) probably doing it wrong (by allowing it to happen in the first place. Should be setup to keep watch and orders from that point). I don't capture the base all the way, I like C-Bills ya kno? But if it came down to it I'd gladly win by capture of base/resource than accept a loss/death [just depends on what both teams do]. Not having bases on Assault is not assault it's deathmatch (which can be added, easily!) as can King of the Hill, one base in the middle.. there's even room for a defend the repair bay (spawnpoint w/ _# of lives) or multiple 'mech drop matches.

After all that said, all that really needed to be said was, "It's a tactic, deal with it."

edit: I mean really most that stuff takes people half a second to process.

Edited by M4NTiC0R3X, 24 December 2012 - 12:44 PM.

[Monky]

I think if they get rid of the increasing bonus to cap speed for piling more than 1 mech on the point it will effectively fix this.

Capping needs to be in to force teams to think tactically rather than just bum rush the main line, since not all mechs are intended for a head on assault. It is essentially a hard counter to pure blob fighting.

previously you would have teams just bum rush the cap in a blob to get the cap victory bonus, so that part should stay out, and you can prevent it from happening too quickly if the cap speed is static.

[Deathsiege]

I'll stop capping when the other team stops hiding in caves. This isn't frackin' hide-and-go-seek.

[De La Fresniere]

Joseph Mallan, on 24 December 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

Cause teh primary objective of assault is Capture the base. says so every time an assault mission come up. Seriously why don't folks just understand that some of the players want to perform the mission.

Actually the game lists the two possible ways to win the match. If you absolutely want to win you have to pick one, but they're still just options. One happens to be exceedingly boring and basically just stops the fun prematurely.

Additionally, that's if you prioritize winning over having fun; most players probably get a lot more fun (and reward, too) out of a fight loss than out of a cap win, so really, it's the least desirable option.

...aside from a cap loss, which is just sad and can still very well happen if you try to cap win.

If you choose to fight, you can have good fun and win, or you can have moderate fun and lose.
If you choose to rush cap, you can not have fun and win, or you can not have fun and *still* lose.

I can't believe there still isn't a TDM option... then this nonsense would finally end.

[Deathisgod]

I agree with OP.

Us 'team death match' guys dont have a team death match as you may have noticed.
You capture the flag guys have 2 game modes.

So...

If you want to play capture the flag, play conquest.

Leave us team death match guys assult mode until we get a real team death match.

[Farix]

Deathisgod, on 24 December 2012 - 01:01 PM, said:

If you want to play capture the flag, play conquest.

Conquest isn't capture the flag. It is an entirely different game.

Deathisgod, on 24 December 2012 - 01:01 PM, said:

Leave us team death match guys assult mode until we get a real team death match.

Nope. Assault is capture the flag and no amount of whining that it is capture the flag will change that. Besides players like you have turned Conquest into TDM already. You are far more likely to see a base cap in Assault than you would a resource victory in Conquest.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Assault should have ONE base in the middle or equal distance of both teams.

If they want to mix it up, they could even have 2 spawn points a little away from each other so your team needs to form up and move to Assault the target which happens to be the same target your opponent is advancing on.

All this "missing" the other team and forcing a cap rush is terrible and I'm surprised, somewhat, it has been allowed to exist this long.

End conversation.

[Ryebear]

The thing is, incentivization is the core to video games. You have to create incentives to keep playing. In MWO that is earning C-Bills/XP and winning a test of skill. But winning via unnecessary base cap isn't really winning as a test of skill, which can arguable be said as not winning at all, and there is very little on the way of C-Bills/XP.

Capping instead of fighting only pads your Win/Loss ratio, but taking the skill out of it. I can play a game of skill against a child and win every single time, but I don't feel better about it and don't have any other incentives to keep doing it and base capping is pretty much the same thing.

[PANZERBUNNY]

..except it's the kids capping like that or those of equivalent intellect.